Ocean QOL

[Trevindo]

Good morning everyone, I think most of you have seen Klei's post by now. So you must know that the next major update will be a quality of life improvement in the Ocean. Therefore, I suggest we use this post to suggest ideas we want to see in this rework. With that in mind, I'll propose some ideas:
Marine biomes can now be located more easily, as remnants of the biomes can be observed on the coast (Example: Mangroves with floating figs on the coast, salt formations with some salts on the coast, new ice biome with some floating ice chunks on the coast, etc.).

[Gloooom]

Removing the current amount of sea stacks in the ocean would be a great first step. They only exist to hinder the player's movement on the seas. They should only spawn close to shore and close to islands. It makes no sense that rock formations would be in the middle of deep ocean.

Other than that change, just adding coral reefs or some mini biome where seasonal fish spawn would be great. Having a mini biome where you can get seasonal fish, gnarwhals and rockjaws all together would be great. No longer having to find them separately around the world, and only finding fish in malbatross shoals. They could also add seaweeds to this mini biome just to make the whole ocean feel alive, instead of all spread out and separate.

Last thing they could do is just add more islands. They can be range from simple to more interesting like Moonquay or Lunar. Just having anymore land masses out in the ocean would already make it less empty.

Those are the changes I think that could realistically be implemented in this update at this time. But, I also have an idea that I think should be added that would make ocean content more viable for players. Klei wants players to choose between lunar and shadow, right? So, why not extend that choice with the ocean and the ruins. Imagine having an ocean ruins, and having to choose between venturing there or to the ruins. The ruins gives the players items that are more geared towards combat ability. Imagine if this ocean ruins instead gave items that helped with long term survival? This already kind of exists with lunar: Stone fruit and kelp and very great for over all survival. In this ocean ruins im proposing getting items that will greatly increase the players ability to farm and survive. Idk what these items would be but its just a cool concept in my eye. The ocean ruins could also implement more lunar gestalts, actually giving shadow affinity more of a use. As it stands now, shadow affinities will always be generally weaker than lunar affinity due to shadow creatures being more prominent than lunar aligned mob. Lunar aligned mobs are either entirely localised on lunar island (and not worth killing) or only available late game in brightshades and mutated bosses.

Thats just my idea, idk

[benfroyobro9381]

I think the ocean has been getting more  of stuff to explore and reasons to go out. I think the atmosphere or blank areas while traveling could be improved. I think traveling between the major destinations should feel like less of a hastle. 

Someone suggested this or something similar from another thread but finding abandoned ships or ways to find anchors, boat kits, sails, etc, on the ocean would help improve the experience. Maybe small abandoned land masses like the guy above said. 

More ways to repair boats that don't require boat patches. They require beestingers, something you can only get on land, so it's really annoying and consenquencial to ram into a island at 0.00001 m/s and make a hole. Maybe boat patches from abandoned or sunken boats. 

Buffs or a rework to cannons to make them more practical. They feel more like extremely situational tools then actual weapons. And if that was the intent than they aren't that useful in that regard either. Maybe make them scare off of Moon Quay pirates if they're aimed in their direction. 

Items or features that can help us find locations like Moon Quay, Frostjaw, Malbatross, etc. Maybe you need to follow x mobs to get to a certain location, like jellyfish, or during a certain weather event x thing happens. It'd make finding them less of a drag, which is a common criticism of the ocean content. 

Small buffs or qol for specific ocean content related items. I think shells feel like clutter in their current state and more relevant recipes wouldn't hurt. The Trident feels incredibly mediocre for how exhausting the Crab King fight is for many. If it at least did 68 damage all the time instead of just on water, which is 100% fair since you could get that damage from Dark Swords and Glass cutters easily, then more ppl might consider using them. Malbatross as a whole could use tweaking to make fighting him less of a pain. Better loot would also be nice since the oar and feathers feel underwhelming with their current uses. Maybe a special hat from the feathers or a weapon from the oar. 

 

[Brago-sama]

•Let me craft the battle paddle already.

•More specialized boat equipment. Let me staple a crockpot to the edge of the boat and a birdcage to the mast

•More fish with effects (the thermal fishes are already amazing even without owning wurt)

•Endgame fishing equipment. Let me fish 3 fish out at the same time if i win the minigame. Call it brightshade magic idc.

•Craftable sea stacks for barnacle farms (I love these things)

•Something something Some way to farm salt more easily outside of turning into maxwell (I am aware of the pirate hat)

•An ocean maker thingy, an antithesis to the docks. Make em work the same way iguess, gotta be connected to body of water idk

•More sea dishes. I love cooking

[gamehun20]

I only have a few things i would like from the update.

1. There is an overabundance of Sea Stacks, would be so nice if their number were reduced and maybe most of them spawned in deeper waters, a few near coast, some here and there in the other waters.
2. If not the first one then add a "Boulder breaker" boat bumper made from Rocks that destroy Sea Stacks, does more damage on collision into boats, trees and the sort, and takes longer to break than the normal bumpers.
3. Powder Monkeys seem quite territorial so maybe they could mark their territory with their Pirate Banners on Sea Stacks or makeshift buoys. They could attempt to return to Moon Quay after raiding a player boat and when a Wonkey player jump aboard they ferry them over to the island. (also make it so only if you pick up a trinket then you get the rest to make it so if you pay attention you can prevent it but if you carelessly pick up items with space you get punished, also fix the stash item deletion please, make a temporary storage in their houses and stack stackables)
4. Would love if we got a "Paddle Wheel" boat bumper that requires Gears maybe Cut Stone to make and when filled with fuel like a Campfire produces a small to moderate amount of heat and light and pushes the boat in the opposite side of where it is placed you have to use a Rudder to turn your boat, can be toggled on and off. (Maybe a Winona thing)
5. It would be quite nice if the Deck Illuminator got a bit of a touch up i can barely tell how much fuel it has left most of the time so maybe an extra fire stage sprite inside or quotes for it could help and Wavey Jones only takes a small amount from it.

[Mike23Ua]

A lot of my ocean content posts have now been archived in Klei’s record books and I am far too lazy to go digging through the internet to find them.

But some of the things I had mentioned was Buffing the Light radius of the Deck Illuminator, it’s pretty expensive, and it has very low light radius… your literally better off just dropping a lantern on your boat deck or holding a torch for better lighting, so what does that actually say for this absolutely terrible boat upgrade??

Ive played since Klei’s alleged “boat placement improvements for console players” but they still suck and are quite frustrating- This should be as easy as it is to aim and cast willows fire mage spells, why can’t “use” on a boat kit give me a range and radius to place similar to casting fire spells please.. 

Another big thing I wished would happen is instead of having one or two tiny key locations for ocean content that Klei duplicated that content and placed it all about in the ocean.. I can only explain that better with this picture-

The above image is roughly how it worked in the shipwrecked DLC, you didn’t just have one Moon Quay or one Salt Formation- they were scattered about the map giving players more than one location to explore.

Finally boats are pretty expensive resource costly crafts, in the shipwrecked DLC you could make multiple types of boats out of multiple resources found throughout the DLC (so if you ran out of resources to craft a Wooden boat, you could make one out of Bamboo instead or whatever)

Even the Hamlet DLC had several types of boats/Rafts you could craft.

Which prevented the issues DST has currently where a player can actually end up stranded on an island out at sea somewhere with no way to build a new boat to get back out to sea and back to the main land.

[Mortalbane]

- less sea stacks, especially in deep ocean. Perhaps they should only indicate that you are close to sea weeds or crab king, or smth else of importance, and otherwise be removed

- bigger boats. There is too much to place now for the current size, especially if you want to sail with friends. Maybe add a connector to make several boats swim together as a big ship, or become a sea base. Such connector could get rid of the boat-to-boat jumping animation, and make boat stacking not look ugly and have no/less holes in the middle. Also could be useful for boat bridges

- introduce smaller personal boats similar to Shipwrecked

- make regular sails give more movespeed, so we don't have to stack a bunch of them. With the current boat size I'd much rather prefer having one single sail with 1,5-2x speed and 1,5-2x size, for aesthetic and practical purposes

- bigger boats would solve this, but still it would be nice to see specialized boat firepits / crockpots / whatever of smaller size, so people don't have to build regular ones. And boat-themed stuff would definitely look better

- add boat lanterns that could be built on edges of the boat

[Cassielu]

I may have had too high expectations...

• More regular, traceable, and learnable ocean biomes generation.
• Make the mast/sail worthy to their learning costs and material costs.
• Crab King rework, make the sailing skills and knowledge helpful in this combat.
• Any simple thing that is prevalent throughout the ocean. (Instead of maverick POI)

[grm9]

11 minutes ago, Cassielu said:

Crab King rework, make the sailing skills and knowledge helpful in this combat

no need to remove a fun fight for that, just add a new sea boss if you want that

[Frosty_Mentos]

I'd appreciate some oceanic world generations.

[Cassielu]

6 hours ago, grm9 said:

no need to remove a fun fight for that, just add a new sea boss if you want that

Or rework it, and make a new boss with the similar content of the current Crab King.

If the main storyarc boss battle of ocean is a battle which boat and every ocean experience drag you down, then ocean gameplay will never get better. 

[grm9]

2 minutes ago, Cassielu said:

If the main storyarc boss battle of ocean is a battle which boat and every ocean experience drag you down, then ocean gameplay will never get better

that's entirely unrelated

2 minutes ago, Cassielu said:

Or rework it, and make a new boss with the similar content of the current Crab King

assuming that it'll be nearly identical, but klei'll most likely turn it into another frostjaw

[Cassielu]

9 minutes ago, grm9 said:

that's entirely unrelated

It has, CK is the fun killer of the ocean, it just shows you that your carefully prepared boats and lerning sailing skills are all useless even harmful, and that the right way to benefits from ocean is to not get involved at all.

Using the analogy of your favorite boss fight, it's as if the way to defeat AFW is to not do any damage to it and let it kill you. It's frustrating.

[grm9]

1 hour ago, Cassielu said:

It has, CK is the fun killer of the ocean

it wouldn't become better if he wouldn't have existed

1 hour ago, Cassielu said:

It has, CK is the fun killer of the ocean, it just shows you that your carefully prepared boats and lerning sailing skills are all useless even harmful, and that the right way to benefits from ocean is to not get involved at all

just add another fight that'd require using sails, making CK require getting sails would be lame

[Jakepeng99]

New mobs in the main parts of the ocean. More foragables in swell and deep ocean.

[goatt]

9 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

I suggest new walking mechanism. A bioluminescent path that only appearing at night between small islands. But it lights up very little radius similar to brightshade helmet. Of course, the path will be dormant if a boat is above it, and it can be pushed out by boats like kelps.

 

Alternatively, there could be a temporarily big leaf path between nearby island. The leaf disappearing shortly after being stepped on, and will reappear soon after. So if 2 people are walking towards each other from both ends of the path, and they meet each other in the middle when all the leaves behind them have disappeared, they will both drown.

 

So I suggest floating (not swimming) be the new way to move. It moves as slow as carrying statues. The current drowning&teleporting is unfun. With this, we can ocean specific body gears to counter the downsides of floating:

1. slow movement

2. freezing temperature and damage

3. full wetness and sanity drain + ocean sanity monster

4. disarmed and hand slot becoming equipped by water. You can't defend yourself from monsters in water, or hunt down gnarwail when in water.

5. Small vision radius and fog-of-war clearing radius. This is important (and future-proof) so that floating will be an undesirable way to explore unknown ocean, and boats stay far superior.

 

Also make boats slightly more agile, let players feel less clunky moving around in ocean.

[chincer]

what is interesting is that klei already have content to add to the ocean, from shipwreck, another thing that would make the ocean more interesting? archipielago map like in the map.

the current mainland have so much of the surface and all the cave entrances, but if you could have different map generations you could set things like a massive lake for an ocean with the land being all around the edges, a bunch of islands that you have to transverse with boats or using the cave entrances or wormholes, or you can have regular pangea map which is what we have right now.

for anyone that have try archipielago map, or do a all loop no branches world generation it should become apparent that it change the game enough and can be so fun, nothing like a donut world where the lunar island is in the middle of the map and can work as a hub for example.

[JosePapp]

20 hours ago, gamehun20 said:

I only have a few things i would like from the update.

1. There is an overabundance of Sea Stacks, would be so nice if their number were reduced and maybe most of them spawned in deeper waters, a few near coast, some here and there in the other waters.
2. If not the first one then add a "Boulder breaker" boat bumper made from Rocks that destroy Sea Stacks, does more damage on collision into boats, trees and the sort, and takes longer to break than the normal bumpers.
3. Powder Monkeys seem quite territorial so maybe they could mark their territory with their Pirate Banners on Sea Stacks or makeshift buoys. They could attempt to return to Moon Quay after raiding a player boat and when a Wonkey player jump aboard they ferry them over to the island. (also make it so only if you pick up a trinket then you get the rest to make it so if you pay attention you can prevent it but if you carelessly pick up items with space you get punished, also fix the stash item deletion please, make a temporary storage in their houses and stack stackables)
4. Would love if we got a "Paddle Wheel" boat bumper that requires Gears maybe Cut Stone to make and when filled with fuel like a Campfire produces a small to moderate amount of heat and light and pushes the boat in the opposite side of where it is placed you have to use a Rudder to turn your boat, can be toggled on and off. (Maybe a Winona thing)
5. It would be quite nice if the Deck Illuminator got a bit of a touch up i can barely tell how much fuel it has left most of the time so maybe an extra fire stage sprite inside or quotes for it could help and Wavey Jones only takes a small amount from it.

I absolutely LOVE the Powder Monkey Rework idea. Especially with the banners and the trinkets only cursing you if you pick one up (like in the trailer video).

Personally I'd love it if Malbatross was reworked as well, so that he could spawn on a small percentage basis whenever you hook a fish, regardless of whether or not you're in a designated shoal, similar to the tiger shark. 

I would also love it if Gnarwhails, Squids and Rockjaws could get dedicated spawners (maybe mini biomes?) And some interesting stuff to do with their drops.

Maybe you could use a Rockjaws' Jaw with some moon glass for a slower hard hitting weapon like the cork bat, or get ink from squids to make feather pencils by soaking a jet feather on them

An archipelago world configuration or at least one with rivers between mainland biomes would make boating much more relevant as well

[benfroyobro9381]

Random idea: Maybe have ice staffs or some ice item can freeze a path in the ocean? Either temporary or permenant depending on the season or item. I think it could help with sea exploration. Specifically, the Celestial/Lunar Deerclops item that freezes or makes it colder in a area. Or maybe ice rafts or something, like a grass boat that's permenant in Winter but melts in every other season. 

[Mortalbane]

I have just "enjoyed" some sailing, to refresh why i don't like it.
In this game, i simply tried to get a Knobbly tree seed.

1. Round thing which is called a boat here is not visually appealing. Also for convenience i have to build sails in the upper part of the boat, and not in the center, which only further ruins the visuals.

2. The boat is too small. It becomes littered with stuff, some of which look really out of place, like firepit. Actually, two firepits. And i was alone in the boat, with no cannons or fire extinguishers. Making us create multiple specialized boats is not good imo, and one clearly can't fit it all.

3. Wooden ore is too weak, driftwood ore is too strong. In most of the videos i saw, people didn't bother to build sails and just used driftwood ores. But i like my fingers too much to do the same. Also, i think that necessary clicks per minute should be reduced, in order to achieve same speed. It will feel more relaxed, natural and enjoyable as well.

4. Regular sail is too weak. Having one feels like you're crawling at turtle's speed, like your driftwood ore is faster. Having multiple sails on such small boats is ehh. Sailing with friends and having multiple sails to operate would be fun, but currently there is no need or interest to sail in company.

5. I can't see anything ahead. Maybe this is because i play at 1366p on a laptop, but while sailing i look at map more than i look at my boat. And i can't possibly dodge an obstacle at this rate, i can only throw an emergency anchor. While in most sailing games navigating around obstacles is part of the fun.

6. Too many sea stacks! I mean, i want to rush around the seas with 17 sails, but i'm afraid to use even 2, because i will ram into a rock any second. Shipwrecked had a wave-riding minigame, and here we have a hindrance and annoyance.

7. The boat is so fragile that it gets leaks all the time, especially considering issues mentioned above. Why can't i fortify it with wood, you know, before i go sailing? And when i get the sea materials, i'd like to make the boat even stronger - like being able to ram those stacks and give no facks.

8.  I can't locate what i want. In SW there was a visual indication, which was enough to orient in the world. SW had spyglasses. Here i've spent 2 whole seasons (!) to swim all around one half of the world, dodging those damn stacks, only to find out that my waterlogged biomes all spawned on the other side of the world!
And can i sail "through" the world, by some rivers? No, i have to either go around, or create another boat.
Maybe make sailing better and turn the world into islands, like in SW? Or at least add rivers.

9. The sea is boring and lifeless. In SW there was a ton of mobs, both aggressive and friendly. All you do here is crawl through empty space and dodge sea stacks.
But if i meet an aggressive mob, if i'm not prepared, i will have a lot of troubles getting away with those sails, i mean, turning around. So i'm kinda glad that there are few, but, you know, having empty sea is not a solution.

10. I hit the edge of the world like a wall. With no rivers / island system, why not let us teleport to the opposite side of the map?

 

This describes not all there is to say, but at least basic seafaring experience.

If that was DS's first experiment with water, that would be kinda ok. But you guys made the glorious Shipwrecked!

No offense, but those people who designed DST water, then playtested it and thought that this is fun, should be banned from designing stuff.

[grm9]

11 minutes ago, Mortalbane said:

But you guys made the glorious Shipwrecked!

extremely boring, literally nothing to do after day 4 at most because waiting for seasons feels like a waste of time because there's nothing else to do because you can prepare before even the 2nd season starts and there's nothing else to do other than making a base or looking for volcano which is entirely RNG

12 minutes ago, Mortalbane said:

If that was DS's first experiment with water, that would be kinda ok

previously we just had walking with acceleration on water

12 minutes ago, Mortalbane said:

7. The boat is so fragile that it gets leaks all the time

only if you ram into stuff

13 minutes ago, Mortalbane said:

2. The boat is too small. It becomes littered with stuff, some of which look really out of place, like firepit

i usually only either make a fire pit if i forgot to get light bulbs or put nothing there

[Mike23Ua]

I still feel like DST could benefit greatly from invisible under water mob spawners, kind of like how Minecraft has those underground mob spawner blocks that you can eventually dig your way to and destroy so the mobs stop spawning in the area..

Exactly like THAT but without being able to destroy the spawners.

To keep the ocean from being stale, boring and repetitive those mobs should be a bit more randomized, port over some of the amazing ocean mobs from Shipwrecked & Hamlet, even Frogs were able to swim in the SW/Hamlet DLC.

It’s cool to have mobs that can be both land & sea mobs, so things like water glider spiders, frogs, snakes, crocodogs, hippopotamoose, etc.. mobs that aren’t just entirely limited to Ocean life, and can chase you back to dry land (Pirate monkeys will do this by the way)

But it’s also equally important to have a few mobs that are exclusive to being on the ocean, so things like sting Ray, RockJaw, swordfish, Electric Eel, Jellyfish etc..

[Capybara007]

The telelocator restriction was made back then when you could telelocate bosses to the water and kill them instantly

Not too long ago they made it so bosses just spawn at the shore

Let us place telelocator focus on boats pls

[Swiyss]

So many insanely great ideas here. You guys are this close to turning into devs really. Just gotta put in the work.

[Wormboi]

portable boats like the inflatable rafts in UNCOMP would be nice