Why the Webber Rework doesn't... work

[Guille6785]

19 minutes ago, LonelySkeleton said:

Wendy still kills Dfly faster and with less resources, i take it you don't play her? When fighting bosses that have mainly single target attacks, all you do is position Abi behind them while you take aggro. This effectively makes Abi invulnerable while still providing the benefits of damage buff and extra dps. And this is without the inclusion of her easily craftable potions. There's some neat tech with the movement speed potion and map edges that allows Abi to effectively kite boss AoE attacks also. I don't main her anymore for a reason she is actually OP while Webber even now is just so-so.

because as we all know killing a boss a minute faster is extremely broken because dst is a boss rushing game where 99% of your gameplay is bosses

[Mysterious box]

It's actually not even faster I did the math abigial using a night potion deals 120 damage every 3.3 seconds where as cave spiders deal 20 damage every 3 seconds meaning it only takes 6 to match Abigail's damage boosted by a night potion.

[LonelySkeleton]

19 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

Techincally webber kills less resources due to not using healing. Silk and monster meat stockpile from wars which you generally need anyway for food and the honey comes from boxes add to that webber's army has no size restriction and that combat spiders deal 20 damage while nurses deal 10 and I can't see a point where wendy beats dfly faster webber with just abigial her dps won't be able to keep up with horde 1v1.

I will say wendy could do the fight earlier in a run tho.

Fair counter-points, thank you and i agree

14 minutes ago, Guille6785 said:

because as we all know killing a boss a minute faster is extremely broken because dst is a boss rushing game where 99% of your gameplay is bosses

I get it lol but it actually is to most players, DST endgame either becomes megabasing or boss rushing.

[Guille6785]

5 minutes ago, LonelySkeleton said:

I get it lol but it actually is to most players, DST endgame either becomes megabasing or boss rushing.

not most, only the subset of players who have enough experience to survive indefinitely but not enough experience in combat to play without help from combat characters (which granted seem to be lot of people in communities like the forums so it would make it seem that way)

[Baark0]

2 hours ago, ShadowDuelist said:

Did you give spiders thulecite crowns? Also they ate the horn...
This may have worked if your point is "kill AG just because", but it doesn't seem like a practical strategy for an actual game....

You can put spiders into defensive mode by blowing the webby whistle, which stops them from eating meat. Also this wasn't just ag kill, it was ruins rushing with spiders. Same thing, just thought I'd clarify. And yes, I gave them crowns. I had basically done everything I had wanted to, and just felt like having some fun.

 

1 hour ago, LonelySkeleton said:

Wendy still kills Dfly faster and with less resources, i take it you don't play her? When fighting bosses that have mainly single target attacks, all you do is position Abi behind them while you take aggro. This effectively makes Abi invulnerable while still providing the benefits of damage buff and extra dps. And this is without the inclusion of her easily craftable potions. There's some neat tech with the movement speed potion and map edges that allows Abi to effectively kite boss AoE attacks also. I don't main her anymore for a reason she is actually OP while Webber even now is just so-so. Spiders are still my last choice for followers but it's good Klei made them viable against bosses, that's actually quite neat.

Not to be a stick in the mud, Webber actually seems balanced now. While he doesn't appeal to me personally, there is definitely a reason to choose him now so i'm happy. He has a proper summoner role to play now which is great. 

If you put the spiders in defense mode they will not eat any drops. Simply blow the whistle when the boss dies problem solved! I see like 3 thul crowns on spiders, but tbf the same results would of been achieved with 3 nurse spiders instead so at least that expense was optional. Nice AG kill!

My plan was to get nurse spiders as my healing source in the ruins, but I learned about a day before entering the caves that I needed to befriend a nurse spider before I could craft their respective cookie. Even then I still only brought like 4 blue caps to the ruins, and I never dropped to critical levels of hp. If any of you are curious as to how the run went, I uploaded the video to my channel.

Also not sure if that Wendy part was directed at me, but in case it was, I do play Wendy, she's a lot of fun, especially with an ornery beefalo.

[douan33]

It waa always much to speedrun some helmets and a hambat for combat instead of building a spider army before. And it seems to remain that way.

[ShadowDuelist]

6 hours ago, Baark0 said:

You can put spiders into defensive mode by blowing the webby whistle, which stops them from eating meat. Also this wasn't just ag kill, it was ruins rushing with spiders. Same thing, just thought I'd clarify. And yes, I gave them crowns. I had basically done everything I had wanted to, and just felt like having some fun.

I know the whistle thing, truth is you have less than half a second after the enemy died to blow the whistle for the effect to work and prevent them from eating the loot. Despite everyone mentioning that, with the current timings It’s very impractical and 2 out of 3 times they will eat the loot.

The crowns thing because it was just for fun, I get it I guess, as long as it can be done without the crowns on them I mean.

[twitchgabo]

5 hours ago, ShadowDuelist said:

I know the whistle thing, truth is you have less than half a second after the enemy died to blow the whistle for the effect to work and prevent them from eating the loot. Despite everyone mentioning that, with the current timings It’s very impractical and 2 out of 3 times they will eat the loot.

The crowns thing because it was just for fun, I get it I guess, as long as it can be done without the crowns on them I mean.

I agree with you... Despite the method of using the whistle to prevent spiders from eating loot, it is very very risky to do that. It is easier withh health indicators mods, however, it is still too riksy.

 

They should make a delay for the spiders to search for meat in the ground so webber can catch the loot before they try to devour 

[kerillian 1417]

On 6/27/2021 at 10:00 AM, Baark0 said:

To anyone saying spiders suck against bosses:

(also yes I know this is only one boss, but still, a 1 minute ag kill with no gravestone/pillar cheese is pretty good)

they r still completely worthless against fuelweaver and celestial champion these 2 major bosses

[Baark0]

2 hours ago, kerillian 1417 said:

they r still completely worthless against fuelweaver and celestial champion these 2 major bosses

yeah thats kinda how bosses with aoe attacks go

[Mysterious box]

19 minutes ago, Baark0 said:

yeah thats kinda how bosses with aoe attacks go

actually as it stands spiders can fight most aoe bosses from what i've seen just not all them