Rifts should spawn naturally after 2 years in game.

[Szczuku]

9 hours ago, bloopah said:

That's not a great idea, either. Having people be notified that their world is about to get much harder from now on is a good thing, in my opinion. Solo DS also had confirmations for certain major things, like saving Maxwell from the Nightmare Throne, switching worlds, entering Maxwell's Door, etc.. Not having the pop-up for confirming Rifts would be a detriment to players who would then unknowingly be faced with challenges they didn't know would be activated upon, for example, casually giving Wagstaff that one loose Enlightened Crown Shard because he asked for something special.

Once again, the game doesn't ask for permission to send deerclops, frog rains, firehounds, temperatures, wildfires or antlion your way. And these are actually the things that make the game harder for new players, not the rift content.

To get to the rifts one has to defeat 2 of the hardest bosses in the game. So by the time the player activates them they have the skills and knowledge necessary to deal with the new stuff

The pop-ups are not here to warn the player of the game becoming harder. They are here to warn the player of the game becoming annoying, and they allow klei to brush off any complaints about the new content with a simple 'welp, we did warn you', instead of trying to actually make it fun for the player

If the brightshades didn't swarm to player-planted plants, and if they died after 20 or so days, and if the rifts moontated stuff around them, instead of destroying it, there'd be no need for the warning, as taking root would be actually nice and not headache-inducing

[bloopah]

1 hour ago, Szczuku said:

Once again, the game doesn't ask for permission to send deerclops, frog rains, firehounds, temperatures, wildfires or antlion your way. And these are actually the things that make the game harder for new players, not the rift content.

Deerclops, Frog Rain and stuff aren't permanent changes to the world.

1 hour ago, Szczuku said:

To get to the rifts one has to defeat 2 of the hardest bosses in the game. So by the time the player activates them they have the skills and knowledge necessary to deal with the new stuff

But they won't have the knowledge that those things will happen if the certain things are done to activate them.

1 hour ago, Szczuku said:

The pop-ups are not here to warn the player of the game becoming harder. They are here to warn the player of the game becoming annoying, and they allow klei to brush off any complaints about the new content with a simple 'welp, we did warn you', instead of trying to actually make it fun for the player

No??? This is just your interpretation of it.

1 hour ago, Szczuku said:

If the brightshades didn't swarm to player-planted plants, and if they died after 20 or so days, and if the rifts moontated stuff around them, instead of destroying it, there'd be no need for the warning, as taking root would be actually nice and not headache-inducing

This isn't part of my original point. The point was that warning the player that harder things are to come is good, and this is a good example.

[EatenCheetos]

On 10/1/2023 at 11:01 AM, Szczuku said:

Once again, the game doesn't ask for permission to send deerclops, frog rains, firehounds, temperatures, wildfires or antlion your way. And these are actually the things that make the game harder for new players, not the rift content.

To get to the rifts one has to defeat 2 of the hardest bosses in the game. So by the time the player activates them they have the skills and knowledge necessary to deal with the new stuff

This is why the rifts should automatically spawn once the game otherwise stops ramping (~2 years). The world is supposed to be hard and unforgiving, it doesn’t wait for you to be ready. There’s always something difficult around the corner that requires you to step up to the challenge or die.

The rifts don’t really have that right now, because you don’t have to step up at all. The excitement and terror of simply struggling to survive should continue even past the second year, forcing players to step up if they want to survive as many days as possible.

[Pedro cc]

why this thread exist, there's the option to enable rifts at any time

[Mike23Ua]

16 minutes ago, Pedro cc said:

why this thread exist, there's the option to enable rifts at any time

This thread exists so Klei has a better idea of how to incorporate new content into their game.

I can understand that they did not want the game world to become too hard on players who already struggled learning to survive as is, and thus why a lot of the newer content is locked behind having to literally spend 8 hours befriending a NPC, Solve an Underground Puzzle, and Fight FOUR Bosses.. But- It’s Tedious… it’s Time Consuming, and it’s honestly Annoying AF..

If Klei’s intention was to only have maybe 30% of their playerbase (im being generous with that number) ever actually see or experience their new updates then I guess the current implementation of it works..

However- Having World Gen Settings for it (or have several other players carry me through the game to reach unlocking it) is the only way I’m ever going to experience it.

Hence why this thread exists, In the old days of Don’t Starve & it’s two DLCs Shipwrecked & Hamlet, the game world ramped up in difficulty based on how many days you had survived, and the longer you survived.. the more likely you were to encounter brand new gameplay mechanics or content.

Such as: Autumn turning to winter and the ponds you were used to getting fish and frog legs out of freezing over and becoming unuseable for the season as you had to now find a way to deal with Winter AND a terrifying boss hell bent on targeting and destroying your base.

This is Dont Starve at its Heart & Core, so why Klei has chosen a different development approach for DST is a bit confusing..

Maybe it’s for Story & Lore related purposes?? I honestly don’t know.

But I feel like I would enjoy the game a lot more if it incorporated more RogueLite-like elements to it- Such as not always encountering the same mobs in the same locations.. or Randomized Variations what happens during Seasons so that Winter Year 3 may not be the same as Winter Year 1, Same thing with Rifts…

Rifts are actually a Golden Opportunity for Klei to add RogueLite/Like elements of surprise into DST, with the player not knowing exactly what challenges will come out of any particular rift.

It could be a boss, it could be something that hinders your gameplay like a harsh weather effect, or it could even be something that BENEFITS your Gameplay, such as a lunar mob that goes to war against Shadow mobs.

My point is that having new content locked behind extremely late game play means that few players (unless toggled on in settings) get to even experience or enjoy that new content.. and that’s just never been Don’t Starve.

Sure, under Normal Circumstances you would need to survive 20 days of autumn before Winter starts. OR you could choose to start your world already in Winter to experience Winter content & challenges, without spending all that time repeating things your overly familiar with to get to the new stuff you’ll enjoy.

Maybe I just want Klei to make a new game under the Dont Starve franchise that actually is more RogueLite/like, and maybe that game will NEVER be Dont Starve Together… 

But it doesn’t hurt to make suggestions like these so they can have a better idea of what their fans would like to see for the future of the franchise. 

[EatenCheetos]

@Mike23Ua that is an absolutely perfect explanation!

[arubaro]

44 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

But- It’s Tedious… it’s Time Consuming, and it’s honestly Annoying AF..

oh the irony, you have described rebuilding and other destructive mechanic pointless mechanics

[Capybara007]

Just defeat the bosses lol

[Mike23Ua]

11 minutes ago, Capybara007 said:

Just defeat the bosses lol

Do you have to defeat Deerclops, Klaus, Dragonfly and Bearger before Summer starts or does that season just sort of start on its own?

[Axoshlotl]

2 hours ago, EatenCheetos said:

This is why the rifts should automatically spawn once the game otherwise stops ramping (~2 years). The world is supposed to be hard and unforgiving, it doesn’t wait for you to be ready. There’s always something difficult around the corner that requires you to step up to the challenge or die.

The rifts don’t really have that right now, because you don’t have to step up at all. The excitement and terror of simply struggling to survive should continue even past the second year, forcing players to step up if they want to survive as many days as possible.

i dont think rifts should be used to make the game harder for new players, the reason they start spawning is because you went out of your way to piss off these 2 factions, introducing a completely new threat that that has no relevance to a new player who has potentially only encountered the seasonal bosses would only be confusing

[EatenCheetos]

40 minutes ago, Axoshlotl said:

i dont think rifts should be used to make the game harder for new players, the reason they start spawning is because you went out of your way to piss off these 2 factions, introducing a completely new threat that that has no relevance to a new player who has potentially only encountered the seasonal bosses would only be confusing

Trust me a new player is not going to survive past the first year, let alone the second. By the time they reach that point they have considerable experience and likely have a comfortable setup.

I think it would make sense thematically. Like the fabric of the world is slowly destabilizing due to the war between the celestials and shadows. Whether we choose to speed up that war makes no difference in the cosmic scale of things.

[dzzydzzy]

On 9/30/2023 at 9:38 AM, Szczuku said:

Rifts auto-starting after 2 years is a bad idea.

A much better idea is rift auto-starting after you defeat their respective boss. Without this whole pop-up confirmation crap. You don't see a pop-up window asking if you want to enable winter after surviving 20 days, do you?

This is a flawed comparison, winter happens based on time progressed regardless of what the player does. If anything you're supporting OP's idea.

[Capybara007]

whats wrong with the game having progression instead of everything needing to be so uncompromising for no reason other than klei not wanting to evolve the game lol

what ive seen  both from this update and from the forums in general is that people that want the game to be more uncomprosing mostly just care about the inmersion or those niche moments where the game puts them in a very unavoidable situation and they enjoy that pain for some reason

im fine if thats how they have fun but most of these suggestions also **** on megabaser by adding worthless griefing mechanics and newbies that know nothing about the game

[Primalflower]

On 9/30/2023 at 4:03 AM, EatenCheetos said:

2. The endgame content is completely optional.

it is optional in the same way that simply not playing beyond the wall of flesh is

[Frashaw27]

I don't like this idea because it inherintly cheapens what the idea of an "endgame" of dst is starting to look like, the world being shaped by your choices to help certain people. This entirely just removes the idea of that in place of "lol, funny goods want to be quirky because the rock they inhabited hasn't been checked up on in a while"? Like, there is so much lore that is beeing expanded upon with implying that wagstaff is somehow causing the lunar rifts and the ancient people are finally returning after restoring the gateway, and it's being all thrown away because you think that people not wanting to engage with endgame content is some kind of sin? also I think the timer restriction is very arbitrary since surviving 2 year means jack when you can hole up with your friend and revive each other with telltale hearts, barely scrapping by. I think part of the reason why there haven't been many time based threats is because time simply isn't a good way to gauge a player's skill. You can survive for 1000's of days having done almost no practical progress on the things we consider important and you can somebody who's killed all other bosses before day 70, it's just a good way to gauge skill due to high margin that there is. The reason why the current offering system works is because it allows klei to have some decent expectations to what the player has. With a time base unlock condition, this would mean Klei would have to account for the players not having certain things. For instance, all dreadstone outcrops and bure brillience boulders would not be pickable by normal tier ones instead of the the Pick/Axe and above. While some may see this as a good change, I see it as removing the originality and the "endgameness" from the content. What's the point in harder content if your not expected to be using the gear you supposedly gotten up to that point? I understand the want for more things to be added as time went on, but rifts just ain it imo.

[GelatinousCube]

I'm not sure if I have ever once said this in my entire history of playing video games but honesty - Git Gud.. /s because you don't actually even have to be that good at videogames - all content in DST is perfectly doable solo and nothing is all that hard comparatively to games that are actually genuinely difficult. You can also very easily ask someone on the forums to come give you a hand with certain bosses etc. If someone genuinely needed help beating Crab King or Fuelweaver or whatever on PS I am more than happy to help out. 

Play the content, defeat the bosses, actually dedicate some time to a world to get through the "quests" and whatnot and actually reach endgame. 

This is like asking to be able to skip to the last level of other games of other genres. A huge element of gaming in of itself is progression. You beat X boss or level or area and as a reward you get new gear or abilities or whatever and you get to take on the next area or chapter or level or whatever. That's literally the game. Don't you guys want to earn the late game challenges and content? Don't you want to feel that satisfaction and/or glory of beating the content necessary to get to end game? Do you really just want everything handed to you on a platter without earning it? I really don't get it.

I know that the game is very much half survival/half sandbox (although of late many seem to forget this and are absolutely hating on the sandbox half and just want pure survival with no option to mega base, terraform, thrive and get creative) but there are still limits to sandbox games and some form of progression generally. 

Honestly as far as I'm concerned turning rifts on and off should only be an option in worlds that have already opened them at least once the proper way and for beta worlds so players can actually experience the new content and give feedback accordingly. 

 

[Mike23Ua]

On 10/9/2023 at 7:19 PM, Capybara007 said:

im fine if thats how they have fun. but most of these suggestions also **** on megabaser by adding worthless griefing mechanics.

If your fine with how people want to have fun… why are you upset that they’d actually like some of what you feel is “worthless griefing Mechanics”?

Why does EVERYTHING have to be compatible with a Mega-Base? Why can’t we have at least SOME mobs or destructive features that will Hinder my ability to even build a base that big?
What harm does it do to you or your base to have optional Game settings to make the base building aspects harder or maybe even impossible? 

If I could toggle meteorshowers to happen lots more often and not constrained to one tiny always predictable area, for the players who actually WANT to suffer like that and constantly need to repair whatever the games mobs or hazards destroys… how is that hurting you? 
 

It’s like getting Mad that you bought a racing game and you enjoy the standard race mode, maybe you even enjoy the Last Car Eliminated Mode, but what you absolutely can not stand and hate is the Capture the Flag Mode.

Different Playstyles, Different Areas of Enjoyment.

[Capybara007]

44 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Why does EVERYTHING have to be compatible with a Mega-Base? Why can’t we have at least SOME mobs or destructive features that will Hinder my ability to even build a base that big?

BECAUSE YOU CAN LITERALLY NOT BUILD A BASE

[EatenCheetos]

1 hour ago, GelatinousCube said:

This is like asking to be able to skip to the last level of other games of other genres. A huge element of gaming in of itself is progression. You beat X boss or level or area and as a reward you get new gear or abilities or whatever and you get to take on the next area or chapter or level or whatever. That's literally the game. Don't you guys want to earn the late game challenges and content? Don't you want to feel that satisfaction and/or glory of beating the content necessary to get to end game? Do you really just want everything handed to you on a platter without earning it? I really don't get it.

I think you misunderstand. I’m not asking for the game to be easier, I’m asking for it to be harder. Normally players don’t *have* to go explore the endgame content like the ruins, the ancient archives, the lunar island, all the fun bossfights, etc. However, if something like rifts showed up naturally, then players are forced do all the other endgame stuff so they can get the gear needed to survive.

Like I mentioned previously, the endgame is completely optional and it is very much against the spirit of the game to wait until the players feel like completing it. I say no! Force the players to beat nightmare werepig, the shadow pieces, ancient fuelweaver, etc. The game is supposed to be unforgiving and the challenges wait for nobody.

In summary, instead of players completing the endgame content whenever they feel like it, if they ever feel like it — we should force them to complete it so they get the gear necessary to survive the rifts.

[arubaro]

On 10/9/2023 at 7:46 PM, EatenCheetos said:

This is why the rifts should automatically spawn once the game otherwise stops ramping (~2 years). The world is supposed to be hard and unforgiving, it doesn’t wait for you to be ready. There’s always something difficult around the corner that requires you to step up to the challenge or die.

The rifts don’t really have that right now, because you don’t have to step up at all. The excitement and terror of simply struggling to survive should continue even past the second year, forcing players to step up if they want to survive as many days as possible.

an experience player would reach "hardmode" before 2 years so making it start automatically would only ruin the experience for noob people who is good enough at the game to barely survive the 4 seasons...

some people needs to play with new players since they forgot the time before they checked edgy prick's tutorials to survive and kill bosses ...

[GelatinousCube]

On 10/10/2023 at 5:31 AM, EatenCheetos said:

@Mike23Ua that is an absolutely perfect explanation!

Huh.. So you are Mikes alt account..?

[Mike23Ua]

On 10/11/2023 at 7:52 AM, arubaro said:

an experience player would reach "hardmode" before 2 years so making it start automatically would only ruin the experience for noob people who is good enough at the game to barely survive the 4 seasons...

some people needs to play with new players since they forgot the time before they checked edgy prick's tutorials to survive and kill bosses ...

If you want to get technical, in the fictional world that is the constant there is 12 known weather seasons. Each of those seasons bring about their own challenges and rewards and unique gameplay.

However, and for whatever reason- Klei decided that DST should stop at its 4th Season, now this may CHANGE sometime in the near future.. but for right now, once you beat Summer the game is pretty much over unless you go and find some completely optional content to do like hang out with Pearl or fight 4 mandatory required bosses before new weather and mobs show up.

I get the feeling that had the content updates to DST NOT tried to be incorporated into players Existing Worlds and was instead treated like Shipwrecked and Hamlet as an actual paid DLC expansion, that Weather and new mobs would show up on their own over time instead of me needing to go fight some highly obscure super late game bosses to get to that point.

[Spino43]

On 10/11/2023 at 3:01 PM, Mike23Ua said:

Why does EVERYTHING have to be compatible with a Mega-Base? Why can’t we have at least SOME mobs or destructive features that will Hinder my ability to even build a base that big?

Say, you are a game dev, and your game has a feature a large portion of players do and like.

Then a single person complains, hates it and demands you to get rid of it and implement the person's ideas.

Would you do it? Would you abandon a large portion of your playerbase just to accomodate a single person?

I am sure dst devs realize megabasing is a thing that will stay in this game, and given all the skins, the decorative objects you can craft, that is 90% the case. Klei makes great games, but they still need money.

Look, I have said before, if you want them to change to your ways, fund them. Don't sit here and expect them to implement only your ideas.

[GelatinousCube]

21 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

but for right now, once you beat Summer the game is pretty much over

what...? If you don't want further challenges I suppose but there is PLENTY left to do after the first Summer especially if you are a slower player that likes to build up a base and get various survival elements handled before taking on bosses/questlines. There has never been a clear "finishing" point in DST and it certainly isn't, has never been and will never be simply surviving the first in game year and beating each season once. 

The game might be over for you first Summer because you have no interest in bosses, terraforming, building farms/setups, clearing the fog of war from the whole map including Caves, the ocean, basically doing the actual questline that Klei have provided us with, improving or upgrading your world in any way whatsoever, any sort of self imposed challenge you may set or see if you are capable of doing or basically most of the vast content or options in this game but that does not mean the game ends at this point for anyone else or that this is some sort of logical finishing point like you seem to be suggesting. 

Its literally a sandbox game that doesn't ever end unless you the player wants it to but you think the game basically ends after summer? 

 

21 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

some completely optional content to do like hang out with Pearl or fight 4 mandatory required bosses before new weather and mobs show up.

optional ..... yet mandatory? what? Oh mandatory for new weather and mobs to show up, so progression basically. So not really that optional if you want the content that follows them and to actually progress further into the vague quest line of sorts that we have. 

By your logic literally every single piece of content in DST is optional. You don't have to make it to Summer you can just start a new game/world instead. You don't have to kill Deerclops you can just run away. You don't have to fight bosses or mobs at all if you don't want to. You technically don't even need to collect food and eat if you don't mind dying pretty quickly and just starting over again. 

21 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

highly obscure super late game bosses

Highly Obscure? CC and FW are pretty important to both the lore and game mechanics - the entire ruins resetting is tied to FW and Moonstorms and so much more lunar content and lore is tied to the CC. They are both super important and the logical next step when actually following the loose progression and "quests" we do actually have in the game. 

[Mike23Ua]

49 minutes ago, GelatinousCube said:

what...? If you don't want further challenges I suppose but there is PLENTY left to do after the first Summer especially if you are a slower player that likes to build up a base and get various survival elements handled before taking on bosses/questlines. There has never been a clear "finishing" point in DST and it certainly isn't, has never been and will never be simply surviving the first in game year and beating each season once. 

The game might be over for you first Summer because you have no interest in bosses, terraforming, building farms/setups, clearing the fog of war from the whole map including Caves, the ocean, basically doing the actual questline that Klei have provided us with, improving or upgrading your world in any way whatsoever, any sort of self imposed challenge you may set or see if you are capable of doing or basically most of the vast content or options in this game but that does not mean the game ends at this point for anyone else or that this is some sort of logical finishing point like you seem to be suggesting. 

Its literally a sandbox game that doesn't ever end unless you the player wants it to but you think the game basically ends after summer? 

 

optional ..... yet mandatory? what? Oh mandatory for new weather and mobs to show up, so progression basically. So not really that optional if you want the content that follows them and to actually progress further into the vague quest line of sorts that we have. 

By your logic literally every single piece of content in DST is optional. You don't have to make it to Summer you can just start a new game/world instead. You don't have to kill Deerclops you can just run away. You don't have to fight bosses or mobs at all if you don't want to. You technically don't even need to collect food and eat if you don't mind dying pretty quickly and just starting over again. 

Highly Obscure? CC and FW are pretty important to both the lore and game mechanics - the entire ruins resetting is tied to FW and Moonstorms and so much more lunar content and lore is tied to the CC. They are both super important and the logical next step when actually following the loose progression and "quests" we do actually have in the game. 

But tell me how much (if any) of the CC or AFW Questline your going to figure out on your own without YouTube, Wikipedia, Edgy Rick, Starvey Charles, or finding out about it on these very forums?

I think I can cement the word “Obscure”

Anyway, the op wants new content to start popping up after the first or second in game year with a sort of “Through the Ages” style ramping progression in the game getting more difficult the longer we’ve stayed alive.

What the OP most certainly does not want, is for this new content to be tied down behind some late game obscure bosses.

Furthermore Klei’s Roadmap stated there would be content updates for both the early and late game, yet unless Klei was counting the Character Skill trees as part of those updates… the only updates we have gotten have focused entirely on post-CC/AFW Late-Game Content.

Your okay with that because obviously your some kinda god at the game and don’t mind doing all the quests and fighting all the bosses to reach that point, other people (like the Op) may not be too thrilled with that idea.

Lastly- Rift content is tied exclusively to Rift content.. Meaning that fight CC & AFW mean nothing, because the difficulty and progression of Rift Content starts with engaging with Rift Content, and THEN that Rift Content will provide its own resources to further help with dealing with Rift Content.

See what I’m saying yet?