Should Klei add boss hp bar?

[Bumber64]

1 hour ago, Mysterious box said:

You just explained right here how it makes it easier. An hp bar removes a level of caution and gives certainty to your actions this in turn can make fights feel easier. That being said I'd definitely prefer a visual degrading system but I'm not really bothered with whatever way they go with it be it bars or nothing at all.

It's not easier if they're just going to rollback anyway.

Edited June 30, 2025 by Bumber64

[AliceShiki]

Uhn... I don't think the argument of, "You found out that AFW actually heals because of a healthbar, therefore the fight is now easier" is a logical one. It's simply learning from in-game information instead of from the wiki... Because yeah, I would never figure out that an enemy heals if the enemy doesn't have a visible health bar, I'd just assume the enemy has 100k HP if it refuses to die no matter how much I hit it.

I get the arguments related to phase changes and the like, because knowing when the phase change is about to happen does indeed give you an advantage, but I think the argument related to a health bar letting you know that you failed AFW is pure nonsense. This just a case of the health bar telling you something you'd learn from the wiki or youtube videos otherwise.

As for arguments related to random mobs' health bars creating visual clutter... I mean, mods have had this solved since forever? The enemy only has a health bar if you hover your mouse over it... And in controller, I guess it would only show the HP of your current target.

[cybers2001]

8 hours ago, cropo said:

I'm surprised "health bars make boss fights easier" is taken this seriously; as if knowing a bosses health and having clarity on how well or how terrible you are doing is some kind of critical factor that can sway your chances of beating it. Like in a vacuum I understand that it does make the boss fight easier, but that's like saying adding a droplet of gas to my car is going to make it drive farther.

On the contrary, people always say, "X isn't such a big deal" or "Y wouldn't change much" because they always look at them in a vacuum. "I beat Deerclops, Deerclops is easy. I've beaten Klaus, Klaus is easy." Okay, but what if you're fighting Klaus while Deerclops spawns, kills one of the deer and enrages Klaus, and then your thermal stone goes cold because you were relying on the heat attacks from the red deer that was killed, and then hounds show up, and then...

Like, the whole point of the game is that it's the combination of multiple factors that you have to consider when trying to survive. Every challenge in a vacuum can be solved and solved repeatedly. Subtle information cues can mean the difference between whether or not you are able to adapt to changes in the environment as things happen outside of your vacuum.

Reminds me of once upon a time, a young Glermz lost his base to Bearger. Was it because he could not handle Bearger? No, it's because he wasn't listening for the growls, and had no visual cue from his character because his character was Wes, and so suddenly a Bearger was in the middle of his chest zone. It's easy to take the cues for granted, but you only have to misread the environment one time...

Edited June 30, 2025 by cybers2001

[Antynomity]

Depends on how it's executed it could be the best or worst QoL feature ever added to the game.

If it's diagetic and consists of new sprites added to at least the bosses (doesn't need to be 10 stages like Crab King, could be 4 or 3) it'd be a nice touch, would let new players get to "feel" the health pools of bosses and also add feedback to the player so you know a bit earlier if it's worth going further with the boss or if you underprepared BEFORE you get close to or straight up die.

If it's just a healthbar that appears on the top of the screen... hell no. Just no.

UNLESS we get both, the diagetic part being ever present and the healthbar being part of a new item/tool/armor piece

[JustAPineapple]

I was pretty neutral on the whole thing, but honestly the people giving reasons why the health bar 'makes things easier' really just reads to me as why not having health bars makes a highly phase and knowledge based boss like afw, even more frustrating and unintutive as a boss fight.

So I'm now I'm all for them lol

And something making something "easier" isn't like, an inherent bad thing? I really don't see what of value is lost by adding them besides peoples pride I guess?

[cybers2001]

1 hour ago, JustAPineapple said:

I was pretty neutral on the whole thing, but honestly the people giving reasons why the health bar 'makes things easier' really just reads to me as why not having health bars makes a highly phase and knowledge based boss like afw, even more frustrating and unintutive as a boss fight.

So I'm now I'm all for them lol

And something making something "easier" isn't like, an inherent bad thing? I really don't see what of value is lost by adding them besides peoples pride I guess?

I never said I don't want the game to be easier. I said that we should accept that this ask is an ask to make the game easier and not the same as geo-placement or an emote wheel. The fact that OP himself said that this ask would make the FW fight easier for him is evidence enough of that, lol.

[JustAPineapple]

9 minutes ago, cybers2001 said:

I never said I don't want the game to be easier. I said that we should accept that this ask is an ask to make the game easier and not the same as geo-placement or an emote wheel. The fact that OP himself said that this ask would make the FW fight easier for him is evidence enough of that, lol.

No yeah exactly, I completely agree! That's what I meant to get at, sorry if that wasn't clear.

[Cheggf]

11 hours ago, Queron81 said:

What if the healthbar isn't a bar, instead a certain amount of hearts (maybe 3-7 depending on the total health) just as an indicator without showing the exact (remaining) health. When the boss is hit, the last heart could be shaking. After a certain amount of damage taken, the heart turns grey. So players have some feedback without giving too much information.

You're trying to make compromises without even understanding why people don't want a healthbar. This does nothing to placate the people who know there shouldn't be a healthbar, it's just adding restrictions for the people who want a healthbar. 

8 hours ago, NeoDeusMachina said:

The only thing it does is help making a go/no go decision on whether you should risk fighting on or leave fight. It doesn't make the fight itself easier. The mechanics are the same.

Hp bar doesn't need to show phases, that can be left out to visual cues or roars or whatever. Most bosses who have significant mechanics change between phases already indicate it in some way.

As far as I know, bees aren't bosses. The topic is about boss hp bar not all mobs hp bars.

 

Healthbars don't do anything to make the fight easier? Then we don't need them to be added, since they aren't actually doing anything. Easy fix!

[Clopsy627]

It would be really encouraging to have a visual indicator that I'm actually doing damage on every boss

Edited June 30, 2025 by Clopsy627
Forgot a part of it

[NeoDeusMachina]

2 hours ago, Cheggf said:

Healthbars don't do anything to make the fight easier? Then we don't need them to be added, since they aren't actually doing anything. Easy fix!

Can you read what you quote before replying? And might as well apply some of what you said yourself and try to understand why more people want a health bar instead of what you wrote. Don't bother quoting me again, I won't waste more time replying if that's how it's going to be.

Edit: Just to be extra clear, when I said "the fight itself" I meant the mechanics of the boss, as per the following sentence. It does makes decision making about the fight easier (which is the first thing I stated). I don't care that it's added or not, and if it is, I wouldn't be surprised if it was optional anyway. 

Edited June 30, 2025 by NeoDeusMachina

[Bumber64]

5 hours ago, cybers2001 said:

this ask is an ask to make the game easier and not the same as geo-placement or an emote wheel.

5 hours ago, Cheggf said:

Healthbars don't do anything to make the fight easier? Then we don't need them to be added, since they aren't actually doing anything. Easy fix!

Geo-placement and emote wheel make the game easier since they save time otherwise used for survival. If they don't make the game easier, then we didn't need them to be added since they don't do anything.

Can things ever just be nice to have?

Edited June 30, 2025 by Bumber64

[hyoton123]

Health bars make the game much easier, but I personally like the way it makes the game easier. Yeah it’s skill to track mob health, but I dont like doing it. I’d like a toggle or gatekeeping it behind something (boss kills etc). edit: to be clear, existence of a health bar vastly changes DST. i think the purer experience is playing without it. i just dont like that.

Edited June 30, 2025 by hyoton123

[Mysterious box]

22 hours ago, Bumber64 said:

It's not easier if they're just going to rollback anyway.

This doesn't make sense you could even spin it the other way and say you could give a boss an attack that shaves off your max hp when hit and it wouldn't make the game harder because rollback exists this wouldn't make sense and neither would that.

[Bumber64]

33 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

This doesn't make sense you could even spin it the other way and say you could give a boss an attack that shaves off your max hp when hit and it wouldn't make the game harder because rollback exists this wouldn't make sense and neither would that.

That's completely different because it's not just info. (Never mind that the scrapbook now provides the info for single-form bosses.) Should I be cautious? Let's facetank and get a feel for that.

Schrödinger's health: Being able to see it changes how many hits you need to kill the boss.

Edited July 1, 2025 by Bumber64

[Mysterious box]

7 hours ago, Bumber64 said:

That's completely different because it's not just info. (Never mind that the scrapbook now provides the info for single-form bosses.) Should I be cautious? Let's facetank and get a feel for that.

Schrödinger's health: Being able to see it changes how many hits you need to kill the boss.

Information is key to how you approach gameplay for example if klei removed our health bar are you saying how you approach combat wouldn't change? Even if so do you think that would apply for most people? That certainty greatly influences how people approach combat and this is far more than just looking at the scrap book as most people aren't calculating the bosses hp against their weapons damage and other factors in real time. The scrap book only gives a general sense. The lack of information is very much a form of difficultly.

[Bumber64]

3 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

Information is key to how you approach gameplay for example if klei removed our health bar are you saying how you approach combat wouldn't change? Even if so do you think that would apply for most people? That certainty greatly influences how people approach combat and this is far more than just looking at the scrap book as most people aren't calculating the bosses hp against their weapons damage and other factors in real time. The scrap book only gives a general sense. The lack of information is very much a form of difficultly.

It doesn't change anything because final hits are a very small part of the fight. If you're low on health, but the boss is low on health, it would be rather embarrassing to miscalculate and die at the finish line because you wanted one free hit. There's no substitute for caution.

Send a few pigs in at the start of the fight to surpass all the damage you can do with health info. All that is a drop in the bucket for the actual cheese available, and the near-mandatory item requirements like pan flute.

Edited July 2, 2025 by Bumber64

[thesooz9000]

As a person who plays the game sometimes with health bars and sometimes without, yes they definitely do make fights easier, being ready for a phase change is really good, especially when your in a group and can't count your damage.

[Hungry French]

On 30.06.2025 at 20:53, cybers2001 said:

Я никогда не говорил, что не хочу, чтобы игра стала проще. Я сказал, что мы должны признать, что это просьба сделать игру проще, а не то же самое, что геопозиционирование или колесо эмоций. Тот факт, что сам OP сказал, что эта просьба облегчит ему прохождение FW, является достаточным доказательством, лол.

Thanks to this, a person generally learns that he literally overcomes all your damage and does not have 99999 hp.

[Mike23Ua]

Certain games work better with health bars (borderlands) and certain games that have health bars are far more enjoyable with them turned off (Dead Island 2)

DST is one of those types of games that I wish had Health Bars, I’m fighting enemies that soak up a bunch of damage like Borderlands enemies do, and can also sometimes heal like borderlands enemies do.

Dead Island on the other hand.. is a Zombie game, that by default has health bars toggled to on, and it lets you know that the zombie on the ground still has health left so it isn’t actually “dead dead” yet. I turn the health bars OFF for this game so the Zombies can play dead properly, relying on the extremely realistic highly detailed model damage to let me know that I’m hurting it. (Sorta?)

DST however: There’s no difference in 1 hit to Dragonfly vs 1 more hit to kill her.

So yes game needs health bars.

[Dwight34]

On 6/30/2025 at 9:15 AM, cropo said:

I'm surprised "health bars make boss fights easier" is taken this seriously; as if knowing a bosses health and having clarity on how well or how terrible you are doing is some kind of critical factor that can sway your chances of beating it. Like in a vacuum I understand that it does make the boss fight easier, but that's like saying adding a droplet of gas to my car is going to make it drive farther.

Especially when every single veteran has checked the wiki to know the exact heath value of every single boss anyway.

[Milordo]

1 hour ago, Dwight34 said:

Especially when every single veteran has checked the wiki to know the exact heath value of every single boss anyway.

Never did. Why should I?

[Edible Coal]

i think we think too hard.. klei can just add a new hat that shows boss health, just like gardener hat and hori expander.

i imagine you can optain one in early game for a simple hp inspection, and a upgrade one that shows you the enemy attack cd and even their exact attack range

[Milordo]

2 hours ago, Edible Coal said:

i think we think too hard.. klei can just add a new hat that shows boss health, just like gardener hat and hori expander.

i imagine you can optain one in early game for a simple hp inspection, and a upgrade one that shows you the enemy attack cd and even their exact attack range

This.

 

 

I like.

[RexySeven]

On 6/29/2025 at 10:40 PM, AveHortor said:

I would prefer showing battle damage over the fight, like an indicator that they're below a certain hp threshold.
An example would be Ancient Guardian.

Honestly this is the best compromise. 
You don't have info but at least you can visually recognize the moment when the boss is gonna suddenly start doing some wacky one shot attacks. 

[Cruvimaster]

I think that even if Klei ever put a mod for this, I would still use Epic Healthbar. In fact, I still use Geometric Placement + Geometric Drop.

I'm very familiar with all the signs that the devs leave on the highest HP bosses, like the 4 phases of the Bee Queen or the phases of the Misery Toadstool. But it's fun for me to see the boss's life draining away on my PC screen.

Making a boss easy, for me, is using Wolfgang with Volt Goat Chaud-Froid with Chili Flakes. If people really wanted to make it harder, they would play Wes. In the end, it's all just empty rhetoric, because the player will always come up with a strategy to make a fight easier when it's a difficult boss.