Clothing items and backpacks at the same time

[Mysterious box]

40 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

Every time there's a discussion about body slot items people say head slot items are better so body slot sucks. Head slot items are so good that apparently you don't want to actually be able to wear them since you're forcing so many different things to need to be on your head.

Other than the fact that body clothes stack with head clothes (since just a stone or 1 piece of clothing is pretty short) body clothes let you wear a tam, the cheapest armor in the game, two different light sources, and various other hats.

When body and hats are identical (if not having body be superior) why would the hats need to be nerfed?

I find you only need a tam when your sanity gets low and that stacking clothing is kinda overkill you already get more than enough from 1 of the top tier insulation clothes anything more than that just feels like a waste of a slot. What I feel it comes down to is bodyslot items tend to encourage wearing them constantly for maximum benefit while most of the better head slot items usually output max benefits when needed.

Btw what is the cheapest armor your talking about?

[Copyafriend]

10 hours ago, reallychina said:

A beefalo doesn't glow in the dark (which means you need an extra slot for lantern/miner, an extra slot for bulbs plus the slot for bell)

 

Yes a glossamer saddle rider is nice very late game thing but that's about it.

 

But the discussion was around chest slots on their own, not with beefalos.

The parts i deleted can be summed up with: get off of it, then get back on, it takes about a full second, and you can do multiple things while off of it. 

ohhh noooo, if only i had TWO extra equipment slots while moving from place to place thanks to not having to hold the walking cane AND have the magi equipped at all times. And its almost as if… you could have a backpack or krampus sack to have even more slots, and just keep your magi switchout ready to be equipped when you do get off. Or just have the appropriate seasonal protection equipped and not have to stop and recharge your magi, burn trees as often, or gather nightmare fuel. 
 

And gossamer saddle endgame? With a construction amulet you only need 34 butterfly wings a single living log and some silk. If you can make the time to grind a walking cane it’s absolutely doable to just kill three dozen butterflies, or alternatively catch them (they stack to 20) 

 

now i want to be clear im aware the discussion is about chestpieces, but to say the magi is the hands down no argument best option is just factually wrong. Any other chestpiece is a perfectly viable option because there is another option to achieve the same speed. You choose magi? Thats your choice, that doesnt make it the best choice.

 

[Pig Princess]

11 hours ago, reallychina said:

Yes a glossamer saddle rider is nice very late game thing but that's about it.

 

42 minutes ago, Copyafriend said:

And gossamer saddle endgame? With a construction amulet you only need 34 butterfly wings a single living log and some silk. If you can make the time to grind a walking cane it’s absolutely doable to just kill three dozen butterflies, or alternatively catch them (they stack to 20) 

Actually even 68 butterfly wings are perfectly doable within 5 autumn days (one can consistently kill 15 butterflies per 4 minutes during day) without any sort of containers that reduce spoilage rate and there is no need to catch butterflies alive, plus it doesn't even have to be 5 days in a row since butterfly wings need 6 days to spoil and fresh ones are constantly added to pile of less fresh ones. Since flowers are abundant, unless it's winter or light's out setting, all one has to do is to rotate camera and keep in mind that butterfly spawns roughly every 15 seconds as long as there is at least 1 flower nearby. All this can be done in addition to other activities on surface mainland, preparation to ruins rush included. I don't think first autumn is endgame.

Sorry for offtopic.

[reallychina]

1 hour ago, Copyafriend said:

The parts i deleted can be summed up with: get off of it, then get back on, it takes about a full second, and you can do multiple things while off of it. 

ohhh noooo, if only i had TWO extra equipment slots while moving from place to place thanks to not having to hold the walking cane AND have the magi equipped at all times. And its almost as if… you could have a backpack or krampus sack to have even more slots, and just keep your magi switchout ready to be equipped when you do get off. Or just have the appropriate seasonal protection equipped and not have to stop and recharge your magi, burn trees as often, or gather nightmare fuel. 
 

And gossamer saddle endgame? With a construction amulet you only need 34 butterfly wings a single living log and some silk. If you can make the time to grind a walking cane it’s absolutely doable to just kill three dozen butterflies, or alternatively catch them (they stack to 20) 

 

now i want to be clear im aware the discussion is about chestpieces, but to say the magi is the hands down no argument best option is just factually wrong. Any other chestpiece is a perfectly viable option because there is another option to achieve the same speed. You choose magi? Thats your choice, that doesnt make it the best choice.

 

Beefalo is clunky to use and is all around worse than using magi. We could've have had this discussion if thermal stones weren't as strong so that insulation would matter. Insulation, for the most part, does not matter and there are many quick and cheap ways to cool off or get heated. In winter for example if you do your setup right with multiple furnaces and/or a combination of furnaces+ caller, the stone will last you a lifetime.

 

Endgame when you megabase and you have everything setup already, mob, resource farms, celestial crown etc and you don't have to fight and do work every few seconds, a glossamer rider with a chest clothing and celestial crown works, yes. But at that point it's more of a matter of convenience.

When actually playing the game, magi will always be better.

[Copyafriend]

1 hour ago, Pig Princess said:

Actually even 68 butterfly wings are perfectly doable within 5 autumn days

 

1 hour ago, Pig Princess said:

. I don't think first autumn is endgame.

Thank you and neither do i.

23 minutes ago, reallychina said:

Beefalo is clunky to use and is all around worse than using magi. We could've have had this discussion if thermal stones weren't as strong so that insulation would matter. Insulation, for the most part, does not matter

But it really isnt though, in my fairly large experience its a matter of getting used to it. You have provided nothing to prove 

 

24 minutes ago, reallychina said:

When actually playing the game, magi will always be better.

Literally nothing. You just keep saying its better but you’re not giving a reason.

Reasons why a beefalo is better:

you’re not limited to one chestslot

you dont need to farm nightmare fuel

Can be obtained even faster than a magi with experience (though i prefer to just use one construction amulet use, I already make one to craft things with so i might as well just save a use.)

provides a better speed boost than magi+cane+road

doesn’t need roads, so you can take faster paths to your destination, and never need to set up roads or follow premade paths i.e gets to its destination much faster than you’d realize if you’re used to following roads. 
 

while in transit armor is not a concern whatsoever, you have a beefalo with 1000 health to take hits, unless you’re ruins rushing or fighting a boss its not likely to die, and regenerates health over time. 
 

a beefalo and a magi are not mutually exclusive, if you need a magi for a fight, drop the bell (and your backpack if desired) together and come back for them when you’re done. 

If you truly do not need the space a backpack provides, insulation is superior to a thermal stone. A thermal stone will literally freeze you faster if you’re running around with even moderate winter protection (240 total is moderate if you want to wear chest winter gear, as you can stack with the tam and is already better than a thermal, but 360 is easily imagined year two with bearger for winter, or 480 if you want to effectively warm up once halfway through winter. 
 

In the same vein a insulated pack is also an option to improve the lifespan of your food without needing chester or 9 gems.

Realistic downsides of a beefalo

beefalos do require getting on and off of if you want to gather resources early on (tufts saplings and berrybushes)

beefalos require food until they’re domesticated, but if you do it early with a normal saddle they’ll speed your gathering up more than they’ll consume

If you’re riding a beefalo you likely are using a lantern for light, so your light source spoils (but is still easier to gather, if you can gather NMF faster somehow then refer back to magi is not exclusive to running) 

Beefalos need to be ridden semi constantly, so you do need to leave a salt lick when doing things that can take a long time, like clearing ruins the first time or sailing the ocean. But a day or two of decay wont hurt anything, just leave him somewhere and come get him when you’re done. But honestly if you’re traveling more than twenty steps you might as well take your beefalo anyway.

 

 

so in conclusion:

stop pretending like your choice is the best choice. Theres always an argument to be made for another option.

[reallychina]

55 minutes ago, Copyafriend said:

 

[....]

Your argument sits on the common yet false assumption that thermal stones can drag your temperature lower than ambiental temperature. This belief used to be very common in single player, but not even there was it applicable.

 

Thermal stones can only pull your temperature opposite to the current season. Once it reaches ambient temperature, it's "deactivated".

 

Most people that think insulation is important don't use thermal stones right. They either somewhat heat them on a firepit that's not even fully fueled or think 1 furnace or one caller is enough to get close to max. Even 2 furnaces or 1 furnace 1 caller, which is a common and easy setup, gets you extra 15deg, with close to max stone temperature being reachable with 4 furnaces and a caller, with almost 40deg hotter over a single furnace. 

 

Just because a stone is red hot doesn't mean it's anywhere near it's potential. A stone that is 30deg hot looks the same as one that is 90deg hot and their temperature drops LINEARLY.  Considering you can and should have at least one extra to hotswap, your downtime is next to 0.

 

You could make a case for chest clothing IF thermal stones weren't as powerful and if headgear was not as strong as chest clothing.

 

Since magi allows for free hands, has bonus speed, light AND allows for head armor, it is by far the best chest piece overall.

[Copyafriend]

1 hour ago, reallychina said:

it is by far the best chest piece overall.

seems like the wiki needs to be updated on the temperature thing, im not going to argue it, check it yourself or do your own testing, or admit you’re wrong. I’ll believe whatever you say because im not in the mood to break out a timer and a frozen thermal stone.

but you also ONLY focused on my temperature arguments, ignoring my points about using backpacks, insulated packs, or really any other chest slot item interchangeably instead of forcing yourself into one mode of playing due to being stubborn. Also, you arent prevented from just using a thermal with a beefalo, nothing is stopping you. You only need to pause for a second before dropping the stone, you can grab it again from the beefalo. Or grab it and then hop on. Its a seconds difference. 
 

im not saying that magi isn’t one of the best, because it is. But a backpack provides a lot of quality of life, bone armor can be as good as a magi, and always wearing a magi means you cant have switchouts as easily because thats extra storage space you cant use to carry either the magi, chest armor like the bone armor, or a very high protection armor like shadow armor. 
 

my point is that you’re restricting yourself and expending resources unnecessarily when theres a better and easier alternative in the form of a beefalo. If you’re playing a character with an innate speedboost then yeah magi is slightly faster, but if you’re not (like 90% of the cast) then a beefalo is faster and more versatile AND arguably cheaper.

[Guille6785]

15 hours ago, EighteenXVIII said:

The best players play in a way that maximizes the slots they have available, not by forcing themselves to make do with less. Doesn't mean they don't also have good inventory management, but it's not a good argument in this discussion.

ok but who are the best players

[HowlVoid]

30 minutes ago, Guille6785 said:

ok but who are the best players

Is you baby boy

[Copyafriend]

1 hour ago, HowlVoid said:

Is you baby boy

Now kith

[reallychina]

12 hours ago, Copyafriend said:

seems like the wiki needs to be updated on the temperature thing, im not going to argue it, check it yourself or do your own testing, or admit you’re wrong. I’ll believe whatever you say because im not in the mood to break out a timer and a frozen thermal stone.

but you also ONLY focused on my temperature arguments, ignoring my points about using backpacks, insulated packs, or really any other chest slot item interchangeably instead of forcing yourself into one mode of playing due to being stubborn. Also, you arent prevented from just using a thermal with a beefalo, nothing is stopping you. You only need to pause for a second before dropping the stone, you can grab it again from the beefalo. Or grab it and then hop on. Its a seconds difference. 
 

im not saying that magi isn’t one of the best, because it is. But a backpack provides a lot of quality of life, bone armor can be as good as a magi, and always wearing a magi means you cant have switchouts as easily because thats extra storage space you cant use to carry either the magi, chest armor like the bone armor, or a very high protection armor like shadow armor. 
 

my point is that you’re restricting yourself and expending resources unnecessarily when theres a better and easier alternative in the form of a beefalo. If you’re playing a character with an innate speedboost then yeah magi is slightly faster, but if you’re not (like 90% of the cast) then a beefalo is faster and more versatile AND arguably cheaper.

 

 

So you're telling me you're not willing to test it but that i should give up and accept i'm wrong even though i've been testing thermal stones since DS singleplayer and i'm playing around them every game, in winter never wearing insulation at all?

[Because of how powerful thermal stones are] Chest insulation needs a buff to be worth it over magi and that is the crux of this discussion, i consider my suggestion for them to have minimal extra storage a decent option.

[Chalky]

On 5/16/2022 at 8:46 AM, Mike23Ua said:

One of the biggest problems “clothing” has is you need to sacrifice your backpack slot for it- which in of itself isn’t that big of a deal: and while playing SINGLE PLAYER Don’t Starve, I had no issue at all of ever throwing my backpack down to equip Armor or a Clothing item.

However in a game with Multiplayer, needing to drop your items on the ground is more often than not.. NOT the smartest thing to do.

To further drive this point home, Wendy use to need to drop Abigail’s flower onto the ground and then kill an animal near to it to get Abby to Spawn, during this time.. Anyone can snatch up the flower- Hence Reworked Wendy where the flower should never under any circumstances need to leave Wendy’s Inventory.

I am hoping that Klei will give Maxwell the same treatment (Aka being able to hold the book in his hand and summon from it rather than needing to drop it on the ground for someone to steal away..)

Which leads me back to the problem of clothing & backpacks.

IF Klei would patch the game so that a players Backpack could not be picked up by another player

(Aka That belongs to Warly…)

Then I’m 150% sure you’d see more players ditching backpacks to use clothing because they’re loots is safe from thieves.

In it’s current form however.. most people ignore clothing as to not lose their backpacks to other players.

But I don’t think being able to wear armor and carry backpacks should be the right way to fix it..

I didn't mean armor, I only meant clothing items such as puffy vest, summer frest, etc. Thank you for giving your insight on it though!

[Echsrick]

what ever yes just do it, no talk about how using backpack = person that dont know how to manage inventory simply because he has more slots, makes no sense what so ever, it would mean that krampus sack is like the worst item ever, since in there logic, "more inventory = bad management" its simply because you can carry more, and too carry more things is a good thing, thats why everyone loves the backpack, because you can carry more cool things you found in the wilds, things that all then get placed in a chest, alsol the fact that backpack still alows you to see your body skin is a thing that body clothing dont realy have, not only that, why use body clothing if hat clothing can do the same or sometimes actualy even better? like, why use puffy west or what ever when winter hat is the same thing? there is a reason why hats have reskins instead of body clothing, the only body clothing worth using is body armor, since you dont have to wear it all the time to get its effects like body clothing, just drop your pack, use armor for battle, win battle, and then pick your backpack up again, you cant do that whit body clothing, so i am all for being able to use body clothing and backpack at the same time, that way body clothing will get way more use

[Waynel]

If it's day 720 ig it's fine to wear a puffy vest to avoid freezing; but the 1st winter is still part of the "early resource gathering" (mining glaciers, hunting walruses, popping tier 3 spider dens, a delayed lunar, etc.) so, coupled with a thermal stone these extra slots come in handy.

Heck, the thermal stone will even provide light to travel safely at night (but the stone is crappy in DS if memory serves me well).

10 hours ago, Echsrick said:

alsol the fact that backpack still alows you to see your body skin is a thing that body clothing dont realy have

An aspect that's often overlooked: what's the point of skins if your outfit is buried under your body apparel and head gear

[GodIess]

Never seen a problem with
this, in winter a warm hat and a stone, in summer an eyeglass and a stone, and there is no need to wear clothes, especially if you do not plan a long trip

[Mysterious box]

11 hours ago, Echsrick said:

what ever yes just do it, no talk about how using backpack = person that dont know how to manage inventory simply because he has more slots, makes no sense what so ever, it would mean that krampus sack is like the worst item ever, since in there logic, "more inventory = bad management" its simply because you can carry more, and too carry more things is a good thing, thats why everyone loves the backpack, because you can carry more cool things you found in the wilds, things that all then get placed in a chest, alsol the fact that backpack still alows you to see your body skin is a thing that body clothing dont realy have, not only that, why use body clothing if hat clothing can do the same or sometimes actualy even better? like, why use puffy west or what ever when winter hat is the same thing? there is a reason why hats have reskins instead of body clothing, the only body clothing worth using is body armor, since you dont have to wear it all the time to get its effects like body clothing, just drop your pack, use armor for battle, win battle, and then pick your backpack up again, you cant do that whit body clothing, so i am all for being able to use body clothing and backpack at the same time, that way body clothing will get way more use

Sadly for whatever reason if someone talks about the benefits of a backpack or other non clothes related bodyslot stuff on these forums it's usually followed by backpack player bad even tho there's basically no good reason to use bodyslot clothing other than because you can.

[Cheggf]

9 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

Sadly for whatever reason if someone talks about the benefits of a backpack or other non clothes related bodyslot stuff on these forums it's usually followed by backpack player bad even tho there's basically no good reason to use bodyslot clothing other than because you can.

Backpack good, clothes bad