Poll: What changes would you like to see for Wortox, if any?

[loopuleasa]

Source thread is this:

Previously I asked "What character do you main?" and after, I contacted people that replied to the poll, I compiled a list of desired changes.

In this thread feel free to vote and discuss about this character.

[Echsrick]

thats it? nothing?

[loopuleasa]

Just now, Echsrick said:

thats it? nothing?

it was an issue, I have modifed the poll

second question didnt save for some reason

[ShadowDuelist]

Wortox needs to:

• Be able to see who needs healing and who doesn't (perhaps even to the extent to  be able to see all mobs and player's health, since he can sense souls. Or at least when creatures/players are about to die)
• Be able to heal ridden beefalos, and allied mobs (he can't become an ally of many things anyway unless Wurt helps him. This is more  of a team perk)
• Be able to soul-hop the actively ridden beefalo.

Then he will be really good past early game, IMO.

[kirihime]

seeing health is the main one, or at least having a general indicator of when he can heal something

there's a few things the explorer can do but soul hop can't, dodging the fuelweaver insanity trap is the main one, I'd make them functionally identical
 

 

[Waoling]

Soul weapon and crystal, and soul have more use and utility.

[Dextops]

i don't think anything should be done do nerf wortox cause he already isn't doin too hot but i found him just extremely annoying to play which is probably why i never played him and then unraveled him for wanda (who i then never ended up playing i am really bad at spools management) but his half stats from food is very annoying and his mellow perks don't help with it

[Mike23Ua]

I think Wortox is simple enough that he is fine as is, the only “nerfs” I would give him is making it so in addition to a large stack of souls he can carry, he can no longer carry living animals to kill for their souls.

This COMPLETELY Contradicts his Animated short and there should be some very impactful consequences perhaps to his Sanity when carrying living animals with intent to kill later for souls.

Wortox NEEDS a Nerf no matter how you sugar coat it, but during this nerf it should reflect upon his innocent nature he had of being a fawn that didn’t want to cause Harm.

[Dextops]

4 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Wortox NEEDS a Nerf no matter how you sugar coat it

why?

[Mike23Ua]

45 minutes ago, Dextops said:

why?

Because being able to carry 40+ souls when he didn’t even want to kidnap a baby Beefalo there’s something clearly off about that?

[Dextops]

1 minute ago, Mike23Ua said:

Because being able to carry 40+ souls when he didn’t even want to kidnap a baby Beefalo there’s something clearly off about that?

k but i don't think wurt wanted to kill merms yet she still has the option to. Character motivations shouldn't limit their gameplay to an annoying degree. Seeing as wortox is already very underpowered to mid i don't see a reason to nerf him more.

[HowlVoid]

I've had a rough idea that balances souls dropped from different mobs.

First a small nerf/buff on "small" souls dropped by lesser creatures (rabbits/moleworm/birds/butterfly)

-Lesser souls heal for 8hp, restore 13 hunger (when eaten), cost -15 sanity (when eaten), +5 sanity (when released). 

This makes smaller creatures an equivalent to picking flowers and almost as much as eating a cooked cactus flesh for Wortox in the early game. Early game "lesser" creatures are pretty limited and can be wiped out just as flowers can, or end up requiring more work than picking a few cactus (killing birds). I know this makes killing butterflies a whole lot less rewarding but later on in the game it will be a viable way to store and restore sanity and incourage another new way with how you interact with his souls. A moleworm farm for example, will make you less dependent on a tam or eating tons of ice cream/cactus flesh/jelly salad. You give up easy healing now, for easy sanity (after some set-up) for the rest of the game. I enjoy it when a character's kit is more involved in balancing downsides with upsides and remaining viable for as long as possible while introducing external forces (food/tam/other characters) as a supplement to your perks rather than becoming dependent entirely on those external forces.

-Medium souls are souls as they are now (pigs/spiders/bunnymen/bees/etc)

A Buff on souls dropped by bosses (dragonfly/deerclops/etc)

-Epic Souls heal for 120-150 HP, 120-150 hunger (when eaten), 0 sanity loss (when eaten). They're scary beings, Wortox shouldn't feel bad about eating them. He didn't feel bad about messing with the survivors because they aren't exactly "innocent" and bosses kill innocent mobs.

Eating souls feels very neutral to me, this includes souls dropped by hard to kill bosses. You gain such a small amount of hunger for sanity that is harder to recover than that tiny amount of hunger. Meaty stew becomes the status-quo but getting sanity restoring foods isn't quite as mass farmable (until you get jelly salad, taffy, etc etc). Even then spending so long chugging taffy never gets easier, or being permanently tethered to a tam. Personally I just think boss souls should be a lot more rewarding and can be balanced with a smaller cap (5?) on boss souls as well as having each drop 1.

This is a rough idea of how I think different souls can serve different purposes so they're less of a one trick pony type thing. Balancing what the cap of each type of soul can be tricky but I think the way his eating dowside works ends up feeling like you fall into a rut of sorts by the mid-game that you never really get out of. 

Edit: I was thinking that with this new system he could drop souls based on total soul "weight". Lesser souls would "weigh" less than regular souls and epic souls would weigh more than regular souls. Wortox would still have a cap of 20 souls but examining the other kind would let the player know how much of a "regular" souls the others weigh. For example, lesser souls could weigh half a regular soul and epic souls could weigh 4-5 regular souls. This would also introduce an unintentional downside of managing more than one soul in exchange for the new utility souls bring to the table. I would call this a dynamic change and luckily lesser souls and epic souls are pretty easy to ignore so they won't invade your inventory half-hazardly. 

(Again rough idea, numbers aren't final)

Edit 2: Just realized that although early game souls are a heavily nerfed and maybe you don't want the sanity, the higher stack size (40) makes them great for teleportation while being balanced in making them generally bad for healing or hunger (great for ruins?).

[NoodlemanNed]

i think soul hopping should be cheaper somehow. I find it a bit annoying how you need to stop extremely frequently in order to explore with teleports, which could otherwise be a fun an unique way to get around.

One idea i have for this is letting wortox teleport while his soul count is at 0, but doing so would cost either health or sanity. Soul hops would still use up a soul if youre carrying any so that way wortox players need to make a conscious decision to not eat/heal with souls while exploring.

Another thing you could do is add a soul meter. So basically you could just have different mobs restoring x% of the meter, that way you can keep healing and eating souls at a similar cost to what they are now, but you could make teleporting jut a bit more accessible (and also nerf butterflies because everyone seems to want that)

[ArubaroBeefalo]

i think every player should see how wounded are others in the same way you can see others being cold,insane or hungry. The animations are from DS single player but works really nicely in multiplayer, idk how many times i saved my noob friends because of them

Maybe some scratch over the face could tell us if the player is low health (same could be added for tamed beefs)

[loopuleasa]

31 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

i think every player should see how wounded are others in the same way you can see others being cold,insane or hungry. The animations are from DS single player but works really nicely in multiplayer, idk how many times i saved my noob friends because of them

Maybe some scratch over the face could tell us if the player is low health (same could be added for tamed beefs)

Viktor made a mod called "Are you hurt" that actually showed a heart above wounded players, but since the Waterlogged update it is no longer functional since the netvar responsible for the "wounded" state was no longer there.

[BeeClops]

7 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

Because being able to carry 40+ souls when he didn’t even want to kidnap a baby Beefalo there’s something clearly off about that?

dude you play on console, how could you possibly want a nerf for Wortox?  he's like half as effective on console than on pc.(and even on pc I don't rate him that high personally).

the qol idea to sense your wounded allies sounds nice.

[chincer]

i feel the main issue with wortox is that his upsides arent meaningful enough to warrant the very low effectiveness of food, not only in hunger but also in the other stats, it feels you either have to eat twice as much food wasting resources or try to keep your sanity up, but also all sanity food is half as effective

i would rather see Wortox have more things to do with his souls than eat , heal others and soul hop, because healing others is not something that special ones pierogi becomes extremely available, he also cant heal wanda in anyway, and she can be very popular late into a server.

soul hop is fun but just save some time , and it is inferior to wanda's teleports. the soul hop is totally overrated in my opinion

souls dont restore enough hunger to feel impactful

Wortox could be a far better healing character if his souls would heal at least one year from wanda, and he could get some soul crafting like Soul lights, or soul shards or maybe a happy departure craft that consume some souls and flowers and what not, to restore sanity from people around it.

 

 

[loopuleasa]

4 hours ago, chincer said:

I basically never eat food when I play wortox

The best sanity gain method is actually killing the shadows

I want to have a chest of nm fuel either way, so why not start early

[ArubaroBeefalo]

3 hours ago, loopuleasa said:

I basically never eat food when I play wortox

The best sanity gain method is actually killing the shadows

I want to have a chest of nm fuel either way, so why not start early

but there is a moment in the experience when you feel tired of killing shadows and you have more nf that you can waste... plus the time you waste doing anything if you need to also kill them. So annoying for little payoff

i often pick it when i play with newbie friends but if the world last enough i end up tired of playing with a Wilson that is most of the time insane and only recovers 75 hunger from a stew...

20 souls for healing are literally 20 roasted tomatoes which are really easy to get

is a great concept and fun character but becomes boring and annoying in the long run. And for solo is simply so bad sadly, i rather use lazy explorer with anybody than killing bees/spiders to jump few meters

[Mr Giggio]

probably a raise of the max souls capacity can solve the problem yall pointed out but im not sure how i feel about it 
i mean i dunno it can be a change for good  but holdin 30 souls sounds huge

[skile]

12 hours ago, MrSoratori said:

probably a raise of the max souls capacity can solve the problem yall pointed out but im not sure how i feel about it 
i mean i dunno it can be a change for good  but holdin 30 souls sounds huge

maybe getting an "upgrade" for max soul capacity in some form would work? 

maybe it would require some resources to craft, or a "strong" soul from a powerfull foe? 

maybe just add some upgrades like that to other soul functions as well? like, to gradually make souls more powerful the further you are into the game. 

it sounds pretty boring, but i think it could work if done well enough? 

[Mysterious box]

13 hours ago, MrSoratori said:

probably a raise of the max souls capacity can solve the problem yall pointed out but im not sure how i feel about it 
i mean i dunno it can be a change for good  but holdin 30 souls sounds huge

I feel like it would be a buff but not enough to fix his situation it would just end up in the same situation it'd probably just be better to give him new uses for souls.

[chincer]

1 hour ago, skile said:

maybe it would require some resources to craft, or a "strong" soul from a powerfull foe? 

considering what they did with WX they might as well do something similar with Wortox in the sense different monsters drop special souls, imagine soul of deerclops which when consume give Wortox cold resistance for 2 days

or be use in combination with 20 souls (which need to be carefully collected to not overflow) to gain some permanent effects or at the very least give him special wortox only powers, maybe consuming the soul of a monster let him see their HP?

right now he just isnt doing much and recent character updates have shown what could be done

[loopuleasa]

19 hours ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

 

with double hit shadows cha-cha dance they die very fast, and I usually dont interrupt myself from what I am doing already, just integrate shadow dancing routines

[ArubaroBeefalo]

21 minutes ago, loopuleasa said:

with double hit shadows cha-cha dance they die very fast, and I usually dont interrupt myself from what I am doing already, just integrate shadow dancing routines

i do that too but still, ends up being tired or atleast happend to me because i usually play wortox with people that need babysit so having to waste time teaching them for 4727474th time a recipe or wanting to pick a resource so they learn to craft something while also dealing with shadows Zzzzz.

Don't get me wrong, i really like wortox and is a great character with a fun desing