Gas oven

[Vincie]

Well... Why not use natural gas for powering cooking stations? People do it and it works. Just put there an input and make it use gas (like 5g/s), while being used.

[Masterpintsman]

Producing some CO2 in the process...

[Michi01]

The cooking station was actually renamed to "electric grill", which implies that there might be other kinds of grills in the future. If they add a gas grill they could also make it possible to pump any burnable gas into it, although other than natural gas we only have hydrogen currently.
There is also propane in the game's files, and in real life that's actually quite commonly used for grills.

[AlexRou]

How is a gas grill any better/different than using a gas generator with the electric grill? It sounds more like you want to use less gas to power the grill, why not just ask for it to use less electricity?

[Vincie]

Alex, because it would produce CO2. Just an another option.

[AlexRou]

If the only thing different is that it produces CO2 then why would someone want to use the gas grill instead of an electric one?

[brummbar7]

15 hours ago, AlexRou said:

How is a gas grill any better/different than using a gas generator with the electric grill? It sounds more like you want to use less gas to power the grill, why not just ask for it to use less electricity?

irl a gas grill is better because gas produces heat, and if you use it in a process whose goal is heat, you will more efficiently use that gas than you will if you use the same gas to make electricity and then heat.  The irl advantage of electricity is that it's easier to control, easier to distribute, and safer.  The irl advantage of gas is that it's more efficient (at producing heat).  Irl using electricity to produce heat is just about the worst way to use that electricity (assuming you have equal access to gas).  They could reflect this in the game if they wanted.  They could also make a space heater, and tepidizer, that uses gas rather than electricity.  Probably nobody would use those though unless there was also a gas pipe temperature switch (gas pipe switches would be nice as well).  Hell, there are *refrigerators* irl that are powered by gas (these are not efficient though, as producing heat is not their goal).

[AlexRou]

EDIT:
Thought I rewrite my reply.

For gas grills to make sense to me, there would need to be a fire and explosions update. Where gas grills would use less gas but have a higher risk of fire vs higher gas usage through energy generation but much lower fire risk.

Also gas pipes could have a chance of leaking and thus an explosion would be possible anywhere along the pipeline.

Without a fire update, gas grills would just be a more efficient electric grill that functions exactly the same but using gas directly instead of through generators. So I don't see any reason for them to exist in that state.

[brummbar7]

7 hours ago, AlexRou said:

Also gas pipes could have a chance of leaking and thus an explosion would be possible anywhere along the pipeline.

As a couple others pointed out, gas grills could produce CO2.  That in itself would be a significant disadvantage vs electric.  Also stringing a gas line to the grill, vs just plugging into the already-present electric grid, would be another disadvantage.  Random explosions would, imo, be a bad addition to the game.  There's no reason to bring in explosions the player cannot predict or control.

[AlexRou]

43 minutes ago, brummbar7 said:

As a couple others pointed out, gas grills could produce CO2.  That in itself would be a significant disadvantage vs electric.

As I have said before, CO2 by itself feels pretty weak to me. Unless we're talking about a ton (metaphorical) of CO2 a second. Then yeah maybe ...

44 minutes ago, brummbar7 said:

Also stringing a gas line to the grill, vs just plugging into the already-present electric grid, would be another disadvantage. 

If you have a gas line to a gas generator then there would already be a gas pumping system somewhere. How is that a disadvantage? It is just replacing wires for gas pipes.

As for the random explosions ... they could start out as a leak you have to fix or it would go off with some variation in the delay if not a fixed delay. I agree that completely random explosions with no hint would be bad.

[Sevio]

10 hours ago, brummbar7 said:

gas produces heat, and if you use it in a process whose goal is heat, you will more efficiently use that gas than you will if you use the same gas to make electricity and then heat.

This is true in general, but for cooking on a stove it's not so clear cut. A gas stove is only about 40-50% efficient at heating pan, the rest goes into the kitchen or gets vented as waste heat. An induction stove is very efficient at delivering its input power to the pan and generates almost no waste heat, but if it's running on electricity made from gas there's of course a loss at the powerplant and in transmission. Coil based heating is about the same as induction.

I don't see a good case for adding this on its own, but it would fit in as part of a larger fire themed update which makes flammable gases actually burn. (either in a machine or causing disaster in your colony when it catches fire)

[brummbar7]

@AlexRou  Yes, CO2 would not be a huge disadvantage.  But then, the game has a lot of simple mechanics that aren't really that big a disadvantage.  But it would provide some extra design considerations.  You would not be able to put the machine in a pit (I mean you could, but your dupes would be cooking holding their breath), unless you have gas permeable tiles to let the CO2 out.  As for the gas lines, everyone has different base conventions.  For me, I always do my natgas processing entirely outside the base.  So that natgas line to the grill would have to come in, and may interfere with my other gas piping for oxygen and whatnot.  Other people may have different ways of going about things, that make it more or less of a problem.  Again, it's not a huge disadvantage, but it *is* a difference. Electric grills can just be plopped down anywhere, no problem, because you're already going to have electricity all over in your base.  The efficiency differential could be scaled to the disadvantage potential.   All that said, considering that Klei doesn't even consider it worthwhile to allow us to mirror the transformer, I'm definitely not holding my breath for a gas grill, nor will I be sad if it never comes in.  I just think it'd be neat to have.

Random leaks are not a good idea either .  Scanning for random leaks is just another micro-management task that is not going to enhance the enjoyment of the game.  Now, if pipes sprung leaks due to overheating, or other *avoidable* player-caused conditions, that's different (like electrical line overloads - avoidable with proper design).   But random leaks = no fun.

@Sevio Ya, irl there's all kinds of nuances.  My natgas stove heats water up quite a bit faster than my old glass-top range.  More waste heat per second, but less time overall.  Also the kind of griddle depicted graphically in ONI does not lend itself to targeted efficient cooking.  Natgas plants can be in the 30-40% efficient range just to start.  I've read they can be as high as 90% though.  We can debate where a natgas generator that leaks water on the floor falls along that continuum, and whether or not cogeneration can be assumed to be included.  But it doesn't really matter - the basic logic case is there and plenty logical for ONI.  And the game mechanics differentiation could be there, and I think would add interest to the game.   But it's been suggested tons before and it's just a matter of if the devs want to devote the time.  See my above statements for how likely I think that is.

[AlexRou]

@brummbar7

Fair enough, I think I might move the fire talk to a new thread after some thinking.