Tab1 Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 hey all, i stopped playing after ranching upgrade Mark 1, (i mentioned that in an unrelated post) however now i find that a lot of things have changed. I tried reading the change log after ranching mark 1 but they are toooooooooooo damn long. i really cant read them all. So , i would like some help in figuring out some of the "major" changes. I'll post some of the changes which i figured out, correct me if i'm wrong and do add whatever you think is a major change after ranching mark 1. 1. Polluted water>fertilizer maker>natural gas is no longer an effective source of power generation (WHY?) Which power source to go for in early,mid game? 2. Abyssalite is no longer useable. (Which material to use for insulator early/mid game?) 3. Keeping critters wild is better than ranching them for eggs/ meat (Im not sure about this one) 4. SPOM is no longer effective (WHY?) Algae terrariums are much better for oxygen production till mid game? 5. Steam engine is now feasible (buildable) 6. Bathrooms no longer warm up as they don’t hold water (not sure about this one too) so using a closed loop with sieve is better. 7. Showers boost morale? 8. Converting oil to petrol means losing 50% of oil so its better to convert it to natural gas (which is quite difficult I might add) P.S. Most of the info gathered above is from the game itself or the forums here. Thanks in advance. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeftyRighty Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 2) get insulated tiles/pipes/vents and use igneous rock, not perfect but plenty sufficient until you start doing the rocket stuff much later and need ceramic or insulation (space material). 4) SPOMs work the same way they used to, they just aren't the "king" any more. "Exploiting" the po2 coming off the pwater produced by algae terrariums or other sources is "free" O2. 8) 50% is with the refinery machine, you can convert to petroleum using heat if you like without that loss. You might need the petroleum for rocket engines, but I think the math for just power per unit fuel makes NG the king there (although I'm not sure about the pwater math). Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1145346 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhatTheDuck Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 1. Because it was overpowered. You can convert Oil -> petroleum -> sour gas - > methane -> natural gas, it is much more complicated but worth it 2. Ceramic (coal + clay, you get clay from sand after it was used as filtration medium or swamp biomes) 3. Depends, some critters are worth it, a early glossy drecko farm will prevent the need of a polymer press in mid game and stone hatch create good amount of coal 4. I still use a SPOM, terrariums are viable now 5. never built one but i will try it soon 6. I feed cold water to the bathroom atm, because the lavatory convert 5kg water to 11.7kg Pwater and the cold pwater flow back in my hot polluted water tank, it helps to keep your pw tank at reasonable heat level. But this depends on your setup 7. Yep, +3 morale. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1145349 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craigjw Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 5. Steam engines; this is debatable. Is blocking the ports an exploit? Is adding a gas above the generator to ensure low pressure above it an exploit? Are door pumps an exploit to remove the steam? If you answered NO to any of these questions, then steam generators are feasible, otherwise, good #@#@ing luck. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1145365 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasza22 Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 2 hours ago, Tab1 said: 1. Polluted water>fertilizer maker>natural gas is no longer an effective source of power generation (WHY?) Which power source to go for in early,mid game? It was too good. Now you need to depend on nat gas geysers mid game. You can store the gas for later usage in gas tanks. 2 hours ago, Tab1 said: 2. Abyssalite is no longer useable. (Which material to use for insulator early/mid game?) Insulated igneous does it`s job most of the time. In larger temp differences use ceramic or 2 layer insulated walls. In extreme temperature differences vacuum insulation. 2 hours ago, Tab1 said: 3. Keeping critters wild is better than ranching them for eggs/ meat (Im not sure about this one) Both are an option. You should rather tame critters for what they produce. Hatches can sustain coal plants if you ranch enough, glossy drecko is the best source of plastic. Pacu use way too much algae to keep fed but they are a good source of eggshells. 2 hours ago, Tab1 said: 4. SPOM is no longer effective (WHY?) Algae terrariums are much better for oxygen production till mid game? Only thing that changed a bout the SPOM is that now there is a use for hydrogen (hydrogen engines, super late game). You might have got confused by the popular thread "SPOM is death" or something like that. It`s still as effective as it used to be. 2 hours ago, Tab1 said: 5. Steam engine is now feasible (buildable) Steam turbine or steam engine? Now we got steam a rocket engine that is the first step to get rocket research and space materials. The turbine can kinda work but it`s hard to keep it working without exploits. 2 hours ago, Tab1 said: 6. Bathrooms no longer warm up as they don’t hold water (not sure about this one too) so using a closed loop with sieve is better. They did warm up? Anyway a closed loop with sieve will keep them at 40oC even if they still warm up. Water carries too much heat compared to what it would create for it to matter. 2 hours ago, Tab1 said: 7. Showers boost morale? Yes. 2 hours ago, Tab1 said: 8. Converting oil to petrol means losing 50% of oil so its better to convert it to natural gas (which is quite difficult I might add) I think it always worked like this when you used the refinery. Boiling it outside (like using magma heat) grants you 100% petrol. You can boil it further to sour gas that freezed creates nat gas. The same mass of nat gas is a way more effective power source than petrol so some people create setups to convert oil to gas. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1145367 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tab1 Posted January 21, 2019 Author Share Posted January 21, 2019 Hey thanks a lot guys. But ur all replying to my observations. Could u point out some changes that are not listed? Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1145413 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neotuck Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 24 minutes ago, Tab1 said: Hey thanks a lot guys. But ur all replying to my observations. Could u point out some changes that are not listed? Reed fiber is more important as it's needed for paintings creativity effects the speed of painting, not the quality for better quality art you need to promote your artist new decor plants have been added as well as wall pots and hanging pots to display them crown molding and carpet tiles have also been added for improving decor Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1145419 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawnmower Man Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 25 minutes ago, Neotuck said: [...] crown molding and carpet tiles have also been added for improving decor Is the carpet actually better than metal? Because when I looked at the stats, I couldn't figure where I would actually want to use carpet. For RP, I'd put it in the bedrooms and maybe rec, but for minmax, it looks like a big skip. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1145438 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neotuck Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 5 minutes ago, Lawnmower Man said: Is the carpet actually better than metal? Because when I looked at the stats, I couldn't figure where I would actually want to use carpet. For RP, I'd put it in the bedrooms and maybe rec, but for minmax, it looks like a big skip. it's more of an early game vs late game choice Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1145442 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawnmower Man Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 48 minutes ago, Neotuck said: it's more of an early game vs late game choice I think that's too bad, because I think metal would be better in utilitarian areas like industrial sectors, but carpet should give a bigger bonus in the living areas. Like, maybe a +1 morale to bedroom & rec room if they have carpet. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1145470 Share on other sites More sharing options...
KittenIsAGeek Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 5 hours ago, Lawnmower Man said: I think that's too bad, because I think metal would be better in utilitarian areas like industrial sectors, but carpet should give a bigger bonus in the living areas. Like, maybe a +1 morale to bedroom & rec room if they have carpet. That would be nice. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1145551 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tab1 Posted January 23, 2019 Author Share Posted January 23, 2019 So what are the early to mid game power options? I like to have a powerplant running by mid game, so if Ferti Makers are not feasible for power what other option should i go for. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1146069 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xyer Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 Natural gas as main power, hydrogen and/or petroleum as supplement power, and coal as backup power for mid game. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1146071 Share on other sites More sharing options...
beowulf2010 Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 6 minutes ago, Tab1 said: So what are the early to mid game power options? I like to have a powerplant running by mid game, so if Ferti Makers are not feasible for power what other option should i go for. 2-4 hatch farms eating clay from deodorizers (normal hatches) and igneous/sedimentary rock (stone hatches) will supply plenty of coal for power. Supplement this with a natural gas generator or 3 run by your guaranteed 1-2 natural gas geysers. Once you are using crude oil for cooling refineries, you can delete the heat in the coolant by converting it to petroleum and then burn that in a petroleum generator. This is ultimately sub-optimal as once you get to thermium/niobium, you can cook the crude oil straight to sour gas, condense the sour gas to liquid methane then heat the methane back up to normal natural gas and get significantly more power than stopping at petroleum. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1146073 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveSatx Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 On 1/21/2019 at 12:42 PM, Lawnmower Man said: Is the carpet actually better than metal? Because when I looked at the stats, I couldn't figure where I would actually want to use carpet. For RP, I'd put it in the bedrooms and maybe rec, but for minmax, it looks like a big skip. i've got crown molding out of granite with a few gold hanging pots with one of the plants that best matches the ambient in my bedrooms, most of them are at or close to max decor (yes there is a max of 120 decor now) i'd like to point out that igneous, sedimentary and obsidian all share the same values when used. so if you have more of one of them than the other you can swap it out. ceramic is awesome as has been stated, then of course later you get insulation also, where possible i try to have a layer of gas between a hot source and my insulated tiles. the transfer rate between just about any gas and a solid is very low. I've also taken to open ranching hatches and normal dreckos while i use a normal ranch for glossy. i've also started ranching pufts for eggs/meat and a bit of slime but its was just something to try - i hardly think its necessary with 2M food, lol. essentially my shrooms are at about maintenance levels with the amount of slime they make so there's that Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1146077 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tab1 Posted January 23, 2019 Author Share Posted January 23, 2019 OK. Why are stone hatches preferred to normal hatches. Its seems both produce same amount of coal. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1146142 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GemeinerJack Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 Stone hatches can eat igneous rock, which is probably the most frequent stone type you find and you can melt for example regolith, the stuff the meteors on the surface leave behind, into magma and magma in turn cools down to igneous rock. So igenous rock is the most easiest to produce of the stone types (you could get obsidian and sedimentary rock for example from space missions, but flying out into space to collect some rocks while you could go and get some new water, slime, algea, ores, metals, new metals etc sounds a bit underwhelming ) Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1146147 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neotuck Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 51 minutes ago, Tab1 said: OK. Why are stone hatches preferred to normal hatches. Its seems both produce same amount of coal. It's more about what you have available to feed them than the rate of coal you get Most players perfer stone hatches as igneous rock is the most common element in the map Personally I keep them normal because I use a lot of deodorizers to produce O2 for my colony so I have a lot of extra clay Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1146156 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawnmower Man Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 13 hours ago, Tab1 said: So what are the early to mid game power options? I like to have a powerplant running by mid game, so if Ferti Makers are not feasible for power what other option should i go for. If you are lucky enough to have a metal volcano, then running Engie's Tune-Up will give you a cheap 50% boost to your power. If you are running electrolyzers, then using physical filtering or sensor-based filtering will give you net power from hydrogen, and a pretty decent net if you are using Tune-Up. But I'd have to say that NatGas is king, and you should definitely try to find and exploit your geysers ASAP. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1146362 Share on other sites More sharing options...
KittenIsAGeek Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 13 hours ago, Tab1 said: So what are the early to mid game power options? I like to have a powerplant running by mid game, so if Ferti Makers are not feasible for power what other option should i go for. I prefer coal early in the game. Doesn't take much research to get it going, and there's usually a lot of coal in easy reach of your starting biome. You'll want to make sure to research at least smart batteries, or you'll waste a lot of your coal power -- but that goes for any generator. Every generator should have a smart battery controlling its activity so that fuel isn't wasted on power that isn't being used. If I have a nat gas geyser close to my base, then I'll use it at a slightly higher priority than my coal generators. Since the changes that have been made to algae terrariums, I haven't used electrolyzers until I'm getting close to space exploration. This means I haven't been using hydrogen generators. HOWEVER, an efficiently designed electrolyzer setup and a power control station for the hydrogen generator can easily power your entire base until you start routinely using aquatuners and other high-power devices. As for fertilizer makers... their primary emphasis is on producing fertilizer. Natural gas is a useful byproduct, but it isn't the primary product anymore and that has reduced its usefulness. There are other buildings that also have natural gas as a byproduct: The oil refinery and the oil well. Using the 'waste' natural gas produced by these buildings improves their efficiency, but is no longer a solution for powering your entire base. With the addition of steel, niobium, and thermium, it is easy to design a system to produce either petroleum or natural gas directly from crude, making buildings like the fertilizer maker no longer necessary except for producing fertilizer. Granted, the sour gas problem complicates things, but it is still a power-positive solution. Steam generators can also be a good mid-game solution, especially if you have a lot of excess heat that you need to remove, but they're difficult to get set up early in the game. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1146373 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tab1 Posted January 24, 2019 Author Share Posted January 24, 2019 9 hours ago, KittenIsAGeek said: I prefer coal early in the game. Doesn't take much research to get it going, and there's usually a lot of coal in easy reach of your starting biome. You'll want to make sure to research at least smart batteries, or you'll waste a lot of your coal power -- but that goes for any generator. Every generator should have a smart battery controlling its activity so that fuel isn't wasted on power that isn't being used. If I have a nat gas geyser close to my base, then I'll use it at a slightly higher priority than my coal generators. Since the changes that have been made to algae terrariums, I haven't used electrolyzers until I'm getting close to space exploration. This means I haven't been using hydrogen generators. HOWEVER, an efficiently designed electrolyzer setup and a power control station for the hydrogen generator can easily power your entire base until you start routinely using aquatuners and other high-power devices. As for fertilizer makers... their primary emphasis is on producing fertilizer. Natural gas is a useful byproduct, but it isn't the primary product anymore and that has reduced its usefulness. There are other buildings that also have natural gas as a byproduct: The oil refinery and the oil well. Using the 'waste' natural gas produced by these buildings improves their efficiency, but is no longer a solution for powering your entire base. With the addition of steel, niobium, and thermium, it is easy to design a system to produce either petroleum or natural gas directly from crude, making buildings like the fertilizer maker no longer necessary except for producing fertilizer. Granted, the sour gas problem complicates things, but it is still a power-positive solution. Steam generators can also be a good mid-game solution, especially if you have a lot of excess heat that you need to remove, but they're difficult to get set up early in the game. Can someone tell me how did they nerf the fertilizer maker like e,g, is the natural gas coming out of them is low compared to before. Id still like to make a FM> Nat. Gas power plant. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1146568 Share on other sites More sharing options...
abhiraz Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 for bathroom i have mede a loop 1 water tank 1 polluted water tank connected via a water purifier powered via dupes all things are below 1000 w so easily done with 1 manual generator . this setup is useful for later games also for pincha pepper farmingcheck it out here Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1146582 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neotuck Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 6 hours ago, Tab1 said: Can someone tell me how did they nerf the fertilizer maker like e,g, is the natural gas coming out of them is low compared to before. Id still like to make a FM> Nat. Gas power plant. They now emit 10g/s gas so to run a generator you need 9 of them but they use 120 W of power each and that's 1080 W total Natural gas generators only generate 800 W so what you want is impossible, sorry besides they added dirt and phosphorite to the ingredients for fertilizer, if you attempt to spam fertilizer synthesizers you'll run out of dirt fast Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1146657 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasza22 Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 1 hour ago, Neotuck said: 1080 W total Natural gas generators only generate 800 W Well techincally with the engi`s tune up you can get 120W surplus. Assuming 100% uptime on the buff and having unlimited dirt it`s probably still not worth it. The amount of dupe work for it (tune up, dirt delivery) would grant more power using a manual generator. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1146701 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neotuck Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 49 minutes ago, Sasza22 said: Well techincally with the engi`s tune up you can get 120W surplus. Assuming 100% uptime on the buff and having unlimited dirt it`s probably still not worth it. The amount of dupe work for it (tune up, dirt delivery) would grant more power using a manual generator. With tune up that's 920W which is still less than the power needed to run all 9 synthesizers yes when you get down to it, the manual generator is more effective than a Synth>NG>Gen setup Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102010-need-help-with-some-of-the-changes/#findComment-1146730 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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