Help with plumbing

[LordAizen]

I'm trying to make liquid o2 and h2 for rockets and I just can't get past this pesky little problem. The idea is to run super coolant in a loop and if the temp drops run the liquid into an aquatuner through a shutoff. Pretty simple and unoriginal but everytime the loop if filled and there is extra liquid in aquatuner output, the loop stops circulating.

I haven't used bridges all that much and so am unaware of proper way of doing this. What am i doing wrong?

Edit: added the save file.

ForTest.sav

[Yoma_Nosme]

I'm not 100% sure but I think it's this bridge...change it for an automation valve

[babba]

Chrhahahaha, excellent - Respect. That must be the most innovative door build ever

[Lilalaunekuh]

Easy to fix problem

Bridges are prioritized inputs but have lower priority on their ouput.

 

1. Remove the bridge in the upper left corner

2. Move the shutoff valve in the corner with the input inside the cooling loop and the output in the upper left corner.

3. Move your in-pipe temp sensor one tile higher so the sensor is just next to the valve input

[LordAizen]

10 minutes ago, Yoma_Nosme said:

I'm not 100% sure but I think it's this bridge...change it for an automation valve

I just tried it but didn't work. I even completely removed the bridge but still the loop is getting blocked.I've added the save file in the op as well.

 

11 minutes ago, babba said:

Chrhahahaha, excellent - Respect. That must be the most innovative door build ever

 

Wait, am i doing it wrong? I mostly just use airflow tiles but i was doing some work with polluted water as well and didn't want to mess with the vaccuum.

[babba]

Uhhh, im not critizing your build in any way and can not judge how well its working or how to improve on your goal I respect every playstyle, I sometimes get critics for my Factorio mass production play style handling gigatons in debug, wasteful. I respect the faction of players handling every single gramm or kilogramm, 0.0001 celsius and such on their great designs My comment was from a pure visual impact on using lots of doors in such a way.

[Lilalaunekuh]

Ok you marked the false bridge^^

But I am in the mood and will play a bit with your save

(Will upload it soon)

[LordAizen]

10 minutes ago, Lilalaunekuh said:

Easy to fix problem

Bridges are prioritized inputs but have lower priority on their ouput.

 

1. Remove the bridge in the upper left corner

2. Move the shutoff valve in the corner with the input inside the cooling loop and the output in the upper left corner.

3. Move your in-pipe temp sensor one tile higher so the sensor is just next to the valve input

Like so? It's still getting blocked.

[Lilalaunekuh]

 

Running smooth like butter xD

Temp sensor is set to above -252°C

[LordAizen]

6 minutes ago, babba said:

Uhhh, im not critizing your build in any way and can not judges how well its working or how to improve on your goal I respect every playstyle, I sometimes get critics for my Factorio mass production play style handling gigatons in debug, wasteful. I respect the faction of players handling every single gramm or kilogramm, 0.0001 celsius and such on their great designs

 

oh gotcha. Yeah i hate wasting any materials even if it's debug. That being said, I don't mind any criticism from more experienced players It's how we learn, right?

 

5 minutes ago, Lilalaunekuh said:

Ok you marked the false bridge^^

But I am in the mood and will play a bit with your save

(Will upload it soon)

Thank you! this has been bugging me since yesterday and i really appreciate you taking the time

[Lilalaunekuh]

ForTest2.sav

OK here is the save just for fun^^

[LordAizen]

2 minutes ago, Lilalaunekuh said:

Is my picture enought or do you want the save file ?

The pic is enough. It's working perfectly now, thanks!

Was the problem extra liquid in the loop or my bridge placement?

[Lilalaunekuh]

Bridge and shutoff valve placement

Keep the sensor always at the shutoff valve for accurate results

(was just about to post something about you could add the bridge you marked/deleted first again^^)

[LordAizen]

2 minutes ago, Lilalaunekuh said:

Bridge placement

(was just about to post something about you could add the bridge you marked/deleted first again^^)

Thanks! yeah seems like i have a lot to learn but i'm loving this game!

[babba]

2 hours ago, LordAizen said:

Thanks! yeah seems like i have a lot to learn but i'm loving this game!

ONI is awesome ( by accident I first wrote "Factorio is awesome" ). I enjoy ONI more than Factorio.

In Factorio there is players which look into every single resource amount

"Ive just now copied another 20 trains and track builds to get more gigatons of coal for this and that to XYZ."

..."But but your wasting too much electricity with too much railroads, you dont need so many! Make it so and so is much more efficient. What computer have you anyway to run so many trains?".

"Ah ok, thanks for your helpful comment. I followed up your complaint and build another 10 nuclear reactors to power another 100 trains for the job. It looks much cooler now with all the stuff moving, the bugs trying to cross the tracks have no chance as Im using trains as flexible defence wall too". 

[thejams]

21 minutes ago, LordAizen said:

Was the problem extra liquid in the loop or my bridge placement?

Just by looking at it, the extra liquid.  When you are looping like that you need to provide enough room for loop expansion/contraction.  What's happening here is that the liquid coming from the aquatuner has priority, but no room to flow into.

31 minutes ago, LordAizen said:

 

[AndreyKl]

1 hour ago, LordAizen said:

the loop stops circulating

You need to leave a bit of free space, if all pipes are full neither bridge not aquatuner will be able to push liquid.

[thejams]

@Lilalaunekuh well you want the coolant to move constantly, otherwise the wrong packet may get sent to the aquatuner.

[LordAizen]

6 minutes ago, thejams said:

Just by looking at it, yes.  When you are looping like that you need to provide enough room for loop expansion/contraction.  What's happening here is that the liquid coming from the aquatuner has priority, but no room to flow into.

 

Yeah i had an inkling the aquatuner output was causing it but wasn't sure and didn't know how to correct it. Would keep this in mind in future builds.

 

[KittenIsAGeek]

40 minutes ago, LordAizen said:

The pic is enough. It's working perfectly now, thanks!

Was the problem extra liquid in the loop or my bridge placement?

One thing to remember is that if the pipes are completely full, you can sometimes get a pipe blocked problem.  The way your pipes were set up meant that you filled up the bypass and the aquatuner loop, and you had it set so that the aquatuner loop had priority.  This means that when your bypass loop is turned on, liquid couldn't go anywhere.  The aquatuner had priority, so its pipe had to clear before liquid could flow out of the bypass loop, but the fluid from the radiator was flowing into the bypass....  which was waiting for the aquatuner's output to clear.

[crypticorb]

Nobody seems to have mentioned it, but here's a quick breakdown of how bridges make things work:

• Building inputs act as the highest priority for flow. This is true for any building, but bridges are special because they act as pipes, passing the flow onward. If a pipe in a straight line has a bridge input intersecting it, the flow will always prefer the bridge input, up until the bridge cannot pass more onward to the output (pipe full/blocked).
  • One use case for this is creating an "overflow" pipeline for LOX to your rocket, with the bridge pointing toward the rocket. When the rocket is full, the bridge can't send anymore to the rocket and will flow past the bridge.
  • Another simpler use case is for a sieve/washroom loop. Have a 3-way intersection, with the polluted water flowing toward the T-junction from the lavatories, a bridge flowing towards the sieve, and an overflow without a bridge towards a polluted water dump. Once primed, this system will never require more water, it'll actually produce extra water.

 

• Bridges act as a pipe flow "encouragement". This is also true for all buildings that have an input and output, but bridges are special again because they require no power or work to make the movement. They will always pull the packet from the input and teleport it to the output, thus causing flow. You can create an infinitely circulating coolant loop with this method.

 

• Bridge outputs have no preference. With a 4-way intersection of pipes, the packets will often get confused and wobble back and forth, especially at corners. Bridges can be used to force pipe intersections to always flow away from the intersection, instead of getting confused and flowing back and forth, or even back up the source.

[Kelirt]

2 hours ago, LordAizen said:

I haven't used bridges all that much and so am unaware of proper way of doing this. What am i doing wrong?

 

[LordAizen]

32 minutes ago, KittenIsAGeek said:

One thing to remember is that if the pipes are completely full, you can sometimes get a pipe blocked problem.  The way your pipes were set up meant that you filled up the bypass and the aquatuner loop, and you had it set so that the aquatuner loop had priority.  This means that when your bypass loop is turned on, liquid couldn't go anywhere.  The aquatuner had priority, so its pipe had to clear before liquid could flow out of the bypass loop, but the fluid from the radiator was flowing into the bypass....  which was waiting for the aquatuner's output to clear.

Thanks for the explanation. This was extremely helpful. I actually made a change learning from this so that now the aquatuner's output is bridged in meaning it now has lower priority than the main loop. I put in a few more 10kgs more of liquid and the loop is now even better.

Also gave me a couple more ideas!

32 minutes ago, crypticorb said:

Nobody seems to have mentioned it, but here's a quick breakdown of how bridges make things work:

That's an extremely helpful explanation. Especially the part about the the bridge output having no preference. The packet wobbling part is very frustrating to deal with and i've spent quite a lot of time struggling with it.

[babba]

Pipes`n`Bridges - Would you enjoy or find it useful to have 10kg gas pressure on a gas pipe ? The Spaghetti Thread...

 

[LordAizen]

18 minutes ago, babba said:

Pipes`n`Bridges - Would you enjoy or find it useful to have 10kg gas pressure on a gas pipe ? The Spaghetti Thread...

I'd love to see 100Kg liquid pressure emptying pol water from those slime biomes would be so great!