METAL VOLCANOES - MANAGING THE METAL (Using Sweepers)

[Lifegrow]

Hi folks,

Just a quick thread showing a little build I've thrown together for handling the metal from a gold volcano (or any metal volcano).

In this build I'm using a cooled sweeper arm sitting in a little cheeky oil bath, and then cooling the refined metal before dumping it at the end storage place.

Liquid metal flows from the volcano and onto cooling plate - instantly solidifies into refined metal, is then picked up by the sweeper arm and then fed to some receptacles below. These receptacles are sat in a liquid bath which further cools the refined metal to ~20 degrees Celsius - where it gets sent to the final storage area perfectly cooled.

The sweeper/loader oil bath is cooled by an aqua tuner that seems to run for about 3 seconds every 10 cycles or so (depending on how derpy the sweeper arm is being). The rest of the cooling is handled by 3 wheezeworts sat in a hydrogen chamber at the bottom, which maintains both the cooling plate temperature, and also the liquid temperature.

Spoiler

tl;dr : Video.

 

 Hope it helps - Much love.

-Life

[JonnyMonroe]

Personally I solved this by leaving a few tons of water on the volcano. Once it had boiled into steam a thermoreg setup kept it below 120c. The huge thermal mass meant that the temperature only jumped up a few degrees each eruption.

[Lifegrow]

1 minute ago, JonnyMonroe said:

Personally I solved this by leaving a few tons of water on the volcano. Once it had boiled into steam a thermoreg setup kept it below 120c. The huge thermal mass meant that the temperature only jumped up a few degrees each eruption.

So what temperature is your end metal? The whole point of this build was to get refined metal that could be slapped right into a sleet wheat farm if you so desired  

Theres always more ways than one to skin a cat (an awful expression I know) but I chose for my cat (refined metal) to be a controlled 20 degrees Celsius  

[CantBreathe]

Are using tungsten metal plates?

[Lifegrow]

15 minutes ago, CantBreathe said:

Are using tungsten metal plates?

Yeah tungsten metal plates and a single diamond tempshift in the wheeze room. The mech airlock is wolframite and all wiring in hot areas is tungsten also.

Probably should have explained that a little better sorry.

[JonnyMonroe]

31 minutes ago, Lifegrow said:

So what temperature is your end metal? The whole point of this build was to get refined metal that could be slapped right into a sleet wheat farm if you so desired  

Theres always more ways than one to skin a cat (an awful expression I know) but I chose for my cat (refined metal) to be a controlled 20 degrees Celsius  

The rail that the collected metal ran on went through a seperate cooling area and came out a cool 20 degrees at the other end.

I stopped skinning cats after that legal trouble a few years back though.

[Lifegrow]

1 minute ago, JonnyMonroe said:

The rail that the collected metal ran on went through a seperate cooling area and came out a cool 20 degrees at the other end.

It's all the same cooling chamber when it comes to the middle liquid section.

The refined metal cools initially as it's first collected/loaded in the upper oil bath, but the majority of the cooling happens between :

first loader -> first receptacle -> sweeper - > 2nd loader -> end receptacles.

All of that is cooled by the wheezeworts.

 

[avc15]

What I want to figure out is a way to manage this heat extractor (it's not a cooler per se but a superheating unit, though in the end the metal does get cooled):

Volcano empties into chamber (3) pumping its heat into the magma layer. Superheater (1) uses heat from the magma layer only when necessary (when superheater [2] can't keep the steam hot enough for whatever reason) and doubles as a startup boiler.

Usually steam comes from off-screen left in my heat-recovery boiler (which I'm not quite ready to show off yet). If there's hot metal in superheater (2) that one on its own will be able to keep the steam hot enough to run the turbine. Otherwise, superheater (1) will draw energy out of the magma until metal in (3) solidifies. Then I'll send dupes to dig the metal then move it into the compactors at (2). The end result is metal cooled to steam temps by superheating steam.

I need a way to move the metal without letting the high pressure gas [hydrogen or steam experimenting with both] out of (2). All my efforts at making a suitable vacuum door in that 7x2 space have failed so far (with the one here, that pump only lets a few dupes through before breaking). But then, the gas in that chamber is going to be very VERY hot, and I haven't come up with a good solution yet.

 

[Lifegrow]

7 minutes ago, avc15 said:

What I want to figure out is ...

Spoiler

 

a way to manage this heat extractor (it's not a cooler per se but a superheating unit, though in the end the metal does get cooled):

Volcano empties into chamber (3) pumping its heat into the magma layer. Superheater (1) uses heat from the magma layer only when necessary (when superheater [2] can't keep the steam hot enough for whatever reason) and doubles as a startup boiler.

Usually steam comes from off-screen left in my heat-recovery boiler (which I'm not quite ready to show off yet). If there's hot metal in superheater (2) that one on its own will be able to keep the steam hot enough to run the turbine. Otherwise, superheater (1) will draw energy out of the magma until metal in (3) solidifies. Then I'll send dupes to dig the metal then move it into the compactors at (2). The end result is metal cooled to steam temps by superheating steam.

I need a way to move the metal without letting the high pressure gas [hydrogen or steam experimenting with both] out of (2). All my efforts at making a suitable vacuum door in that 7x2 space have failed so far (with the one here, that pump only lets a few dupes through before breaking). But then, the gas in that chamber is going to be very VERY hot, and I haven't come up with a good solution yet.

 

 

I can't make sense of your picture to be honest, so i'd probably advise you make your own thread with a few more detailed pics/save file and stop hijacking this one with something totally irrelevant  

[avc15]

you got me, I apologize. Let's say, it's a similar thing except it "cools" metal inside a hot high pressure gas instead of a cold fluid or by contact in a vacuum chamber (the two things yours does).

Different thread, you got it. I don't think I can use a sweeper anyway, in a bath or otherwise.

[CantBreathe]

That's cool, I'm very interested in a thorough explanation of how temp-shift plates work. I filled a room up with the that was cooling oxygen through weezeworts, the O2 was coming out the other side of the room at 16° before the plates, 26° after installing them. I'll browse your video catalog for any info on this.

 

Thanks

  

[Lifegrow]

27 minutes ago, avc15 said:

you got me, I apologize. Let's say, it's a similar thing except it "cools" metal inside a hot high pressure gas instead of a cold fluid or by contact in a vacuum chamber (the two things yours does).

Different thread, you got it. I don't think I can use a sweeper anyway, in a bath or otherwise.

I'll see your thread when you post it - and I may have a solution for you if you can create space for a sweeper-bath  

3 minutes ago, CantBreathe said:

That's cool, I'm very interested in a thorough explanation of how temp-shift plates work. I filled a room up with the that was cooling oxygen through weezeworts, the O2 was coming out the other side of the room at 16° before the plates, 26° after installing them. I'll browse your video catalog for any info on this.

Thanks  

All temp shift plates essentially do is average the temperature over a 3x3 centred on them. In my case I wanted this because my two tungsten metal tiles are technically in contact with the tempshift plates cooling area.

Without it I might have cooler hydrogen above my wheezes temporarily, but once the liquid metal starts flowing things would soon heat up. With the plate - the entire wheeze chamber is averaged and cooled as one, rather than just the upper levels of gas (if that makes sense?)

[CantBreathe]

So the flaps on the ends of the the plate extend into adjacent tiles, causing all of them to affect each other, is that correct?

How would this affect a hot machine like a battery in an average temp (23°) gas like O² 

[Lifegrow]

9 minutes ago, CantBreathe said:

So the flaps on the ends of the the plate extend into adjacent tiles, causing all of them to affect each other, is that correct?

The AOE it refers to is 3x3 assuming the centre tile is the middle of the tempshift.

Also, fear my mighty paint skills.

[CantBreathe]

So where a weezewort might blow cool air out of (it's top tile or the tile above it), the ts plate spreads that cool air tile's temp around?

Thank you for your patients

[Lifegrow]

8 minutes ago, CantBreathe said:

So where a weezewort might blow cool air out of (it's top tile or the tile above it), the ts plate spreads that cool air tile's temp around?

Thank you for your patients

Spoiler

------------------------------

And with touching plates :

 

 

Figured some pics might explain it better. Even though the heat is localised around the top middle plates - it's "dispersed" to the nearby plates, regardless of if they're touching because of the AOE effect. Basically you don't need to plaster as many plates as you think if you just want an average spread. Obviously more mass is more mass, but if you're looking for quick transference often less is more.

[Whispert]

In a "no debug" map is there another way to create the vacuum around the volcano? Or is using a pump my only option? Seems like that will take forever. These builds are always something I want to try but then I try to execute them and realize it's not as easy as it looks with a dupe workforce.

Thanks for the build @Lifegrow simple and to the point I think I might try this one.

[TheScaryOne]

Since you can see the neutronium blocks under them you can easily plan out the build so that you dig out into vacuum. Just set up the waterlock before cracking in.

[Lifegrow]

6 hours ago, Whispert said:

In a "no debug" map is there another way to create the vacuum around the volcano? Or is using a pump my only option? Seems like that will take forever. These builds are always something I want to try but then I try to execute them and realize it's not as easy as it looks with a dupe workforce.

Thanks for the build @Lifegrow simple and to the point I think I might try this one.

With vacuums - especially ones in hostile areas, you always have the option to build a solid "block" of tiles,then deconstruct them - backing out of the room towards a liquid lock. Obviously in this case the room is only ~50 tiles so outside of debug I'd have just slapped a pump in the oil bath and waited. 

1 hour ago, TheScaryOne said:

Since you can see the neutronium blocks under them you can easily plan out the build so that you dig out into vacuum. Just set up the waterlock before cracking in.

Also ^^^ This is entirely true - most of the difficulty in any build is working yourself back out of the room cleanly - so just plan ahead and you should be fine bud.

 

[TheAlterMind]

Hey, Mate! Cool build - I tried it in a world of mine, but the auto-sweepers show "submerged" and wouldn't work. How come yours work underwater and in oil?

[Lifegrow]

3 hours ago, TheAlterMind said:

Hey, Mate! Cool build - I tried it in a world of mine, but the auto-sweepers show "submerged" and wouldn't work. How come yours work underwater and in oil?

Use just a small amount of liquid else they'll often get the "submerged" status when you relog.

Alternatively you can try to trap a pocket of gas, or mix two liquids on top of the sweeper - that normally works.

[TheAlterMind]

8 hours ago, Lifegrow said:

Use just a small amount of liquid else they'll often get the "submerged" status when you relog.

Alternatively you can try to trap a pocket of gas, or mix two liquids on top of the sweeper - that normally works.

Thanks, but I did pump out all but a few grams of oil and it's still showing the "submerged" attribute. Could it be due to the fact that I'm building/using it in play mode and yours is in debug? Have you actually made one in play mode?

Your alternative solution is not applicable as the top chamber needs to be gasless (vacuum). 

[Kasuha]

23 minutes ago, TheAlterMind said:

Thanks, but I did pump out all but a few grams of oil and it's still showing the "submerged" attribute. Could it be due to the fact that I'm building/using it in play mode and yours is in debug? Have you actually made one in play mode?

Your alternative solution is not applicable as the top chamber needs to be gasless (vacuum). 

Sweepers work up to 300 kg of liquid over them, but the game has a problem recognizing the change. You can either rebuild the sweeper, or save/load the game for the flooded status to be re-evaluated.

[Lifegrow]

3 hours ago, TheAlterMind said:

Thanks, but I did pump out all but a few grams of oil and it's still showing the "submerged" attribute. Could it be due to the fact that I'm building/using it in play mode and yours is in debug? Have you actually made one in play mode?

Your alternative solution is not applicable as the top chamber needs to be gasless (vacuum). 

Yeah i've used it in a few places now. I only use debug for testing, most of my real play time is in normal mode - and nearly all on stream nowadays (don't have as much time to play as I used to!).

The alternative solution was depending on your setup - it's easy to trap a packet of gas, but it depends on how you have your room set out.

[TheAlterMind]

Thanks Kasuha and Lifegrow! Reloading fixed the oil sweeper "submerged" and I drained the water one until it came back to life. My volcano outputs at least twice as much iron as Lifegrow's build and I couldn't manage to cool it down. I ramped up the thermostat in the oil to cool until -10 and added 5 more weezeworts, but the top sweeper gets damaged and the metal plates are simply uncoolable. My water went up to 60C for like 15 cycles. 

The interesting thing I found though was that solids in rail systems are very thermally reactive - I snaked my line of iron through the tiles around an AETN and they were going from 150 to -10C in just a few tiles. The tiles and AETN stayed just as cool after 10ish runs. Should think of ways of exploiting that.