So here we stand. Farming is dead, pigs go extinct, beefalo still don't respawn, and

[Trainer_Zero]

we can kill rabbits with impunity once again. It seems like the game is just moving in circles, with the player being punished for surviving.

Krampus was made to limit rabbit trapping. Krampus was then nerfed to a non-issue. Now there's a way to farm rabbits with no bad karma at all with the tooth traps. What was the point of Krampus to begin with?

Pigs were being abused for meat. Pig spawns were then lowered and house recipe requirements were raised. Now the pigs just plain die off, leaving only a 25% drop chance for one of the 4 items needed to renew them. Extinction will occur, and is inevitable, when pig abuse had already dropped due to the spawn changes. To make this a viable change, I suggest making it only apply to player made houses, and perhaps nerfing pig spawn a bit further.

Farming, the only "proper and nice" way of surviving has now been nerfed to pointlessness. It's pretty much impossible for new players to start up with the lowered seed rate. Not to mention that the lengthened growth times and reduced nutritive payoff make it not really worth it, considering rabbits can again be farmed with impunity, which is why farming was buffed and Krampus was introduced in the first place...

We're chasing our tails trying to find a proper solution here. I'm no gaming or coding savant, but here's a couple suggestions. Feel free to add your own.

1.) Pigs should only go extinct from player built houses.

-To compensate for this, lower pig respawn times from 3 days to 5. That way even with an absurd pig village the player won't be able to sustain himself on their meat alone.

-An increase in pig strength and village size, to present a higher threat to those farming bacon could also be welcome changes.

2.) Farms should have a bump up in speed, closer to what they were pre-Queen.

-However, perhaps introduce a spoilage or infestation mechanic. If you're not there in reasonable time to harvest within a given window, your crop simply dies and you lose it. There could be a percentage chance for dropping seeds, but of course there's the threat of birds picking them up.

-A slight drop in manure farm fertilization efficiency could also work. Say that each poop is worth 6 crops, meaning you'll need 5 poop for one plot.

-Perhaps Beefalo, Pigs, Birds, and Bunnies develop a taste for the easy life off your farms and could eat the crops as well.

In other words, you'll have to work a lot harder if you want to see reward from your turtling, but it's not impossible, nor is it all-reliable. The current nerfing just means people will be making a lot more farms and can live off them once started up. Sure, winter might change that, but winter is only one season.

3.) Lower Krampus's summoning requirements. (I haven't tested this patch out for him yet though). On the last patch I killed 3 full backpacks of bunnies in a row on the same day without even one coming for me. I also killed an entire pig village without his company. If you're going to include a deterrent in the game, it should be possible to summon the deterrent before I get a handy supply of food to last out his forgiveness period. This would keep the pig hunters in check, make people think twice before abusing tall-bird respawning, and give the people who jumped ship from the farming nerf back to rabbits something to think about. Which leads me to my next point.

4.) The tooth trap shouldn't be guilt free. I haven't tested it yet, but from how it was made to sound it seems like you don't get "naughty points" from using the tooth trap. Why wouldn't we? We're actively hunting and killing defenseless, clueless bunnies with tools of our own design. Yes, making them die instantly is a good thing, but we should still be considered naughty if the deterring effect of solely farming them is to work.

5.) Increase in spider hat durability? For people who stockpiled eggs beforehand, the hat isn't that big of a deal, but for people who earned their eggs fighting the monstrosities that are the new spiders and the queen, shouldn't they have more to show for it, at least a bit?

-Which also leads into a question and another point. I haven't seen it myself yet, but are spiders spreading on their own? If not, why are level 3 nests only dropping one egg? If we can use them to make hats to control the spiders and they aren't repopulating they could potentially go extinct. Again, I haven't checked for their re-population, so this could be a moot point.

6.) Fireflies shouldn't just die out in lanterns and hats unless they can respawn. Think about it: You've captured the firefly alive. Why does he die if he's given shelter in my lantern but will live forever if I simply let him go to light my sidewalk base path? Unless they actually do respawn, then it's a moot point.

7.) Goes without saying, but Beefalo have no repercussions for murder atm. They yield 6 meat, so 2 beefalo are enough for 3 meat effigies, making you nigh immortal. They's also an absolute ton of them. My current map has 3 or 4 herds of about 10-12 each. I could kill half of them and still have enough to farm poop with.

-Needless to say they should respawn, or breed.

-Their drops should be nerfed from 6 to 4 meat.

-They could become territorial, the individual beefalo you get close enough to startle attacking you once or twice.

-They should most definitely hit harder.

-Perhaps fewer should spawn initially.

8.) Now that the seed drops have been nerfed, perhaps the feather hat can attract more birds to increase the drop rate of seeds. This gives an incentive to braving the swamps as well.

9.) A way to harvest honey without angering bees? The beekeeper hat, at least last patch, didn't protect you from the bees, so there's no point to it.

10.) Increase Optimus Pine spawning. I enjoy his threat and I also like experimenting with him, but it seems I always have to cut down an entire forest before one spawns.

This last one is more of a want than a need:

-Taming hounds? they're so adorable when they're sleeping. Maybe they could need a regular supply of food like the smallbirds, but could actually be useful in combat. To combat the "Flock of doom" mentality with the hounds, perhaps when you don't feed them properly they attack the nearest source of meat: you or your other dogs.

Again, these are all just suggestions. I in no way no what would work best for this game and am probably unaware of some of the repercussions my suggestions could present. Sorry for the long-winded post.

Feel free to add your own.

[BearHandsAHHH]

I really like all of your suggestions.

[jorell]

+1 for the suggestions. I like the infestation and fertilization of farm plot the best.

The beffalos need to learn how to make babies. Just saying.

[Quincy]

I would love tameable hounds.

[Ora]

1.) Pigs should only go extinct from player built houses.

-To compensate for this, lower pig respawn times from 3 days to 5. That way even with an absurd pig village the player won't be able to sustain himself on their meat alone.

-An increase in pig strength and village size, to present a higher threat to those farming bacon could also be welcome changes.

Pigs once again respawn. Levin admitted that the pig extinction thing wasn't a good idea and turned it back to the way it was in a hotfix until he can refine the idea a little more.

2.) Farms should have a bump up in speed, closer to what they were pre-Queen.

-However, perhaps introduce a spoilage or infestation mechanic. If you're not there in reasonable time to harvest within a given window, your crop simply dies and you lose it. There could be a percentage chance for dropping seeds, but of course there's the threat of birds picking them up.

-A slight drop in manure farm fertilization efficiency could also work. Say that each poop is worth 6 crops, meaning you'll need 5 poop for one plot.

-Perhaps Beefalo, Pigs, Birds, and Bunnies develop a taste for the easy life off your farms and could eat the crops as well.

In the hotfix, they raised the farm's growing speeds a bit so they are lower than what they were pre-queen, but are faster than before the hotfix. They also increased the seed drop rate by about 5% or some number close to that.

[Full Metal Kirby]

Krampus:

- Is to rabbits as Gobblers are to Berry Bushes, not an issue unless you rely entirely on them.

- If you have the teeth to waste on making tooth traps for killing rabbits, you're already on day 100+

- Agreed that it is a bit of a chore to summon Krampus even when actively trying to do so now.

Tooth trap:

- Seems fine as is, considering how rarely hounds drop teeth now (or I'm just highly unlucky)

Pigs:

- Werepigs drop 2 (normal) meat and 1 pigskin

- Still respawn infinitely currently

Farming:

- By day 30 on a new world I already had 30+ seeds just from grabbing ones along my way exploring.

- Near-instant growth using more manure (directly on a seed) with turbo farm plots.

- Other than that, haven't gotten around to testing out farming post-patch, so can't say.

Fireflies: Agreed.

Spider Hat:

- You can still destroy tier-3 nests (to get 1 egg sac) post-patch without having to fight a spider queen, which is the quantity old tier-3 nests have dropped for a while now.

Harvesting Honey: Just have to do it at the right time of day when all the bees are out of the box.

Beefalo:

- Agreed that they need a drop nerf and a strength buff, but the former only once they can breed/respawn.

- They also will summon Krampus if you kill enough.

Optimus Pine:

- Needs to be 20x more common if you burn down an entire forest, or something, yeah.

[Ora]

I'm also pretty sure that Spider queens are capable of creating new spider nests. I've witnessed on my map spider nests pop up in the middle of paths and such and I had to clear them out.

[Xuhybrid]

I don't see the issue after the hotfix. Seeds could do with dropping less but the farming speed is fine. If you've started from scratch then you should know its really not difficult at all to get food from any available source.

[Trainer_Zero]

To the guys knocking my suggestions based on the hotfix:

I made this thread before the hotfix existed, so I was going on Queen patch info alone.

[tigbits]

Ive noticed a glitch though ( i think its a glitch) i made a spider hat and got a good size of spiders to follow me. I was able to take out 2 level 3 dens before night fell and my hat was almost worn out. so i took one of the spider eggs, ran back to base to make another and wait out the night. when morning came i went back to clear out the rest and noticed the spiders i abandoned before (as they were still fighting when night fell) were still fighting.

Also i still dont know how the hat works exactly. do you need it on BEFORE you attack the den so they see you as the controller, or afterwards? or is there a chance that they will follow you

[Wilson]

I think krampus is fine, he will come eventually. I got mad at a pig that ate a hatching bird egg and unleashed my fury on both pig towns and killed every single one and then 2 krampus spawned after exactly i killed the last pig. You must have some sort of bug.

I do agree about the pig extinction because how the hell am i supposed to even fight a tier 3 spider nest with spider warriors when only a tier 3 nest gives a spider nest.

I never knew that beeffalo didn't re-spawn, wish i new that before i used a pig army to kill them. I guess the devs realize that pigs can be abused so easily. (hmm every paragraph consists with pigs. To me they are VERY important xD

[Xuhybrid]

To the guys knocking my suggestions based on the hotfix:

I made this thread before the hotfix existed, so I was going on Queen patch info alone.

Ah i assumed otherwise because i was on the forums without seeing your thread.