Allow for Bearger to be summoned?

[nimzowitsch10]

Right now the earliest you can get a spark arc is second autumn which is around day 75. This is because you have to wait for bearger to spawn.

Idk about everyone else but I am not a fan of restricting certain items behind certain days. Everyone disliked that pearl used to be summer locked, I feel the same way about spark arcs.

There should be a way to spawn bearger the same way you can spawn deerclops using a special item like hostile flare. Maybe a craft that requires fallounders that attracts bearger (cuz that's an autumn fish).

That way people can just farm plenty of arcs during winter and you don't have to keep waiting year after year to keep killing the mutant bosses. And yes I think the item should be allowed to be used in winter. The drawback is your fighting a yawning bearger which is pretty damn hard.

Thoughts?

[Well-met]

you can change bearger's spawns in the worldgen. There can even be 2 alive at once with "Tons".

[AliceShiki]

 Hostile Flare should be capable of spawning a Bearger in Autumn, I'd say. That's the simplest solution.

I mean, it's kinda odd that it can spawn Deerclops, but no other seasonal bosses... Like, sure, can't spawn Antlion because Antlion doesn't move, but Bearger and Moose/Goose should be fair game for the Hostile Flare.

[DegenerateFurry]

Honestly, I don't get why the hostile flare doesn't summon Bearger already. I can kind of get why it can't summon Moose/Goose (since those stick closely to their nests and are territorial, not aggressive), but Bearger's the sort of mob that wants to eat everything. Wouldn't it want to eat up the leftovers from whatever big battle a hostile flare might indicate? 

[Cassielu]

Please don't turn Bearger into another Deerclops, they should keep the uniqueness of their own cycle, turning everything into summon and kill is really uninteresting.

Adding another way to get spark arc would be even better.

[DegenerateFurry]

6 minutes ago, Cassielu said:

Please don't turn Bearger into another Deerclops, they should keep the uniqueness of their own cycle, turning everything into summon and kill is really uninteresting.

Adding another way to get spark arc would be even better.

Bearger and Deerclops were basically the same in how you'd encounter them up until the hostile flare was added. Many players don't even use the hostile flares, so they're functionally the same for a lot of players. They're both bosses that spawn once naturally during a specific season, give you warning first, have roughly similar amounts of health, do AoE attacks, and drop something that's useful for the next season in the cycle (hibearnation vest for winter and eyebrella for spring respectively). Their roles are extremely similar, with the only difference being that while Deerclops is programmed to actively destroy your base if he spawns near it, Bearger targets food sources. 

There being as much of a difference as there is between them now is something that changed in the One For the Books update in August 2022. For most of this game's history, that difference has not existed. It would simply be a quality-of-life change to make them very slightly more similar (in that they can both be summoned with hostile flares) again. 

[BezKa]

Hostile Flare is the first thing I have ever truly hated when it was added. I wish it didn't exist

Other ways to get spark arks would be better than ruining another boss's unique spawn mechanic

[Cassielu]

30 minutes ago, DegenerateFurry said:

There being as much of a difference as there is between them now is something that changed in the One For the Books update in August 2022. For most of this game's history, that difference has not existed. It would simply be a quality-of-life change to make them very slightly more similar (in that they can both be summoned with hostile flares) again. 

You may have misunderstood me: Hostile Flare is one of the worst changes you can make to Deerclops, to me it's done more damage than improve, i don't want it happen to Bearger or anythings again.

[reddocc]

Summon able bearger is the thing I need to never have to chop trees ever again

[DegenerateFurry]

34 minutes ago, Cassielu said:

You may have misunderstood me: Hostile Flare is one of the worst changes you can make to Deerclops, to me it's done more damage than improve, i don't want it happen to Bearger or anythings again.

How exactly has it been harmful? They're an entirely optional feature you have to go out of your way to make and use. They change nothing else about Deerclops.

[AliceShiki]

42 minutes ago, BezKa said:

Hostile Flare is the first thing I have ever truly hated when it was added. I wish it didn't exist

Other ways to get spark arks would be better than ruining another boss's unique spawn mechanic

36 minutes ago, Cassielu said:

You may have misunderstood me: Hostile Flare is one of the worst changes you can make to Deerclops, to me it's done more damage than improve, i don't want it happen to Bearger or anythings again.

Honest question, what do you two dislike about it?

Like, from my perspective it's just an item that guarantees everyone in the team gets an Eyebrella.

So uhn... Yeah, I'm curious. What do you dislike about it? I don't see much reason to dislike it in the first place.

The reason I'd want Bearger from Hostile Flare would be similar, as it could let us get a Hibearnation Vest on first Autumn. As in... Seasonal Autumn Boss actually giving us an item to prepare for Winter, instead of giving us an item long after we don't need it anymore.

[BezKa]

8 hours ago, AliceShiki said:

Honest question, what do you two dislike about it?

Deerclops is a seasonal boss that appears in Winter. It's purpose is to ruin your game so far, come into your base and destroy it, or if you know how it works to chase you out and force you into the cold. You can approximate when it's coming after the first year, but you won't be sure until then. Hostile Flare transforms it into a raid boss with % chance of spawning from an item.

The McTusk family are a source of two very good items, especially in early game. The trick is, they only appear in Winter, in one (or four) very specific spotsso you have to put yourself in danger by either basing near their camp, or leaving your base during the harshest season of the game to fight them. Hostile flare brings them right to your door and you can fight them in your back yard.

Monkey raid summoning is cool.

Those are the functions of the Hostile Flare, and notice how two of them completely destroy the point of the mobs they're affecting. There are many measures in the game to stop players from huddling up in base and just surviving forever in there (hounds, sinkholes, Deerclops, Bearger etc etc) and hostile flare defeats two of them for no reason. It's not like the materials to get the flare are super hard to get or incentivise you to leave your safe spot in Winter.

But let's say you don't care about all that, or immersion, or established lore, or stuff like that. The argument truly is (and has been since the thing was added) that everyone can get the eyeball and the cane asap and that's good and we should be able to.

I say that it's part of the multiplayer experience to have shortage of certain stuff. When you play alone everything you get is for you to use. When you play with other people you either share or fight for who gets the stuff. Like in real life!

If you disagree with me on that point we found where we see things differently and can agree to disagree, especially since the flare has been in the game for years(?) now and it's not like an argument will get the thing removed.

Any other arguments for the Flare are just transforming the "I want no limit on good drops" sentiment, so I'm not gonna discuss them because you already know my opinion on that.

 

 

And summoning Bearger, aside from turning the only other boss that seeks you out into a raid boss, is the exact same sentiment except it's drops aren't nearly as good and that's why there hasn't been that many people asking for it.

9 hours ago, AliceShiki said:

The reason I'd want Bearger from Hostile Flare would be similar, as it could let us get a Hibearnation Vest on first Autumn. As in... Seasonal Autumn Boss actually giving us an item to prepare for Winter, instead of giving us an item long after we don't need it anymore.

Bearger doesn't appear in first Autumn for a reason (you're supposed to be in early game and setting everything up) and having a drop for Winter on the very first year doesn't make sense as the first Winter is one of the bigger challenges in the game (imo) and is supposed to be harsher than later when you have better gear. Kind of like hounds are easy, then get harder, and then get easier again as you have access to better weapons. Autumn is easy, Winter is hard, gets harder with Deerclops and ice hounds, and next year Autumn gets harder from Bearger but Winter gets easier because you got a hibernation vest or maybe the scale furnace.

It makes sense in my head but if I'm actually speaking nonsense then sorry.

[cropo]

Being able to summon Bearger would seem a bit unfair, seeing as it is the greatest tree-chopper in the game. You could just call one out in the spot you pick, have it lawnmower your entire pre-planted set of trees and have thousands of wood pieces on demand. 

Plus, judging by their personalities the Deerclops is aggressive by nature and wants to destroy everything, so it would make sense shooting a giant flare into the sky basically crying "There are people here to kill!" is going to attract it.

The Bearger is a lazy doofus who just wants some good food, is not hostile to the player, and takes naps a lot.

[arubaro]

11 hours ago, DegenerateFurry said:

Bearger and Deerclops were basically the same in how you'd encounter them up until the hostile flare was added

Except deerclops wanders to find something to destroy while bearger simply looks after food. Doesnt make sense to attract bearger with a flare

If anything they could add more mobs and these plus bearger could be attracted with a giant cornucopia filled with food but the flare is simply another low quality mod like band aid fix and we dont need more of that

[AliceShiki]

10 hours ago, BezKa said:

It makes sense in my head but if I'm actually speaking nonsense then sorry.

Oh, it made complete sense. Thank you for clarifying your view on all that!

And yeah, I agree that Bearger not appearing in first Autumn makes sense as it's the season you're meant to be preparing stuff and the like. I just figured it would be nice to have this options for experienced players who don't struggle with their first winter and the like.

Still, I definitely understand your line of thought and it makes complete sense! And I agree that stuff like Deerclops being controlled by the player instead of being something that forces you to put yourself in danger can be kinda sad from a game experience perspective, so... Yeah, I get your point! I still like Eyebrella being available for everyone, but I also understand the idea of limited resources in multiplayer and stuff~

[Well-met]

fixing every "problem" with the hostile flare is unbelievably lazy and low quality.

[Keller Max]

Craft a special item with Fruits, Fish, Honey, Glommer's Goop that has a spoilage timer of 2 days. Place it on the ground and wait. After some random time period, Bearger will come. But to make life harder, some weak mobs will ocasonally come to snatch it. Spiders, Catcoons, Pigs, Hounds? You have to protect it basically.

[Maxil20]

10 hours ago, BezKa said:

You can approximate when it's coming after the first year, but you won't be sure until then.

This is false. Assuming uncharged seasons/giant lengths, Deerclops consistently spawns at the end of day 30.8, provided you meet the other spawn conditions (be in the overworld, and not on the lunar island). This is because giants are impossible to spawn for the first 28 days, and afterwards the deerclops spawn timer (which is 2.8 days by default) ticks down. You can consistently track deerclops down to the second it spawns provided you follow it’s spawning guidelines.
 

Bearger by comparison, is more in line with your inconsistency. While bearger spawns “early” in autumn, the spawning is inconsistent. Bearger has a spawn range of 2.5 days, going from 3.75-6.25 days into autumn. There is no way to pinpoint the exact range bearger spawns at until you get within 60 seconds of the time it’s supposed to spawn, where it starts growling.

[Evelo]

I see no issue with spawning Bearger so long as certain conditions are met:

1) No other Bearger must be alive on the world map.

2) It is Autumn and past day 30.

HOWEVER the major issue is loot, Bearger can actually be farmed for his thick fur using the tufts, nullifying the need for him to be killed repeatedly. The biggest issue is with post rift content and requiring a Bearger to get your first Spark Arc. Subsequent ones can be acquired via Varg + Deerclops alternating, which requires winter. Considering Deerclops cannot drop her eye multiple times, I believe Hostile flare was added to allow for multiple parties to acquire her eye during the first winter. The spawning of MacTusk isn't really an issue imo as BezKa mentioned, just my 2 cents though.

[BezKa]

21 minutes ago, Maxil20 said:

This is false. Assuming uncharged seasons/giant lengths, Deerclops consistently spawns at the end of day 30.8, provided you meet the other spawn conditions (be in the overworld, and not on the lunar island). This is because giants are impossible to spawn for the first 28 days, and afterwards the deerclops spawn timer (which is 2.8 days by default) ticks down. You can consistently track deerclops down to the second it spawns provided you follow it’s spawning guidelines.

I mean, I don't keep a calculator on me to measure when exactly Deerclops dies so I can know with perfect accuracy when it spawns again. I assume most people don't, that's why I said what I said.

[Wormboi]

7 minutes ago, Evelo said:

HOWEVER the major issue is loot, Bearger can actually be farmed for his thick fur using the tufts, nullifying the need for him to be killed repeatedly.

Tbf you need an insane amount of fur turfs to make thick fur (90 in order to make one and its an RNG drop).

[Cruvimaster]

21 hours ago, Cassielu said:

You may have misunderstood me: Hostile Flare is one of the worst changes you can make to Deerclops, to me it's done more damage than improve, i don't want it happen to Bearger or anythings again.

I think this item was a good addition to the game for those who play in groups. I say this because having a single Eyebrella for a group of six players per year is very little.

On the other hand, using this item to call Bearger will have the main function of collecting infinite wood around the world. I think that's the reason the developers didn't release it for him.

It's just what I think, okay?

[Maxil20]

1 minute ago, BezKa said:

I mean, I don't keep a calculator on me to measure when exactly Deerclops dies so I can know with perfect accuracy when it spawns again.

I don’t think it’s too terrible to get behind, since what I used to do is add up my days up by 72 (since you need to spend some time killing normal deerclops, so a perfect 1.8 day gap between the next is impossible) to get a pretty consistent estimate of the next clops. It’s not perfect, but it’s off by only a few minutes and it covered my needs for over 14K+ days. Could also be what taking a math related course in highschool/college does to someone…

It is admittedly not something most people are going to perform in “casual” worlds. I still think it is cool you can do it, as it turns deerclops from a random menace to a predictable encounter provided you follow its spawning timer and it becomes one of the most “consistent” major threats in the game. 

 

[BezKa]

Just now, Maxil20 said:

It is admittedly not something most people are going to perform in “casual” worlds. I still think it is cool you can do it, as it turns deerclops from a random menace to a predictable encounter provided you follow its spawning timer and it becomes one of the most “consistent” major threats in the game. 

One of the things I like about DST, knowledge is power, always

[Evelo]

31 minutes ago, Wormboi said:

(90 in order to make one and its an RNG drop).

90 makes 3 Thick fur. But yes idk why they don't change it to 30 for 1. It is also an excellent candidate for the Green Necklace.