Solution to boring PvE.

[ohhaithere]

As we all know, PvE in DST gets boring after a little while because mobs are weak and can be kited easily. People go and play PvP because PvE has little to offer once you know how to kill mobs, and this takes about 5 minutes of playing the game. There's even a thread in the front page showing how ridiculously easy it is to dance around the mobs and hit them during their recovery frames.



That's how a fight against some beefalo looks like.

What's the solution to this? Guns. Give Beefalo some MP5s and every other mob some guns and we are set. Lots of challenging PvE awaits us.

You can thank me later.

[Asparagus]

Hmm... shouldn't their horns serve as the guns?

And then you can only attack them when they reload.

 

For Pigs, they should throw grenades... But how about the Bearger?

 

Another one of these huh? O__O

[Michi01]

But how about the Bearger?

Bearger should throw hydrogen bombs.

[SuperPsiPower]

Guns. Give Beefalo some MP5s and every other mob some guns and we are set. Lots of challenging PvE awaits us.

Um, how about no? =) 

[BeastNips]

On the mobs: They definitely should be more challenging to kite, since kiting takes all the fun out of killing mobs in Don't Starve. 

 

On the environment: The environmental challenge seems to be a lot easier in DST. I might be imagining this, but I'm playing a DST world and a DS world side by side at the moment, and I find in DST that the rain is a lot lighter, my thermal stones (while not being permanent) stays hot and cold way longer, fires take much longer to catch (I'm aware this was unavoidable for technical reasons). On top of this - and I'm aware this was pretty much unavoidable too - the world regeneration makes things a walk in the park. Maybe we need a better environmental challenge? 

 

On the challenge: Help the newbs! That is the hard part of Don't Starve Together; surviving while carrying and teaching new players. It gets much harder when your base burns down right in the middle of winter because someone needed charcoal and underestimated the spreading of fires, or those precious gears you were saving for Flingomatics have been eaten by a WX, and even better: "I put my spider nest down in the camp so all my spider friends are close" Nice job Webber, nice job. 

 

Edit: Please, no one take this the wrong way, I love teaching new players, but it is funny at times  

[ohhaithere]

On the mobs: They definitely should be more challenging to kite, 

 

On the environment:  Maybe we need a better environmental challenge? 

 

On the challenge: That is the hard part of Don't Starve Together; surviving while carrying and teaching new players. 

 

Or maybe the mobs should get assault rifles.

[BeastNips]

Or maybe the mobs should get assault rifles.

 

It has to keep up with the style though; maybe Puckle Guns? 

[DarkXero]

We only have to disable movement prediction on the beefalo and they are set for combat.

[Carnage]

I'm waiting for some partypoopers to take this seriously like they did in the RPG thread.

[Pyromailmann]

[PandaWaffles]

On a server with 4 or more players, I think Buzzards should be able to fly down and just abduct a random player every few days, insta-killing them. Good luck kiting that!

[Mudley]

 

 

I don't even care what this thread will devolve into, this gif already made it worth it.

[ohhaithere]

On a server with 4 or more players, I think Buzzards should be able to fly down and just abduct a random player every few days, insta-killing them. Good luck kiting that!

 

But what would we do with the ghosts of the abducted players? Would they appear again on the map? We don't want things to get unrealistic and unbalanced.

[XirmiX]

You're not serious, are you? What would make things more challenging is if mobs' attacks are more randomized with more varirty and with smaller attack periods. Ginormous amount of health doesn't cut it (as seen from the Dragonfly) and honestly, I found Spider queen harder to fight than Dragonfly and reasons are the following:

* Spider queen spawns spider minions right where she is and doesn't need to go to any special place to spawn them, where as Dragonfly has to go to pools to spawn Lavae.

* Spider queen has a shorter attack period.

* Players, when fighting Spider queen are less prepped or even under-prepared and lose a bunch of health, needing to retreat every so often, where as for Dragonfly people are usually over prepared and the battle ends up as an easy victory. You wouldn't see someone using some sort of high tech craftables to defeat her, not to mention that she can be anywhere, where as Dragonfly can only move away so far from her base.

* Spider queen is half the time a "must-kill" whilst Dragonfly is always optional.

[XirmiX]

On a server with 4 or more players, I think Buzzards should be able to fly down and just abduct a random player every few days, insta-killing them. Good luck kiting that!

That would be a bit too OP and kind of stupid, but insta kills, ei? Now that's a one of an idea...! Though if that is implemented, then it would have to be due to player's own mistakes and not some random game logic phenomena occurring.

[ohhaithere]

You're not serious, are you?

 

No, of course I'm not serious when I say it takes 5 minutes to learn how to kite every mob. It takes a bit more.

 

As for the rest, guns, guns, guns. Guns solve everything you said.

[XirmiX]

No, of course I'm not serious when I say it takes 5 minutes to learn how to kite every mob. It takes a bit more.

As for the rest, guns, guns, guns. Guns solve everything you said.

I never said that... Oh, wow, you're that guy from Tanki Online! Where else are you gonna stalk me, on goofans?

[ohhaithere]

Oh, wow, you're that guy from Tanki Online!

 

I don't even know what that is, but since it sounds like Tanks Online, I'm gonna asume it has Leopards 2A5, and T-90s, and some other manly ****, and say HELL YEAH I'M THAT GUY.

[XirmiX]

I don't even know what that is, but since it sounds like Tanks Online, I'm gonna asume it has Leopards 2A5, and T-90s, and some other manly ****, and say HELL YEAH I'M THAT GUY.

Sorry, might have overreacted, but I really thought you were that one guy; your nick is basically like his in that game.

[BeastNips]

You're not serious, are you? What would make things more challenging is if mobs' attacks are more randomized with more varirty and with smaller attack periods. Ginormous amount of health doesn't cut it (as seen from the Dragonfly) and honestly, I found Spider queen harder to fight than Dragonfly and reasons are the following:

* Spider queen spawns spider minions right where she is and doesn't need to go to any special place to spawn them, where as Dragonfly has to go to pools to spawn Lavae.

* Spider queen has a shorter attack period.

* Players, when fighting Spider queen are less prepped or even under-prepared and lose a bunch of health, needing to retreat every so often, where as for Dragonfly people are usually over prepared and the battle ends up as an easy victory. You wouldn't see someone using some sort of high tech craftables to defeat her, not to mention that she can be anywhere, where as Dragonfly can only move away so far from her base.

* Spider queen is half the time a "must-kill" whilst Dragonfly is always optional.

 

Yes, this. Randomised attack would be good. Very good. Kiting has the same feel as cheating to me; not in the sense that it is something naughty, but in the way that it takes the fun out of stuff. There are plenty of additional attacks maybe a modder could add for stuff:

 

• Beefalo: Could have a roar that temporarily staggers you.
• Spider Warriors: Could web you to a spot for a second or so (they have their jump but it doesn't work close range, so doesn't help them with kiting).
• Rooks: The final stage of their charge could have an AoE which knocks your weapon out of your hand, as well as their stomp having a shorter range AoE stagger. 
• Tentacles: Should give a slowing effect when you strike them meaning you can't escape their attack. 
• Hounds: I think hounds are pretty much fine. 
• Treeguards: Not sure about this one? I was thinking maybe rooting you in place but we've pretty much done that to death. Maybe because of their size, they could have a longer reach with their attack? 

[XirmiX]

 

Yes, this. Randomised attack would be good. Very good. Kiting has the same feel as cheating to me; not in the sense that it is something naughty, but in the way that it takes the fun out of stuff. There are plenty of additional attacks maybe a modder could add for stuff:

 

• Beefalo: Could have a roar that temporarily staggers you.
• Spider Warriors: Could web you to a spot for a second or so (they have their jump but it doesn't work close range, so doesn't help them with kiting).
• Rooks: The final stage of their charge could have an AoE which knocks your weapon out of your hand, as well as their stomp having a shorter range AoE stagger. 
• Tentacles: Should give a slowing effect when you strike them meaning you can't escape their attack. 
• Hounds: I think hounds are pretty much fine. 
• Treeguards: Not sure about this one? I was thinking maybe rooting you in place but we've pretty much done that to death. Maybe because of their size, they could have a longer reach with their attack? 

 

So far, liking the Rook's idea! Beefalo, not so sure... Spider Warriors, hmm, may be, or perhaps that for Dangling Depth Dwellers once caves are in? Not sure what you're implying about the tentacles, but what I'm thinking is that they could perhaps do 1 - 3 attacks instead of 2 each time, making it more random. For hounds, I certainly agree, since their attack period is pretty small and only Wigfrid or someone with a weapon such as a Tentacle spike could tank a hound without getting hit; and that's only for 1 hound! Tree guards need a shorter attack period, may be they could strike twice as fast as usual?

[ImDaMisterL]

@ohhaithere might have a slight addiction to guns. 

[TemporaryMan]

Eh, I don't see what's so bad about kiting, especially if you consider the alternative.  Most fights in Don't Starve won't leave players barely clinging to life afterward if they know what they're doing, and that's fine.  Getting hit more in combat might make it more dangerous, but it just leads to longer boring stretches of gathering materials to make more armor and honey poultices.  It's also reduces the importance of skill, if all you're doing is spending more time obtaining better weapons and armor and then tanking (and there's often better alternatives to that).  At least kiting requires some reflexes and the ability to quickly judge which direction to run so you don't get cornered or flanked.

 

As for the tentacles, if they're impossible to dodge all that means is I'd have to get Chester to tank them for me, which is actually less risky than kiting, faster than kiting against a single tentacle, but slower against groups because I'd have to wait for Chester to heal between fights.  It doesn't really add anything since I already use Chester to tank tentacles sometimes, it just removes the riskier option of kiting.  And if their attack pattern is random 1-3 attacks instead of 2, I'll just always wait for 3 attacks, or wait for the tentacle to fully submerge again.  It's slower and lower risk; it's lower skill; it's what I used to do before I learned to hit, dodge two attacks and then hit again.  Or I could just make Chester tank them for me.

 

What it really comes down to is that kiting isn't a low-risk alternative to the anxious life-and-death scenarios we faced as newbs; it's the high-risk, high-reward alternative to more passive-aggressive ways of fighting things like switching to a log suit and beefalo hat at the first sign of hounds.  I know better than to enter fights without enough preparations to make my survival, by victory or escape, a foregone conclusion.  I kite because it's cheap and expedient, not because it's the safer than pig armies and blow darts.  Heck, I've taken to kiting frogs and spiders instead of making a dozen traps.  Gathering grass takes time.

[GuyNamedChris]

This idea is worse than giving an RPG to a Deerclops

[ohhaithere]

Beefalo: MP5

Spider Warrior: Desert Eagle

Rook: Grenade Launcher

Tentacle: M16

Hound: Grenades

Treeguard: Comes riding an Apache helicopter that can only be targeted with darts and boomerangs.

There, solved everything. And the Treeguard would be balanced since you can also pacify him and his chopper by planting pinecones. Spider Warriors get that small gun so the game doesn't become unrealistic.