Should Turf Grass stay how it is or be put back to how it was???

[havoc8362]

like the title say should it stay or should it go, let the players decide!!!

Edited November 30, 2012 by havoc8362

[Nxf7]

If this poll is going to get more attention may I suggest adding in another option along the lines of "Find a middle ground".

That said a poll isn't the best way to handle this. Everyone has their own opinion and that isn't expressed in a poll thread.

[Little Teemo]

yeah i would love a third option also

[NeedPants]

I also would prefer mutliple options. We cant make it exactly like it was b4, it is a LITTLE overpowered perhaps, but the manner in which it was nerfed is harsh. I have however suggested a change in the patch thread here, and im sure other people have put in their ideas aswell.

[havoc8362]

i would edit the poll but it seems i cant i would have to make a whole new thread

[LavaPlume]

-

Edited February 17, 2018 by GrowlitheAppears

[havoc8362]

i think the reason why alot of people hate this nerf is because we do use alot of grass for stuff and having to find poop to make the grass grow just makes it even harder for us all yeah i no you cant expect a game company to make the game easy for us but instead of nerfing the grass nerf something els instead, we relie on grass way too much and doing this nerf is like a big kick in the teeth for some of us.

[OmegaJasam]

This game is in danger of becoming poop centric to the point it gets a reputation for it X_X'.

Perhaps a fertilisation being required to restore a moved patch, to make it slower to set up a static base. But right now I feel the game encourages you to set up near poop and stay there... the opositie of what the patch was ment to do (prevent static defences)

[havoc8362]

well hopefully if this poll goes well and the devs do manage to see this "maybe" just maybe they might it to something different but hey we can only hope

[deskp]

My problem is ahving to do soemnthing for it to grow back,,, I'd prefer if it just regrew slower? IF A NERF REALLY WAS NEEDED.

[havoc8362]

i dont think the nerf was really needed they just wanted to do that to make you work that much harder, yeah you can easy say ok i'll find where the beefalo's are on my map and just make camp there, but not everyone has the luck of getting beefalo's

[LadyD]

The current talk is to change the amount we use grass as well as maintain the Nerf.

If you post your grass usage data in the Hot fix thread then Kevin can get an idea of why we seem to need it so much.

[ArmageddonLove]

I agree with all of the nerfs apart from the one everyone seems to have the problem with, the grass. It seems to me like one pile of manure is much more expensive than one pile of cut grass. Although I haven't investigated if it works the same as berry bushes yet, where they only need fertilised once every few harvests, it still seems a little harsh. Grass is a staple at all stages in the game, from starting your first fire to crafting hats and log suits to keep yourself safe, and I go through a LOT of it, even though I don't have a designated "grass farm" next to my base camp like most players. Fertilising every tuft would take a very long time, and a lot of resources, perhaps we should find a middle ground indeed.

[Oatek]

I had to make an account just to put my input on this, the update is fine. To all the complainers, why are you using so much grass? I hardly use any grass at all. If you want food, use berry bushes, easy infinite food (these need nerfing more). Using it to keep your fires going? Who the hell does that, use logs/acorns instead, with some pigs you can rack up many stacks of logs in one day. Need logsuits? Stop sucking at combat and getting hit all the time. Want to use a bed? Don't! beds should be a luxury, not a necessity, live through the night like a real survivor, you can use that time to farm resources. These are all the complaints I've read so far, and find it disturbing you guys see a nerf, and can't change your playstyle to still survive and instead just whine without using your brain. Oh and the grass shouldn't be changed to grow longer instead, then you would just collect even more grass turfs and the problem is back. Collecting poop means you have to constantly work to get resources, and not idle in the camp having everything grow for you.

[ArmageddonLove]

Oatek you are forgetting that there are different play styles for this game, personally I tend to avoid using pigs, after hearing all the horror stories about Werepigs. The logsuits for me are more for security than "Let's go kill stuff!", for example when I'm out exploring and I get jumped by a pack of angry hounds, when you are being chased by 4 of them at the same time (they are quite fast) the "hit and run" tactic is difficult to achieve, unlike with spiders. If you have a Berry Bush farm, it only takes one Gobbler to ruin that, speaking from experience. I agree that I prefer to use logs for fires than grass, but sometimes the night creeps up on you and I don't have time to gather logs to last the night so I use 4-8 grass to run me through the night. I have never used a Bedroll.

I don't "turtle", I have various camps with firepits, crockpots and chests, but not replanted grass tufts or saplings, does this mean I should be punished for not having a "grass farm" set up? Because as it is, for grass, I now have to walk north to my grass tufts, and spend 1-2 full days wandering around fertilising the dead tufts, and another 1-2 days wandering around behind Beefalo waiting to hear the buzzing sound that tells me its done its business.

So yes, I do have to constantly work to get resources, which is an integral part of the game, but I would like to have some time to be able to go and do other enjoyable and vital things also, digging up graves, mining quarries, killing birds, tentacles, shaving beefalo, gathering much needed food... I find that with the new grass nerf, I spend much more time collecting manure and fertilising grass than I do those other things. Maybe that's just me, but with my personal play style, that is what I find.

[D7X]

I had to make an account just to put my input on this, the update is fine. To all the complainers, why are you using so much grass? I hardly use any grass at all. If you want food, use berry bushes, easy infinite food (these need nerfing more). Using it to keep your fires going? Who the hell does that, use logs/acorns instead, with some pigs you can rack up many stacks of logs in one day. Need logsuits? Stop sucking at combat and getting hit all the time. Want to use a bed? Don't! beds should be a luxury, not a necessity, live through the night like a real survivor, you can use that time to farm resources. These are all the complaints I've read so far, and find it disturbing you guys see a nerf, and can't change your playstyle to still survive and instead just whine without using your brain. Oh and the grass shouldn't be changed to grow longer instead, then you would just collect even more grass turfs and the problem is back. Collecting poop means you have to constantly work to get resources, and not idle in the camp having everything grow for you.

Yeah that's it, tell everyone to play your way because theirs is wrong I'm sure that'll work. People are upset that their way of playing is being nerfed, just because it doesn't affect you doesn't mean it's fine.

It's nice that you don't care though, that means that the game offers enough different styles of play to keep everyone happy. This update however forces people to change how they play. There being a specific way to play what is kind of a sandbox game is frustrating.

[Solnaga]

Has changing grass tufts to be like berry bushes been considered? I like the idea of having to travel to different fields for replenishable resources.

[501105]

Although I like that the game is becoming more challenging, the grass nerf itself has just made it more tedious. Constantly running around collecting or using manure is a must if you want a steady supply of grass and it is just not that much fun.

[ViVi]

i think if you don't dig it up it shouldn't need poop if you leave it in the wild it would be the same as it use to be (pre patch)

[NeedPants]

I had to make an account just to put my input on this, the update is fine. To all the complainers, why are you using so much grass? I hardly use any grass at all. If you want food, use berry bushes, easy infinite food (these need nerfing more). Using it to keep your fires going? Who the hell does that, use logs/acorns instead, with some pigs you can rack up many stacks of logs in one day. Need logsuits? Stop sucking at combat and getting hit all the time. Want to use a bed? Don't! beds should be a luxury, not a necessity, live through the night like a real survivor, you can use that time to farm resources. These are all the complaints I've read so far, and find it disturbing you guys see a nerf, and can't change your playstyle to still survive and instead just whine without using your brain. Oh and the grass shouldn't be changed to grow longer instead, then you would just collect even more grass turfs and the problem is back. Collecting poop means you have to constantly work to get resources, and not idle in the camp having everything grow for you.

Im gonna have to repeat a few things since u didnt find the time to read the whole thread, it is pretty long i have to admit.

First of all, the berry bushes. Ah yes the favourite foodcrop of old. Great foodsource. Could indeed do with more nerfs, but are u aware hellhounds can just set all of them on fire if u make 1 mistake? Apart from being boring as hell to do the same thing again and again, it is best to have alternatives. U can go as far as i do, AND pigs AND farms, but at least one extra reliable foodsource would be a good idea.

Apart from spreading risks, u have another thing to worry about: camp location. Not everyone plays with a basecamp, but for those that do, making berry bushes ur only foodsource immediatly brings with it: u need easy access to manure. This limits ur camp to locations near pigs (inefficent manure producers tho) or beefalo. If ur main foodsource is pigs, u can build a few pig houses anywhere u want, without being limited to specific areas.

As for "who the hell" burns grass on fires, well alot of ppl do, coz they realize how good grass used to be. This is a more complex thing than it could have been due to subsequent nerfs on other things.

Tools: golden tools have been nerfed. Their hitpoints have been brought down to 1/5th of the original value. A HUGE swing from the nerfbat. drastically increasing the quantity of gold needed for continuous tool usage. Grass can be farmed without the use of tools, is plentyful in supply, VERY easy to harvest and can be relocated next to ur campfire to have something to do during the night. Also no treeguards.

Grass is, by far, the superior choice and was therefore due to some nerfs. Making grass the same value as twigs on a fire would have been sufficient since 1 grass=3twigs iirc. U need 10 grass to get the fire to its largest size, that would be 30 with a burnability nerf as i suggested. That would pull the grass on par with wood in terms of time. But it will still favor grass slightly due to no tools being involved. Did u know that collecting 40 grass by holding down space on a grouped up bunch of tufts takes just as long as chopping down 2 of the biggest trees, digging out the trunks and collecting the 8 wood and 4 pinecones? Making grass burn like twigs would also settle the time difference in collecting these 2 potential fire-fuels.

Pre tool nerf, grass was the better choice just coz of the amount of time u saved and the fact that u can collect grass easily at night, having it located right next to ur campfire.

Going back to food to make another point about grass: rabbits. Prepatch rabbits were dead easy to farm, and they are the best choice in terms of what meat to trade for gold with the pigking. They stack up to 40 and u could collect those in a single day on a field with rabbits. Now tho, if u chop 1 the others notice it and run to their little holes. This was a huge nerf. U can still farm 40 rabbits a day tho, but u have to use traps. Quite a few of them. U place them on the little rabbit holes and chop 1 rabbit with ur axe. They all run to their holes and fall into the traps. 1 chop, tons of morsels. The time here is spent on emptying the traps and putting them on new rabbit holes. TRAPS cost a LOT of grass. Time is very important, believe it or not. Ill get back to this later.

Need logsuits?

Son, i am KING dodge over here. Many ppl do not know how to farm tentacles without getting hit, no problem for me. I must be truly awesome. No, thats not it, there is a way to kite nearly every enemy, the exception being werepigs to my knowledge. They are extremely hard to kite. This doesnt take away the fact that it costs alot more time kiting enemies than tanking them. Hounds are easy to kite seperatly, but a pack of them nearly always gets a few hits off on u. U can dispose of them in less than a quarter of the time by facetanking them and holding space with a weapon equipped. That takes some dmg on ur logsuit, but saves a ton of time. Its a tradeoff since u need more time to create multiple logsuits. Whats faster? That varies per situation. When i happen to ahve excess wood, its definatly worth it to facetank my way thru so i dont have to sit there for days.

Beds. They are truly amazing u know. U dont need a lightsource to sleep in a bed. Its very useful when exploring far away from ur camp, since out there u usually dont ahve anything to do at night. Its also alot faster.

Speed is important. It is important so u have more time to enjoy the game rather than farming 20 trees a day. Grass farming as i said is alot faster than farming wood. 10 grass burns as long as 5 logs. Whats faster, grass by a mile. In the first 50-80 days we dont have grass problems and by that time u ahve seen a little bit of everything the game has to offer, and the rest is more of the same. Currently there is no mid- and lategame to this game yet. This will be added.

In the meantime this has been replaced by private projects such as massive pigfarms, treemazes etc. Personal fun and satisfaction, the prime goal of every (good) game. When mid and lategame do arrive, i can guarantee u its not about surviving anymore by sitting in ur base all day farming berries. In fact ur gonna need to be able to stockpile food and such for when seasons come out! Being able to farm 40 morsels a day by spending tons of grass is gonna be worth it when winter comes. Good luck farming 10-15 morsels a day with just an axe.

Also a note to this mid and lategame: needing more grass if the growth time is slower. The point is we WANT to reach a state of self-sufficiency so we can focus on the next challenges the game will offer us. Increasing growth time would make sure we dont reach that state too early so we can faceroll the early game and be overprepared for later.

Hence the most commonly asked solution: increase regrowth time needed and make grass a less potent fuel.

And then ur final point: "collecting poop". Me and many others were astonished by the fact that we are going to need over 20 manure A DAY to keep up our grass farms. I am lucky if i can get my tiny herd that spawned on this map to crap out over 20 a day. And im not gonna sit there EVERY DAY to collect poo. So what if i do use wood for fires, what if i do cut back on traps and stop using bedrolls. Halfing my current grassuse would not half the manure use, since there is farms and berry bushes to consider aswell. So how much manure would we need a day when we half grass usage? 12? 13? 14? Somewhere around those numbers. That is still a RIDICULOUS amount. This means that im STILL going to have to spend over half the days collecting poop.

Stop using traps? Sir the update gave us only a few new technologies and was mainly about hounds. For the new hats and the new weapons u need grass. Grass for the hats, yes definately, they need usually grass and/or rope. Grass for the blowdart? But Pants, the blowdart recipe contains no grass. Yes thank you im fully aware of this. It does contain crow feathers (why not redbird feathers aswell, like both would do. I dont know i would have allowed both tbh). Catching birds is impossible without the use of traps. Then catching the right type of bird can be a game of chance aswell. Unless u do it at the right locations. Redbirds dont go to some places, like bridges. So what ur gonna make 1 trap and get perhaps 2 feathers? (the droprate is quite low, below 50% in my personal experience). Yes 2 feathers is really gonna allow u to test out this new weapon on all the stuff u can encounter. No good sir u need 5-10 traps.

I hope i have managed to shed some new light on this matter.

Regards,

The Pantsless

Edited November 30, 2012 by NeedPants

[CKtheFat]

Why not think about why we don't see super large clusters of crops in real life without fertilization? The soil itself will be depleted of nutrients over time, and a higher concentration of plants means more demands for nutrients.

Why not have a radius-based system where grass will only regrow if it is not competing with other nearby grass? This means that wild grass will regrow without worry, but if you try and move them all together in a cluster, you then have to add manure to counter the overcrowding.

Or maybe grass can be placed into invisible sectors, where only one grass in that sector will regrow at a time. This will have the same effect.

[Bogpad]

• twigs and grass to not become exhaustable until you transplant them (in existing saves, everything counts as not-yet-transplanted, because I wasn’t tracking this before)
  

Guess these changes will make it a lot more easy again, and in addition, one poop lasts for 20 cycles now, so fertalizing should be no biggy anymore.