DS, RoG, Shipwrecked and Hamlet in DST.

[Hungry French]

Klei.
Don't Starve Together for almost 10 years now. Over the course of 10 years, you've been adding a lot of new content to make it more fun for players to play in multiplayer.

But your fan base has quite a few solo players who don't play on multiplayer servers either because of ping or because of how the game feels in the command.

10,000 players ( 33% online) play on servers, of which 2,000 play alone.
At this time, the remaining 23,000 players ( 66% online ) They don't play on servers, but play solo worlds or sit in the menu.

At least half of the players play DST alone. Don't you find it strange that you are promoting Together, making updates and balancing aimed at co-op, and at the same time half of the players are playing solo.
Maybe we need to develop Don't Starve Together at least a little bit as a single player game ?

There is Don't Starve, but as you say it was "done" back in 2014, Shipwrecked and Hamlet and Mega Update are just requests and pleas from solo players.

As a result, solo players play DST because it has 10 years of content updates and fixes hundreds of DS bugs.

Klei, half of the players playing solo in DST are wasting your money, don't they deserve attention?
Klei half of the players are playing alone and paying you money, don't they deserve attention or at least a mention? Is there anything you can do for solo players?

And the alone players have literally resigned themselves to your ignoring them. On the contrary, they praise you despite the fact that you are not creating a game for them, but for multiplayer players.

Some players are trying to save themselves with mods that try to make DST look more like DS.

Some of the players who stopped playing DST stupidly went to DS, and even more of those who don't even play DS left, because DST was not created for singleplayer, and DS is literally the DST of 2014.

How can you make DST a solo game and earn money at the same time? Make singleplayer mode for DST as DLC.

What will it be like? Transferring features, mechanics, DS and RoG generations and reworking existing DST content that is not in DS, so that it would look more like a singleplayer.
You can also add Shipwrecked and Hamlet, only for solo worlds, because the servers will not withstand 4-5 world shards and the solo worlds themselves will start working really as solo, not as servers.

Why will players play and buy singleplayer DLC for DST?  Because it provides a unique gaming experience, and many players who have not played DS due to its obsolescence or unwillingness to play solo in multiplayer worlds will try a balanced world for one person, where there is new content and unusually modified content that people have previously seen only in multiplayer.

For players who are used to and like hp creatures like in multiplayer, you can do something like Hard mode - one man army. Then they will be satisfied.

Yes, these are too big ambitions and you don't have confidence that adding something global will pay off and bring you profit.

But damn... Klei, please, at least do something for solo players. See that they exist.

At least make sure that The Lazy Deserter can teleport one player to the local worlds. It's the least you can do for a solo player. Optional solo hp for creatures and bosses can also be done. I'm not talking about boss recycling and generation, but please do something for solo players...

Or at least react in some way that solo players exist... Write something about single players... But it's as if they don't really exist for you.

No, maybe you really have some global plans for solo players. Maybe you've changed the DST somehow or will release a new DS game... But your words are that you need to focus solely on Don't Starve TOGETHER... Makes hope for singleplayer as something that was finished in 2014...

And DST will always welcome multiplayer players with open arms, and singleplayer players will only be allowed to be present here... Is this really how it will stay with the latest DST update and installation of its production? The multiplayer game will lose online... Many DST issues have not been fixed... The game will be designed for multiplayer, but there will be no one to play with...

DST will be done just as DS was done... Although DS lived much less...

One question Klei.

If I want to play DST, but I have no one to play with and I can't play with other people because they're too far away and I have a huge ping... and just single survival warms my soul more...

What can I do to play DST as if this game hadn't had the multiplayer feature since 2014?

...

One day JoeW say :

"Sure, if you aren't thrilled about what DST is doing right now, you should say so. But it's not the end of the world, and who knows what we'll be doing next year?"

Well... I want to see what DST will do this year JoeW... and I'm not the only one...

[Mr.Oshiro]

Please stop making these selfish demands, this game serves more than just you.

[Hungry French]

2 hours ago, Mr.Oshiro said:

Please stop making these selfish demands, this game serves more than just you.

Yes, but a man. What's wrong with expecting Klei support for singleplayer players?

[gaymime]

klei made a multiplayer game. they did not say "no solo players" and you assumed that because klei did not say "no" to you that klei is obligated to give you things that goes against the entire ethos of the game at a cost so high it could never be justified.

 

i cannot eat wheat but it would be silly of me to go into a bakery and demand the bakers stop making bread because of all the gluten-intolerant people who want food but can't buy it from that specific bakery so the bakers need to start making kababs instead.

 

your desire is valid but your demands are wholly unreasonable.

[Hungry French]

16 minutes ago, gaymime said:

klei made a multiplayer game. they did not say "no solo players" and you assumed that because klei did not say "no" to you that klei is obligated to give you things that goes against the entire ethos of the game at a cost so high it could never be justified.

 

i cannot eat wheat but it would be silly of me to go into a bakery and demand the bakers stop making bread because of all the gluten-intolerant people who want food but can't buy it from that specific bakery so the bakers need to start making kababs instead.

 

your desire is valid but your demands are wholly unreasonable.

Baker will start cooking kebabs if he realizes that a lot of his customers want kebabs.

Yes, Klei didn't say "no solo players", but they didn't say "yes solo players" either. Klei just ignores singles players in DST for 10 years. DS has received only 1 QoL in 5 years, tell me is this something and not worth complaining about? Not a few people complain about DST content updates that they are boring or unnecessary, but lol multiplayer gets content updates every 4 months, and the solo player. Nothing...

43 minutes ago, gaymime said:

your desire is valid but your demands are wholly unreasonable.

Well, many people demand something from Klei. Why can't I even ask for a micro change to make DST more like a solo game?

Klei created a multiplayer game, but the fact that it is played by single players, their half of the community, and Klei does not interact with them in any way... It's a little weird...
Is not it so?

Of course, there is a trump card up your sleeve for solo players... But DS New Home is now more like a Silksong situation... It's unclear if another solo game will be released...

[Mike23Ua]

To be fair: In a perfect world.. DS, RoG, SW & Hamlet WOULD be part of DST, because… and I don’t know how many times I have to repeat saying this: DST is NOT its own game, and it was sold as a “standalone expansion pack” to the single player game.

Now for anyone who does not understand what this means: It’s Red Dead Redemptions Undead Nightmare DLC or GTA 4’s Lost T&D or BoGT.

DLCs FOR the base game, that… Did not require you to own the base game to purchase or play separately but if you DID own the base game usually added new perks into other areas of your gameplay (mostly just clothing, weapons, vehicle options or mini games you otherwise wouldn’t have access to.)

I wish DST was compatible with the other DLCs I’ve bought and because I’m always grinding skins in DST- rarely if EVER get to play and enjoy.

But I’m not going to stomp my foot and demand it. I’ll just ask politely.. wait a few years & see if they surprise me with it eventually.  

[Hungry French]

8 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Честно говоря, в идеальном мире... DS, RoG, SW и «Гамлет» были бы частью DST, потому что... и я не знаю, сколько раз мне придётся это повторять: DST — это НЕ самостоятельная игра, она была продана как «отдельный пакет дополнений» к одиночной игре.

Теперь для тех, кто не понимает, что это значит: это дополнение Red Dead Redemptions Undead Nightmare или Lost T&D или BoGT для GTA 4.

Дополнения к основной игре, которые… не требовали, чтобы у вас была основная игра, которую нужно было покупать или проходить отдельно, но если у вас была основная игра, то обычно добавляли новые возможности в другие области игрового процесса (в основном это была одежда, оружие, транспортные средства или мини-игры, к которым иначе вы бы не получили доступ).

Я бы хотел, чтобы DST была совместима с другими купленными мной дополнениями, потому что я постоянно зарабатываю скины в DST и редко, если вообще когда-либо, играю и наслаждаюсь.

Но я не собираюсь топать ногами и требовать этого. Я просто вежливо попрошу... подожду несколько лет и посмотрю, не удивят ли они меня в конце концов.  

Well Mike.
Or in an ideal world, Together would be part of DS (as the developers originally planned). But alas, this is not the case.

I agree with your words, and to tell you the truth, I don't really enjoy DST either... Log in to the game daily to collect skins... Not the most fun thing to do.

I don't want to demand anything from Klei. But I'm just offended...

That singleplayer is not developing in both DS and DST, and this is despite the fact that half of the players are singles...

Expectation... It's been exhausting for years... Silksong fans and New Home fans understand this...

19 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

To be fair: In a perfect world.. DS, RoG, SW & Hamlet WOULD be part of DST, because… and I don’t know how many times I have to repeat saying this: DST is NOT its own game, and it was sold as a “standalone expansion pack” to the single player game.

Now for anyone who does not understand what this means: It’s Red Dead Redemptions Undead Nightmare DLC or GTA 4’s Lost T&D or BoGT.

DLCs FOR the base game, that… Did not require you to own the base game to purchase or play separately but if you DID own the base game usually added new perks into other areas of your gameplay (mostly just clothing, weapons, vehicle options or mini games you otherwise wouldn’t have access to.)

I wish DST was compatible with the other DLCs I’ve bought and because I’m always grinding skins in DST- rarely if EVER get to play and enjoy.

But I’m not going to stomp my foot and demand it. I’ll just ask politely.. wait a few years & see if they surprise me with it eventually.  

Mike. Do you watch ambassador's streams for skins?

[Bumber64]

50 minutes ago, Hungry French said:

That singleplayer is not developing in both DS and DST, and this is despite the fact that half of the players are singles...

Ah, yes, DST singleplayer plays exactly the same as it has for the past decade. Even the skill trees are multiplayer only.

[Well-met]

nothing from SW or Ham would work-out-of-the-box for DST. It needs proper multiplayer optimizations and even rewrites.

It wouldn't be as easy as you think it is. It'd take a huge amount of time and ressources for klei to port them. 

They're also never going to do it since SW and Ham are literally the only reason for DS1 to exist, which means extra sales.

[Echsrick]

with what boss are you stuck with? have you tried lots of gun powder?

[Cheggf]

I'd much prefer a re-separation of the ruins & caves over them just lazily porting over existing content. 

[Anis5240]

3 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

lazily porting over existing content

meanwhile big worm is just discount pugalisk

[Cheggf]

32 minutes ago, Anis5240 said:

meanwhile big worm is just discount pugalisk

I've never complimented that.

[DegenerateFurry]

I'm gonna respond to the points you're making in a summarized fashion to save on post length a bit.

• Don't Starve Together was designed as a multiplayer game, and that's an issue when a lot of its players play alone.

This is true. There are some things in DST (such as the designs of certain raid bosses) that aren't designed with solo players in mind, and I'd like to see at least some world settings options to change that, if not reworks of those bosses to make them more doable for solo players while still being fun for groups (which is possible because the Twins of Terror/Celestial Champion/Nightmare Werepig/Frostjaw/Dragonfly all do it). 

• Because Don't Starve Together was designed as a multiplayer game, it's unfriendly to solo players.

Not exactly. There are some mechanics that I feel are unfair to solo players (like how butterfly spawning is way more powerful if you have more people), but for the most part, the game's fine solo (though, again, some raid bosses could maybe use some tweaks to their mechanics if only one player is present as a world setting option). 

• Klei should make a solo DST DLC that reworks things like health values and worldgen to be more in line with Don't Starve, adds Shipwrecked and Hamlet, and can only be played solo.

I do not want this to be how Shipwrecked and Hamlet get added if they ever do officially. If I wanted to play those with solo DS mechanics and health values, I'd go play solo DS. I am much happier having Shipwrecked and Hamlet through Tropical Adventures, because it adjusts health values and even some mechanics to be more DST-like, and it lets me configure stuff and have it all in one massive world. Shipwrecked and Hamlet becoming part of DST, if it ever officially happens, should be an at least year-long update path each where the DLCs are revitalized for modern Don't Starve Together and are made to meet its standard of complexity and challenge.

One thing that does need to change is the way the ruins generate, though - they need to be made to generate more like DS ruins did. There's a mod for that and it does a great job, they feel a lot more coherent and threatening. 

• It should be restricted to solo for performance reasons because we'd need to use shards.

Firstly, that's not fair to people who have powerful-enough computers to host it regardless of performance issues.

Secondly, no, we don't need to use shards. That mod I linked lets you just put Shipwrecked and Hamlet into a DST world that has a full-sized mainland and lunar island. It does this by simply making the ocean really big. It does take a long time to generate the world, but that's a small price to pay.

• Lazy Deserter is useless for solo players.

Pretty much true, yeah. Klei really should do something like with Year of the Carrat where if there's nobody to use it with, you can just get a shadow dude on the other end to teleport to. 

• DST will die if Klei doesn't start catering more to solo players.

...no, it won't. DST won't die until Klei stops updating it. It's a good game, they're always adding more to it, and they listen to their playerbase for suggestions and feedback when they're working on updates. While I do think they could show a little more consideration for the considerable solo playerbase (like letting us tone down things like the amount of woven shadows Fuelweaver spawns and the amount of grumbles Queen Bee spawns in settings, or making it scale based on nearby players), playing solo is by no means a terrible experience. 

• What can I do to get a solo experience?

Install mods. Don't Starve Alone is a popular one.

[Frosty_Mentos]

-Use hamlet and shipwrecked mods. Use Don't Starve Alone mod for DST to reduce lag and such when playing solo.

-Singleplayer won't pay Klei's bills or staff anymore. That game is finished and there's nothing they can add to do more. DST runs on a reworked and much much different engine, doing same thing to singleplayer will cost enormous amounts that won't be sustainable for them.

-Hamlet and Shipwrecked are designed as singleplayer intended worlds. They have zero multiplayer aspects and would need big amounts of reimagining to redo them entirely. HAM and SW have so much content and assets to integrate that would probably take too much time to do so. Reason why they made DST have it's own ocean pond.

-DST takes up a lot on keeping two servers running (surface and caves) which adding two more shards would basically require too massive of a computer upgrade for everyone to have.

You wishes are acknowledged but they are ridiculously unreasonable.
Klei can't deliver this nor that they should.
We have a splendid modding community that handles that already.
There's no way that DST can support those worlds in how they're designed nor has the content to justify having them.
DST in general is a different experience all focused on the current worlds we have that still may need more work as well as to do something to sate community's craving to explore more lands and have more adventures. There's bigger focus on DST than DS from both community and developers.

[Mike23Ua]

Alternatively… instead of selling me skins for things like bush hats that change the hat to look like a type of bush that isn’t even in the game…..

Klei can instead sell me skins that I can change from the world generation and settings menus prior to loading into a game world that lets me change the appearance of things like bushes, trees, or replace certain mobs with their variants from SW or Hamlet.

Crabbit is just a cleverly reskinned Rabbit that serves most of the same function.

I could easily see people who own SW/Hamlet gaining a whole mess of new configuration options (skins) such as being able to clean sweep DSTs Palmcone Trees to look like SW ones.

These are things that I’ve noticed while playing Minecraft, how for example you can install a “Mod” that changes the appearance or behavior of a certain mob replacing it with another etc…

And with that menu we have with little picture icons of literally almost every single mob, tree, resource etc that can spawn in DST- We’re already HALFWAY there.

[Hungry French]

11 hours ago, Bumber64 said:

Ах, да, DST singleplayer играет точно так же, как и в течение последнего десятилетия. Даже деревья навыков доступны только для многопользовательской игры.

There is more content, but it is created and balanced not for one player, but for several players.

10 hours ago, Echsrick said:

С каким боссом вы застряли? Вы пробовали много пороха?

Bosses are not a problem. Well, apart from the fact that they are very long and boring and require literally a grind for a solo player and extremely ridiculous strategies.

11 hours ago, Well-met said:

Ничто из того, что есть в SW или Ham, не будет работать в DST «из коробки». Ему нужны надлежащие оптимизации для многопользовательской игры и даже переписывание.

Это будет не так просто, как вы думаете. Клею потребуется огромное количество времени и ресурсов, чтобы перенести их.

Они также никогда этого не сделают, потому что SW и Ham — буквально единственная причина существования DS1, а это означает дополнительные продажи.

DST will earn much more simply because few people need Shiprect and Hamlet even in DS, because they are old, unfinished and have little content even against the background of RoG. And DST has a much larger player base. DS sales don't mean much anymore because of Klei's policy

[Hungry French]

5 hours ago, Frosty_Mentos said:

-Use hamlet and shipwrecked mods. Use Don't Starve Alone mod for DST to reduce lag and such when playing solo.

-Singleplayer won't pay Klei's bills or staff anymore. That game is finished and there's nothing they can add to do more. DST runs on a reworked and much much different engine, doing same thing to singleplayer will cost enormous amounts that won't be sustainable for them.

-Hamlet and Shipwrecked are designed as singleplayer intended worlds. They have zero multiplayer aspects and would need big amounts of reimagining to redo them entirely. HAM and SW have so much content and assets to integrate that would probably take too much time to do so. Reason why they made DST have it's own ocean pond.

-DST takes up a lot on keeping two servers running (surface and caves) which adding two more shards would basically require too massive of a computer upgrade for everyone to have.

You wishes are acknowledged but they are ridiculously unreasonable.
Klei can't deliver this nor that they should.
We have a splendid modding community that handles that already.
There's no way that DST can support those worlds in how they're designed nor has the content to justify having them.
DST in general is a different experience all focused on the current worlds we have that still may need more work as well as to do something to sate community's craving to explore more lands and have more adventures. There's bigger focus on DST than DS from both community and developers.

- Don't Starve Alone is a good mod, but it doesn't come close to the level of responsiveness and operation of real local worlds DS.
Hamlet and Shipwrecked are incomplete mods, and you can't navigate between them and the main world.

- Klei can create a singleplayer in DST instead of transferring content to DS.

- DS and RoG are designed as single player intended worlds. And Klei was not too lazy to make them in DST...

-Klei could have made local worlds, but alas, a single-player game has not been thought about since the creation of DST, so we will not get local worlds in the next 10 years.

Why do they pay more attention to DST - money? Why do DST have a different gaming experience? - this is the multiplayer version of DS.
Is this a good gaming experience? Logically, it's wrong and doesn't meet the standards of a single player, but someone might like it.

And I'm not asking for DS lol. We are talking about a solo game for DST.

 The generation, mechanics, servers, and behavior of the creatures are what makes DST a disgusting experience and doesn't match a decent one. 
a single player gaming experience.

And it's impossible to fix it with mods, and creating your own is torture... I don't have time to spend 24 hours a day learning modding and then there will be even less time, moreover, there are really few modding manuals and the difficulty increases 10 times more alone. In addition, some things are hardly possible to create without literally writing a mod that translates DST to another engine... And this requires a whole team of developers...

[Frosty_Mentos]

5 minutes ago, Hungry French said:

-

there's local mode we can select for the game though. It's maybe not fully optimised as singleplayer cause of server running but it's because it's different game with different engine.

They could do it but why do they or we care about it? I'm all for making performance solo better but I don't really care about Shipwrecked or Hamlet because they're just that half baked compared to the full DST experience.

Until they're done with mainland's content or have new tech implemented into DST to support more worlds I don't really see a point to this argument but us just be put for a wait.

What I do see is you complaining something about not getting attention for being a singleplayer person and not getting what you want. Sorry to hear that and that sucks, but also 'oh well. Anyway.'

[Hungry French]

4 hours ago, Frosty_Mentos said:

there's local mode we can select for the game though. It's maybe not fully optimised as singleplayer cause of server running but it's because it's different game with different engine.

They could do it but why do they or we care about it? I'm all for making performance solo better but I don't really care about Shipwrecked or Hamlet because they're just that half baked compared to the full DST experience.

Until they're done with mainland's content or have new tech implemented into DST to support more worlds I don't really see a point to this argument but us just be put for a wait.

What I do see is you complaining something about not getting attention for being a singleplayer person and not getting what you want. Sorry to hear that and that sucks, but also 'oh well. Anyway.'

Technically, local worlds are no different from servers. Well, besides the fact that the players get the opportunity to enter your world. And maybe with a password.

Many players want Shipwrecked and Hamlet, and Klei didn't add them just because they think it might divide the players... Although some of their decisions divide the players anyway...

I'm not even offended for myself, but for the solo players in general. And it makes sense.

Instead of supporting DS, Klei supports only DST, which is why solo players must come to terms with lags, changes in generations, mechanics, and new content off-balance for multiplayer.

We literally made a solo game and it wasn't as close as it was in DS and this... It sucks.

Someone thinks about hearing singleplayer only about hp creatures and bosses, but lol here you can make a huge list considering each component of the game.

For example, I don't like the fact that the caves in DST have become more cozy and bright. There is more food, light, biomes are huge, and exploring caves is far from the most interesting activity, and this is especially true for DST.

Maybe someday I'll make a post with a full comparison of all the changes that make the DS game better for solo and why some of the content is clearly not done correctly and does not meet the DS standards.

[Echsrick]

7 hours ago, Hungry French said:

Bosses are not a problem. Well, apart from the fact that they are very long and boring and require literally a grind for a solo player and extremely ridiculous strategies.

using 80 gunpowder to kill fuelweaver is realy not that big of a problem to grind for, you even get free eggs during winter to let them rot

[Hungry French]

Just now, Echsrick said:

использование 80 единиц пороха для уничтожения огненного муравьеда на самом деле не такая уж большая проблема, вы даже можете получить бесплатные яйца зимой, чтобы они сгнили

I know. I killed him without gunpowder... But I still don't like him the way he is. Completely unbalanced for a single player game.

Although from a design point of view, one of the best bosses imbued with the atmosphere of the original Don't Starve. And why Wilson didn't fight him in RoG...

[Echsrick]

1 minute ago, Hungry French said:

Completely unbalanced for a single player game.

you do realize that this is not realy a single player game right?

[Hungry French]

51 minutes ago, Echsrick said:

you do realize that this is not realy a single player game right?

Yes...But...

I just want to Don't Starve Onegether, where for Wheeler I can fight against a huge giant skeleton giga chad who will address me, and not several characters at the same time.

And maybe he would even have lines for the Iron Hulk suit and Ancient Herald armor...

[Echsrick]

6 minutes ago, Hungry French said:

Yes...But...

I just want to Don't Starve Onegether, where for Wheeler I can fight against a huge giant skeleton giga chad who will address me, and not several characters at the same time.

And maybe he would even have lines for the Iron Hulk suit and Ancient Herald armor...

use 80 gunpowder, thats how i killed fuelweaver alone