sped Should Wolfgang get his Speed Boost back?

[Dextops]

Just now, Monkey Cups said:

He quite literally said combat is optional. It's right there for you to read.

and he said things like farms and using mobs to do your work which you completely ignored

[Sweaper]

10 minutes ago, Monkey Cups said:

This statement is hilarious. Hound waves, depth worms, nightmare creatures, and the many many craftables that require items dropped from mobs prove otherwise. You cannot last very long without fighting anything ever and if you think you can I would love to see you try.

Considering you can live an entire year without crafting anything other than torches I don't see how impossible it would be to last 100 days without directly attacking. Just build a pig village on the surface and a bunny village in the caves for summer.

[Toros]

There have been a lot of threads on Wolf's rework, and this one is probably one of the most unnecessarily contentious.

Wolfgang is fine without a speed boost.  He didn't need it in the past, and removing it didn't create any problem he didn't have before.

If speed was your concern outside of a speedrun, you'd be using Wanda instead already because teleporting > speed, and she has high damage as well.

While I do recognize that Wolf is no longer as appealing to speedrunners... I am fine with that.  Rushing bosses can still be done with several different characters and in a group you can just dogpile a boss to win, character selection is irrelevant.

Having played the beta, I can say that Wolfgang is more fun to play and is still powerful and effective, which is all I really care about in the end.

[Monkey Cups]

1 minute ago, Dextops said:

and he said things like farms and using mobs to do your work which you completely ignored

Using mobs and ducking into the caves for hound waves won't keep you going forever. Eventually the beefalo go extinct, the pig houses get smashed, the tentacles die. The only guaranteed spawns are the bosses. It's easy to say "just run to the beefalo lel" but I want to see someone do it for longer than a single in-game year. You're going to have to stab something yourself eventually.

[Dextops]

Just now, Monkey Cups said:

Using mobs and ducking into the caves for hound waves won't keep you going forever. Eventually the beefalo go extinct, the pig houses get smashed, the tentacles die. The only guaranteed spawns are the bosses. It's easy to say "just run to the beefalo lel" but I want to see someone do it for longer than a single in-game year. You're going to have to stab something yourself eventually.

yes and then you set up farms and you are practically invincible at the point that happens that it literally doesn't matter which character you are

[HowlVoid]

1 minute ago, Monkey Cups said:

Using mobs and ducking into the caves for hound waves won't keep you going forever. Eventually the beefalo go extinct, the pig houses get smashed, the tentacles die. The only guaranteed spawns are the bosses. It's easy to say "just run to the beefalo lel" but I want to see someone do it for longer than a single in-game year. You're going to have to stab something yourself eventually.

Wurt and Webber have followers around all the time for cheap.

[Sweaper]

Just now, Monkey Cups said:

Using mobs and ducking into the caves for hound waves won't keep you going forever. Eventually the beefalo go extinct, the pig houses get smashed, the tentacles die. The only guaranteed spawns are the bosses. It's easy to say "just run to the beefalo lel" but I want to see someone do it for longer than a single in-game year. You're going to have to stab something yourself eventually.

Pig houses get smashed by who, Deerclops? Why would you be near structures if you know you can't manipulate him

[Monkey Cups]

1 minute ago, HowlVoid said:

Wurt and Webber have followers around all the time for cheap.

This is a thread about Wolfgang, though. Do it with Wolfgang. Then maybe you'll appreciate his combat prowess more.

[HowlVoid]

1 minute ago, Monkey Cups said:

This is a thread about Wolfgang, though. Do it with Wolfgang. Then maybe you'll appreciate his combat prowess more.

You changed the subject not me, a pacifist playthrough is completely possible.

[Copyafriend]

24 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

All of your arguments boil down to "oh you like X, you must think Y is useless". 

Why do you like X, when Y exists.

The most straw man of straw man arguments I've ever seen on this forum.

Strawman- creating a fictitious argument that is easier to attack than the original and attacking it instead of the argument given

your whole argument is “wolfgang bad now because double damage useless while speed good”

Yeah they took his speed. You can get  speed without playing wolfgang or while playing him by just using a beefalo. 

thay would be a strawman if that wasnt your entire argument against the nerf. You were complaining that he was simple to play (which can be a good thing, not every character needs to turn the game upside down) but having a speed boost didnt make him complicated or interesting. If you want additional mechanics, well start suggesting something. Because as it is he was iust made easier to play and he lost his speed boosts. He was never anything more than “the guy who is good at fighting bosses”. He didnt need a speed boost to be that. They didnt NEED to take it away, but they did. He’s not suddenly f tier, just like wilson wouldnt become s tier if his rework gave him a speed boost while at full health. Are speed boosts nice? Hell yeah, exploring before i get a beefalo is a chore, and sometimes i just wanna leave it at base. But you don’t NEED a speedboost to kill bosses. He doesnt need to be a jack of all trades either, he’s got a niche and he’s the best at his niche, it sounds like a simple effective character to me. A little simple? Maybe for my tastes, but he works fine. I wouldn’t play wilson either, but wilson fills the niche of being plain, just because i find that boring doesnt mean the niche shouldn’t exist. 

[Gi-Go]

Is my opinion on speed boost removal. 

[HowlVoid]

6 minutes ago, Copyafriend said:

Strawman- creating a fictitious argument that is easier to attack than the original and attacking it instead of the argument given

your whole argument is “wolfgang bad now because double damage useless while speed good”

Yeah they took his speed. You can get  speed without playing wolfgang or while playing him by just using a beefalo. 

thay would be a strawman if that wasnt your entire argument against the nerf. You were complaining that he was simple to play (which can be a good thing, not every character needs to turn the game upside down) but having a speed boost didnt make him complicated or interesting. If you want additional mechanics, well start suggesting something. Because as it is he was iust made easier to play and he lost his speed boosts. He was never anything more than “the guy who is good at fighting bosses”. He didnt need a speed boost to be that. They didnt NEED to take it away, but they did. He’s not suddenly f tier, just like wilson wouldnt become s tier if his rework gave him a speed boost while at full health. Are speed boosts nice? Hell yeah, exploring before i get a beefalo is a chore, and sometimes i just wanna leave it at base. But you don’t NEED a speedboost to kill bosses. He doesnt need to be a jack of all trades either, he’s got a niche and he’s the best at his niche, it sounds like a simple effective character to me. A little simple? Maybe for my tastes, but he works fine. I wouldn’t play wilson either, but wilson fills the niche of being plain, just because i find that boring doesnt mean the niche shouldn’t exist. 

I've already explained why your arguments are all straw man arguments.

"If you want speed go play Wormwood"

If you can't figure it out yourself I can't help you.

[Monkey Cups]

10 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

You changed the subject not me, a pacifist playthrough is completely possible.

So your pacifist playthrough is being uploaded when? If you're so confident in that there's no harm in showing actual proof someone can pull that off.

[Owlrust]

Would make more sense on a lighter-frame person than a larger one honestly, but maybe it should be based on momentum instead? The longer he runs the faster he gets, but if he stops, that speed starts to decrease.

The other thing to consider though is that, with a speed increase, also comes an effective increase in hits you can make on most enemies before dodging since the process is faster. So not only would he land more hits, be faster permanently (which would encourage people to be mighty 100% of the time), and deal more damage, but he would also benefit from one of the strongest armors in the game without any penalty too.

1 hour ago, Toros said:

There have been a lot of threads on Wolf's rework, and this one is probably one of the most unnecessarily contentious.

Wolfgang is fine without a speed boost.  He didn't need it in the past, and removing it didn't create any problem he didn't have before.

If speed was your concern outside of a speedrun, you'd be using Wanda instead already because teleporting > speed, and she has high damage as well.

While I do recognize that Wolf is no longer as appealing to speedrunners... I am fine with that.  Rushing bosses can still be done with several different characters and in a group you can just dogpile a boss to win, character selection is irrelevant.

Having played the beta, I can say that Wolfgang is more fun to play and is still powerful and effective, which is all I really care about in the end.

Would upvote you twice if I could.

[Milordo]

3 hours ago, Dextops said:

no you should judge the character at their full potential ignoring something because its against your own principle is ignorant and is not factual for how good the character actually is

are you really stating that exploits should be considered as game design? Really?

[Dextops]

Just now, Milordo said:

are you really stating that exploits should be considered as game design? Really?

yes yes i am because as long as it is in the goddamn game it is part of the game and until it is fixed or anything it should considered on how good a character is

if you can find a counter then i'd be happy to dispute it or are you just using it as an excuse to back up your faulty claims?

[Milordo]

1 hour ago, HowlVoid said:

Hounds - Pigmen, frogs, beefalo can kill them early on

Depth worms- you can run away from them until they stop chasing, which actually doesn't take very long or have bunnymen kill them. 

Late game you have killing fields, you have bosses capable of killing the invasive bosses and you can also use them gather resources.

Combat has been optional this whole time and you didn't even know it. Try thinking less narrowly and you'll realize how many options the game gives you outside of combat.

Followers can kill any mob in the game too and there are even characters whose gameplay revolves around followers. You don't actually need to do any fighting yourself to actually kill things. 

As if all of what you described sounds economic and easy to do. Not only stating combat is optional..... 

Ah yes, i could recruit 40 bunnymens with 40 carrots, but let me before grow and wait for 40 carrots, (in the meanwhile spring arrived), then i'll try to wait for some random mob to die, so i can cook my food for not die. Then i need to hope and pray for the A.i of a random boss to go where i need. I definitely not need to fight.

Did you understand what you're writing? It's completely non-sensical. Sure, you can play Don't Starve with your eyes, but that doesn't mean you should never see! What are this statement to the discussion? Wtf?

7 minutes ago, Dextops said:

yes yes i am because as long as it is in the goddamn game it is part of the game and until it is fixed or anything it should considered on how good a character is

if you can find a counter then i'd be happy to dispute it or are you just using it as an excuse to back up your faulty claims?

The already "faulty claims" it's a red alarm you just want to "fight". You just want to be right and win like a battle. 

Kiddo this is not a battle and exploits, bugs or whatever it's not intended in the game, never and ever was, is and will be considered in the games as arguments for balance. There is no "counter" here, just normal knowledge. Adieu

[Sweaper]

5 minutes ago, Milordo said:

As if all of what you described sounds economic and easy to do. Not only stating combat is optional..... 

Ah yes, i could recruit 40 bunnymens with 40 carrots, but let me before grow and wait for 40 carrots, (in the meanwhile spring arrived), then i'll try to wait for some random mob to die, so i can cook my food for not die. Then i need to hope and pray for the A.i of a random boss to go where i need. I definitely not need to fight.

Did you understand what you're writing? It's completely non-sensical. Sure, you can play Don't Starve with your eyes, but that doesn't mean you should never see! What are this statement to the discussion? Wtf?

You can get 40 carrots in less than 10 days. You don't need to wait for stuff to die to get food. You can just walk away from base to avoid bosses.

[HowlVoid]

3 minutes ago, Milordo said:

As if all of what you described sounds economic and easy to do. Not only stating combat is optional..... 

Ah yes, i could recruit 40 bunnymens with 40 carrots, but let me before grow and wait for 40 carrots, (in the meanwhile spring arrived), then i'll try to wait for some random mob to die, so i can cook my food for not die. Then i need to hope and pray for the A.i of a random boss to go where i need. I definitely not need to fight.

Did you understand what you're writing? It's completely non-sensical. Sure, you can play Don't Starve with your eyes, but that doesn't mean you should never see! What are this statement to the discussion? Wtf?

Bunnymen and similar mobs automatically aggro onto bosses. 

There are plenty of videos online.

 

[Milordo]

1 hour ago, Gi-Go said:

Is my opinion on speed boost removal. 

Overreaction. If you want speed and travel faster, pick other characters.

[Dextops]

8 minutes ago, Milordo said:

The already "faulty claims" it's a red alarm you just want to "fight". You just want to be right and win like a battle. 

Kiddo this is not a battle and exploits, bugs or whatever it's not intended in the game, never and ever was, is and will be considered in the games as arguments for balance. There is no "counter" here, just normal knowledge. Adieu

first part is because a lot of people use the statement "exploits/cheese doesn't count" as a disguise for their bad arguments and still cheese ag/still set up walls for dfly to block larvae and i assume you are doing the same thing and in any argument the goal is to seek discussion and come out on top and/or to have your opinion changed on something if you aren't open to both there is no point to argue which you refuse to point out any faults so you decide to change the topic to "do exploits count" which yes they do they are in the game therefore should be considered when saying statements about characters and until they're fixed it will remain that way ignoring facts because of your own principle is ignorant and only leads to the spread of misinformation 

[Milordo]

3 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

Bunnymen and similar mobs automatically aggro onto bosses. 

There are plenty of videos online.

 

I know

6 minutes ago, Sweaper said:

You can get 40 carrots in less than 10 days. You don't need to wait for stuff to die to get food. You can just walk away from base to avoid bosses.

And i know this too. 

This discussion is about Wolfgang, not about other ways to beat the game. We're talking about a COMBAT character. 

[Sweaper]

Just now, Milordo said:

I know

And i know this too. 

This discussion is about Wolfgang, not about other ways to beat the game. We're talking about a COMBAT character. 

I just entered the chain of someone saying that playing without attacking is impossible.

[Milordo]

1 minute ago, Dextops said:

first part is because a lot of people use the statement "exploits/cheese doesn't count" as a disguise for their bad arguments and still cheese ag/still set up walls for dfly to block larvae and i assume you are doing the same thing and in any argument the goal is to seek discussion and come out on top and/or to have your opinion changed on something if you aren't open to both there is no point to argue which you refuse to point out any faults so you decide to change the topic to "do exploits count" which yes they do they are in the game therefore should be considered when saying statements about characters and until they're fixed it will remain that way ignoring facts because of your own principle is ignorant and only leads to the spread of misinformation 

This post it's full of misinformation, spreading ignorance all over the place. I imagine you playing closing and re-opening closets to gain i-frames right? I'm done and will no longer continue because it's basic knowledge of videogames, if you don't understand it, it's not my fault. Addio.

2 minutes ago, Sweaper said:

I just entered the chain of someone saying that playing without attacking is impossible.

I entered because the other guy stated "fighting it's situational at best. You should never fight in the game."

[Dextops]

3 minutes ago, Milordo said:

This post it's full of misinformation, spreading ignorance all over the place. I imagine you playing closing and re-opening closets to gain i-frames right? I'm done and will no longer continue because it's basic knowledge of videogames, if you don't understand it, it's not my fault. Addio.

so let me get this straight because you have nothing to counter my argument you continue to say "noo exploits/cheese methods should not be considered valid because ??? even though i will still use walls for dfly and ag" and then decide to quit the argument because you have been cornered and then accuse me of spreading misinformation also no i wouldn't abuse i frames because my iq is above room temperature and i'd kite it instead of closing the entire game to dodge a deerclops hit