The best DST player and Skill in the game

[Dreadle]

5 hours ago, x0-VERSUS-1y said:

"New Wolfgang Bee Queen Speedrun feat. Porkus

Bullying Fuelweaver into submission by killing him in 1 Round (feat. Porkus)

(feat. Porkus) Hard Fuelweaver Challenge (No speed/lazy explorer/nightmare amulet) [DST]
1.5K views 5 months ago" etc

 

"Hey, guys, what should we do to get some spotlight and viewer boost on our channels? Oh, I know..."

 

5 hours ago, Third Porkus said:

I don't even post anymore, I am friend's with Guille yes but I don't think he even links my channel in his videos, that isn't self promotion. Also I'm just on the phone with him in the videos I am not even a part of it 

Half-agree this is poor promotion - the fact you guys are friends sells it out, even if you meant well to praise your friends. Make it a poll and include more people since the list of YouTubers and reasons why you included some of them are so random, overstated, and personal (unless you play with them no way you can know it). 
Many names have been left out, on top of my head: Glemz, Korean Waffer, Lakhnish Monster, Swanky Psammead, Kynoox, Edgy Rick (this guy is terrible lol but somebody going to say otherwise) ...etc.

 

[Datanon]

thats not possible to objectively measure. the only way you can somewhat make a few theories about it is by watching speedrun times but obviously being skillful isnt just about being fast/having good RNG

19 minutes ago, Dreadle said:

Edgy Rick (this guy is terrible lol but somebody going to say otherwise)

i hate the fact that for some time you either watched content creators that glorified anything that klei did or content creators that complained about everything

[Third Porkus]

48 minutes ago, Dreadle said:

Make it a poll and include more people since the list of YouTuber

I didn't make this a poll because this wasn't just about the list of youtubers, I wanted other people to mention players. The list I gave isn't even a list of all the best player's based on how I'd rank them it is just people I think should be mentioned because they had some impact on the community.

 

48 minutes ago, Dreadle said:

Glemz, Korean Waffer, Lakhnish Monster, Swanky Psammead, Kynoox, Edgy Rick (this guy is terrible lol but somebody going to say otherwise) 

Okay well first yeah, Edgy Rick is a terrible player. Watch his fight against Fuelweaver at the end of his second Wolfgang playthrough, fight take's fifteen minutes as Wolfgang it is ridiculous. I never saw much of Kynoox so can't say anything about them, but there is nothing that special about everyone else except for Korean Waffle figuring out how to speedrun Fuelweaver before day 21, the other's are mediocre in skill but yeah Korean Waffles is good.

14 minutes ago, Datanon said:

thats not possible to objectively measure. the only way you can somewhat make a few theories about it is by watching speedrun times but obviously being skillful isnt just about being fast/having good RNG

I didn't ask for anything objective, I wanted to hear what people thought skill was in the game regardless. If I tried to be as objective as possible though, I would just take the definition of skill from oxford dictionary "the ability to do something well" and apply that to the game, and I would say that doing something well is the ability to do things either quickly or with less resources, and then you could apply that to different aspects of the game and basically just call that efficiency. So being efficient is what makes you a skilled player

[Waynel]

7 hours ago, Third Porkus said:

...

[Joeshmocoolstuff]

Before dst was released there was no raid boss in RoG except ancient guardian (whose 2500 hp would be considered puny per today’s standards) so it seems you had to prove the greatness of your skill level by surviving in worlds with restrictions, which is why Joeshmo’s content was mostly focused on survival challenges (e.g. only ruins survival, no crafting raw meat only as wes), small fight challenges (fighting several terrorbeaks or merms as wes for instance) and adventure mode challenges (It was fascinating to see Joeshmo build pig houses in the 1hp adventure mode to kill clockworks guarding pathways).

As raid bosses were gradually being added once dst was released and an arc with a final boss was being developed, Joeshmo noticeably shifted his content towards dst boss speedrunning (and tbf, he had exhausted survival type challenges).

In this area, thanks to an excellent combination of sharp mechanical skills and innovative strats, Joeshmo was undoubtedly the cream of the crop.
From a 2016/2017 perspective, his accomplishments were mindblowing and left the community in awe (fw without weather pain, solo unnerfed toadstool, enraged dragonfly with pigs and scalemail just to name a few).
It’s no wonder that up to this day, you have people in the yt comment section longing for the return of the father of dst speedrunning (also nostalgia, right).

So from both the aspects of, coming with up with a new strategy, and executing it really well, nobody was able to outdo him during that era.
Although he laid the foundation for dst speedrunning and boss fight challenges, I wouldn’t personally consider him to be the GOAT either, nope.

[Helicalpuma]

I don’t remember when he said that but Helicalpuma once stated he'd rather do speedruns with a strat of his own and not just follow Joeshmo’s strats lol… It seems great players don't want to be someone else's copycat... but to the point…

Having dealt with every aspect of dst, Helicalpuma was the embodiment of the accomplished dst player: was very knowledgeable about the game, was a great teacher, was able to quickly build great megabases in his runs, and later on in his career, would dive into boss runs and boss fight challenges (such as Don Giani’s no armor enraged df or Joeshmo’s enraged Klaus fight).

"Kiting with mouse gives a lot of benefits and it helped his playstyle" I beg to disagree, this should honestly be seen more as challenging rather than helpful; I believe Helicalpuma would’ve been even better at the game than he already was if he had got into the habit of using the keyboard for kiting and broke his WoW one.

(R.I.P Helicalpuma, you will be forever missed by this community)

[Don Giani]

Another case of a player who has a masterful understanding of the game with great execution but who isn’t active anymore. Very knowledgeable about the game; gave many tips pertaining to megabasing, general survival/thriving, standard boss fights etc. but also proved to have great mechanical skills by coming up with imo the first really hardcore boss fight challenge (enraged df no armor).

[Lakurion]

Not sure how I feel about him. Apparently, he has a speedrun for bq (rollbacked ??) using a basic void walk glitch (a method which was demonstrated by Joeshmo long before on his twitter account). He also nailed a scienceless maxwell ruins rush.

[Peter Peng]

Sorry, I don’t know Chinese and am too lazy to translate the sites lol. Forgive me.

[Guille]

From a 2023 perspective he is objectively dst’s GOAT; revolutionary in both areas of theorycrafting and mechanical skills; there is undeniably a pre- and post-Guille era in ds/dst speedruns as he completely shattered all the previous records for almost every boss and doing so by bringing forth new amazing strats (no lazy no amulet no wortox fw speedrun, df speedruns where the big fly is dislodged and forced to fight somewhere outside the magma area, etc.).
Not mentioning how many clean and crisp scienceless ruins rushes he’s released (yes, there is a difference between doing consistent ruins rushes with almost every character including the weak ones and posting one rush where you stumble on a logsuit or a hambat boon) and how many other insane challenges he came up with (200% speed enraged df, solo cc no armor hambat only as wes, no lazy no speed boost no amulet fw, etc.).

Unless someone else comes up with new records (with ideally, new strats or some variations of old strats) and new challenges too, for bosses like fw, dragonfly, bq, cc, etc. Guille will remain the best player of all time.

(Also take note that my knowledge of great players might be limited, as I'm a youtube enjoyer only and don't frequent other platforms)

T0 : Guille

T1 : Joeshmocoolstuff, Helicalpuma, Don Giani

Korean Waffles (t1 or t2 ? I have a hard time assigning this guy if I balance theorycrafting, execution, variety of bosses speedrun, challenges, etc. and some players including him don't even get a point in all of these categories but he still probably deserves to be put in t1 because he provided the blueprint for modern fw speedruns by solving a major stumbling block (day 1 shadow pieces))

T2 : Lakurion, Swanky Psammhead, Eboy Cheese

 

I’m probably missing a lot of players for t2 and maybe even t1 as well, so feel free to correct my list.

 

Disclaimer for anyone who would try to be offended by these opinions of mine:

"But all of the above is futile reflection as dst is a sandbox survival game; hence, we’re all skillfully equal as long as we can make a torch on the night of the first day and escape the base when we see a public server wickerbottom coming in with a rain hat on her head, or haunt a touch stone in case we failed to do so."

 

[Third Porkus]

8 minutes ago, Waynel said:

Gormus

Thank you for this

[Swanky Psammead]

This has always been an interesting topic to me as well, specifically because of how the kinds of ways we normally define skill in video games break down when applied to a game with no official win condition. All the speedrunning categories have to be based on some subjective goal, like beating a particular raid boss.

And yet, the game does have an official "lose" condition--namely, to lose your world. Ability to avoid world loss is an objective metric of skill at the game; I would argue it is the **only** truly objective metric. ("These goals are just my own--the only real goal in the game is to survive, and there are many different ways to survive and play this game" --Helicalpuma, DST Maxwell Playthrough Part 1: Exploration (Day 1-12), 0:41). It is ironic, then, that speedrun worlds / challenge run worlds, in which players demonstrate phenomenal subjective skill and require extraordinary practice, typically fail at this single objective goal; they are deleted as soon as the challenge is complete, having despoiled a significant proportion of the world's nonrenewable resources for short-term gain.

In that objective respect I would say that THE BEST DST PLAYER... is Lardee 137. Because they invented a strategy to bypass every single short- and long-term risk of world loss. There is no inevitable eventual world loss due to player error, player boredom, or even IRL player death. The world continues as long as there is a machine to run the game. The "winning" move is not to play, but to stay forever idle as Webber, getting passively healed by nurse spiders.

This "objective" answer may rankle since we have seen so many people we respect, investing so much time and thought and effort into improving at subjective skills like raid boss rushes and aesthetic megabase design, and would like to see them rewarded with credit for their efforts. Them's the breaks though.  jk I agree with the names listed here

 

I will say Porkus, although I agree that everyone on your list is extremely skilled, I do think it represents a somewhat narrower definition of "mechanical skill/game knowledge" than mine, as it privileges mechanics and game knowledge that are specifically relevant for boss rushes over other kinds of mechanics/game knowledge. TBC, this is my perspective as a player who mained Wendy back when Abigail was still a fragile and furious little flower with no easy way to disengage from melee combat, a player who rushed domesticated beefalo before YotBeef made it a lot more practical and convenient, a player who focused on very niche knowledge. I remember allowing myself the tiniest feeling of smug self-satisfaction the first time that I saw Joeschmo accidentally hit a beefalo and lose Domestication during his Fuelweaver speedrun, because he didn't know to anticipate that the default command for a mouse click would change back to Attack after it had bucked its saddle--this one solitary mistake that even a god like Joe was unpracticed with (because it was not normally relevant for his purposes) and which would have been easier for me to avoid. There are many skills we take for granted when we privilege a subset of goals or challenges over others and become specialized. When we practice one set of skills, we are inevitably neglecting others.

A skill that I have found is often underrated, is the ability to practice a lot of games solo for the purpose of regular mechanical self-improvement when other players aren't available, AND simultaneously retain a high standard of social skill and awareness to communicate/coordinate so that multiplayer experience does not suffer. Human players don't behave as predictably as mobs do, especially when they are strangers; when you spend a lot of time playing alone you can start to take it for granted that you've planned and practiced for everything, but then you communicate your intent less efficiently, you get worse at paying attention to cues about other players' intent and emotional state and relative skill level, and that can throw things into disarray even for very experienced players. I've seen a lot of two- and three-player BQ fights thrown this way. I have seen a few megabases go up in flames in the middle of winter because it didn't occur to any of the experienced players to warn well-meaning dead noobs that they shouldn't Haunt the hounds. I never played with Joe, but I played a fair bit with Don Giani and Helicalpuma and Lakurion; HP was the only one of the four of us who was consistently good at this IMO, always knew the potential for a miscommunication ahead of everyone else, always had a good plan to improvise when things started going awry, always really friendly and patient and emotionally intelligent. In HP's absence, Jazzy is extremely good at this. This skill doesn't help at all with speedruns in solo worlds, but it does help a lot with, y'know, playing the game in the way it was actually designed to be played, "together".

In terms of the subjective skills that I value most, I would personally include KoreanWaffles, Lakhnish Monster, SplOrange, HobNob, and Sunset Skye among the best. (also unironically Lardee 137, no shade). PekePeke3121 hasn't been around in a long time and never recorded a lot of their exploits, but I think I would count them; they were a big inspiration to me when I was still a baby Wendy main. I don't think I'd be able to name one player as "the best" because the qualifications are so multiplicitous; I think it's likely that the actual best DST player by my own subjective metrics of skill is someone I've never met, who doesn't stream or record their gameplay.

Lakurion's mechanical skill eclipsed any other that I've seen by a long shot, but it's not fair of me to compare him to Guille. I've seen Lakurion perform live in servers that we have shared, whereas I've only seen Guille perform in recordings.

 

2 hours ago, Waynel said:

T0 : Guille

T1 : Joeshmocoolstuff, Helicalpuma, Don Giani

Korean Waffles (t1 or t2 ? I have a hard time assigning this guy if I balance theorycrafting, execution, variety of bosses speedrun, challenges, etc. and some players including him don't even get a point in all of these categories but he still probably deserves to be put in t1 because he provided the blueprint for modern fw speedruns by solving a major stumbling block (day 1 shadow pieces))

T2 : Lakurion, Swanky Psammhead, Eboy Cheese

Blasphemy, I am T4 at the absolute highest. Ever since they patched out the bone cage glitch, I haven't even been able to solo FW without reworked Abigail or weather pains 

 

[Third Porkus]

1 hour ago, Swanky Psammead said:

Lakurion's mechanical skill eclipsed any other that I've seen by a long shot, but it's not fair of me to compare him to Guille. I've seen Lakurion perform live in servers that we have shared, whereas I've only seen Guille perform in recordings.

This has always been an interesting topic to me as well

Am not replying to your whole message tonight cause it is late and I gotta go to bed soon, but anyways:

This has always been an interesting topic to me as wellI have watched Guille stream most of his attempts for a lot of the challenges he has done as well as unseeded speedruns and I can say his skill is consistent, not like all of his videos are something he could only do once. Sadly I cannot force Lakurion to play DST anymore as much as I have tried so I haven't been able to see his mechanical skill live but based on what Lakurion has said himself his best mechanical skill was for Bee Queen and Dragonfly, but wasn't as good at bosses like Fuelweaver, and he recognizes Guille as better than him. That said, Guille and I also recognize him as the best at Bee Queen which is why I mention that specifically, since he was by far the best at that fight over anyone else there has been. If there was anything that Lakurion was really good at in specific when it came to Mechanical skill I would love to hear it though since I am a bit of a Laku fanboy. I know he developed a strategy to fight Bee Queen without armor or healing as Maxwell using some burning trees and duelists, he said you were going to voice that video too I think?

 

Also not sure if you remember but there were two things:
1. we played among us together once and you said I was really good :flushed:
2. I actually asked you in dms about this topic once a few years ago in november 2020, and we talked about Lakurion there.

[Swanky Psammead]

20 minutes ago, Third Porkus said:

Also not sure if you remember but there were two things:
1. we played among us together once and you said I was really good :flushed:
2. I actually asked you in dms about this topic once a few years ago in november 2020, and we talked about Lakurion there.

Yeah I remember you. That's why I poked my head in 

[Antynomity]

your name had to start with an 'H' and end with an 'A'

[Third Porkus]

8 hours ago, yourAnty said:

your name had to start with an 'H' and end with an 'A'

Helicalpuma? He was amazing

[Waynel]

11 hours ago, Swanky Psammead said:

This has always been an interesting topic to me as well, specifically because of how the kinds of ways we normally define skill in video games break down when applied to a game with no official win condition. All the speedrunning categories have to be based on some subjective goal, like beating a particular raid boss.

And yet, the game does have an official "lose" condition--namely, to lose your world. Ability to avoid world loss is an objective metric of skill at the game; I would argue it is the **only** truly objective metric. ("These goals are just my own--the only real goal in the game is to survive, and there are many different ways to survive and play this game" --Helicalpuma, DST Maxwell Playthrough Part 1: Exploration (Day 1-12), 0:41).

The issue if we apply Helicalpuma’s statement to evaluating skill is that we’re left with the absurd conclusion that the great Heli himself was as skilled as the average Wilson player who just found out he can survive indefinitely by simply fueling fire pits and basing not far from beefalos for hound protection.
Even the people who will be reluctant to make skill judgments will admit in a casual game “oh damn, this guy is good, he just fended off X amount of terrorbeaks as well as my own”.
Everybody knows intuitively that it’s harder to gather resources for a base while fighting terrorbeaks than doing the same task while eating green caps or cooked cacti for example.

When it comes to having different but equally rewarding playstyles, I won’t argue with that; the person doing fw on day 60 with “standard gear” can take the same satisfaction as the person who prefers to farm a lot of resources and fight fw on day 200 with an inventory full of spices/weather pains/ice cream and so on; I think satisfaction results from a combination of both novelty of the undertaking + its difficulty.
You can get if both from “I beat this boss with no extravagant gear !” and “All the effort I put into farming big potatoes and chili, It finally paid off !”

But I believe that performing the 1st scenario takes more skill and is harder.

 

11 hours ago, Swanky Psammead said:

It is ironic, then, that speedrun worlds / challenge run worlds, in which players demonstrate phenomenal subjective skill and require extraordinary practice, typically fail at this single objective goal; they are deleted as soon as the challenge is complete, having despoiled a significant proportion of the world's nonrenewable resources for short-term gain.

Are you talking about the pig skin mate ? Even in all boss runs people don't usually consume every available pig skin the world can provide; and it can always be renewed without much pain at the moonstone with the freshly acquired shield of terror and bone armor .

 

11 hours ago, Swanky Psammead said:

A skill that I have found is often underrated, is the ability to practice a lot of games solo for the purpose of regular mechanical self-improvement when other players aren't available, AND simultaneously retain a high standard of social skill and awareness to communicate/coordinate so that multiplayer experience does not suffer. Human players don't behave as predictably as mobs do, especially when they are strangers; when you spend a lot of time playing alone you can start to take it for granted that you've planned and practiced for everything, but then you communicate your intent less efficiently, you get worse at paying attention to cues about other players' intent and emotional state and relative skill level, and that can throw things into disarray even for very experienced players. I've seen a lot of two- and three-player BQ fights thrown this way. I have seen a few megabases go up in flames in the middle of winter because it didn't occur to any of the experienced players to warn well-meaning dead noobs that they shouldn't Haunt the hounds. I never played with Joe, but I played a fair bit with Don Giani and Helicalpuma and Lakurion; HP was the only one of the four of us who was consistently good at this IMO, always knew the potential for a miscommunication ahead of everyone else, always had a good plan to improvise when things started going awry, always really friendly and patient and emotionally intelligent. In HP's absence, Jazzy is extremely good at this. This skill doesn't help at all with speedruns in solo worlds, but it does help a lot with, y'know, playing the game in the way it was actually designed to be played, "together".

That’s a very interesting point, I’ve personally met a lot of players who are good at the game and who will contribute a lot but cannot type at the same time or do it very rarely because they would lose focus and die; on the other hand I’ve also played with people who can write a sentence every 2 seconds while retaining perfect awareness of their environment.

The ability to survive in an unpredictable environment – typically caused by multiplayer failures or “artificially” created in certain single player challenges such as scienceless ruins rush – is a great metric of skill.
I imagine a team raiding the ruins and being chased by shadow splumonkeys and suddenly the one person who was lighting the way loses the miner hat/lantern: how will the other players cope if they don’t have any light sources such as lantern or miner hat ? do you make a torch and light a splumonkey on fire ? But how many monkeys are chasing you ? Will you survive the initial bite ? All those assessments need to be made, and yet you don’t have much time to react.

As mentioned before, small fight challenges can also be a good metric and maybe there hasn’t been enough of those out there on youtube (e.g. fighting the spider quarry at dawn with a spear only while not being able to leave a certain area; fighting 2 spider queens with spear only (I think since the webber rework this could be more interesting due to the threat posed by nurses)).

Looking at those different skills it’s easy to see why the scienceless ruins rush is such a stimulating challenge as it is an exercice in various skills not just the boss fighting ones: survival instinct in a somewhat unpredictable environment, mapping skills, fighting skills (vs mobs and since the AG rework vs a boss as well).

 

Not quite related to the topic but watching Lardee’s video is a good reminder of why having many players leave public servers at the end of the 1st autumn has less to do with not being able to survive, as there will usually be someone who will carry the server and build a nice base, but more to do with the feeling of being useless as going back and forth between the firepit and the icebox is pointless.

[Evelo]

"The best DST player"
There is no such thing as "best". Time causes this to be the case. Sure some players are really good, but no one person is "the best".

[Baark0]

me obviously, thats why i havent played the game in like 6 months, my power is simply far too great for you mere mortals to withstand

[MadMatt]

25 minutes ago, Evelo said:

"The best DST player"
There is no such thing as "best". Time causes this to be the case. Sure some players are really good, but no one person is "the best".

If a nuclear apocalypse were to wipe out every trace of humans and this game, wouldn't there then finally be a "best"?

[Evelo]

4 minutes ago, MadMatt said:

If a nuclear apocalypse were to wipe out every trace of humans and this game, wouldn't there then finally be a "best"?

No. There was still the potential in millions of people, or even people who are unknown that were at the moment of their demise better than the reported "best". The spotlight is on those who make themselves known. There are definitely better players in any activity that are better than those in the limelight but go unnoticed because of various factors ranging from isolation to humility.

[MadMatt]

51 minutes ago, Evelo said:

No. There was still the potential in millions of people, or even people who are unknown that were at the moment of their demise better than the reported "best". The spotlight is on those who make themselves known. There are definitely better players in any activity that are better than those in the limelight but go unnoticed because of various factors ranging from isolation to humility.

Well, that dwells more about the best currently known player, regardless of how known someone is there would be a "best" player unless you count potential. Which is an interesting perspective, even if all that potential is wiped out then there'd still potentially be another "best"? I can't say I follow that logic.

Personally I more so take the stance of there are no objective measures of "skill" so a true best will never exist for anything, but as far as practicality and reason is concerned a single best will exist by whatever metric is most popular or given the most merit.

[Jrramon_GOLD]

Definitely not Edgy Rick

[Swanky Psammead]

6 hours ago, Waynel said:

The issue if we apply Helicalpuma’s statement to evaluating skill is that we’re left with the absurd conclusion that the great Heli himself was as skilled as the average Wilson player who just found out he can survive indefinitely by simply fueling fire pits and basing not far from beefalos for hound protection.
Even the people who will be reluctant to make skill judgments will admit in a casual game “oh damn, this guy is good, he just fended off X amount of terrorbeaks as well as my own”.

This is true. But based on my experiences with Helicalpuma, I feel pretty confident that he would be chill with that assessment. He was not heavily invested in establishing skill-based hierarchies, or building a reputation for himself as the best. He just did stuff that he thought was neat. I never met or played with JoeSchmo, but my vibe from the persona that he projected in his videos was that he felt the same way.

6 hours ago, Waynel said:

Everybody knows intuitively that it’s harder to gather resources for a base while fighting terrorbeaks than doing the same task while eating green caps or cooked cacti for example.

When it comes to having different but equally rewarding playstyles, I won’t argue with that; the person doing fw on day 60 with “standard gear” can take the same satisfaction as the person who prefers to farm a lot of resources and fight fw on day 200 with an inventory full of spices/weather pains/ice cream and so on; I think satisfaction results from a combination of both novelty of the undertaking + its difficulty.
You can get if both from “I beat this boss with no extravagant gear !” and “All the effort I put into farming big potatoes and chili, It finally paid off !”

But I believe that performing the 1st scenario takes more skill and is harder.

That's perfectly valid for you to believe that. I agree, definitionally, that it is a metric of skill **in general**, to be capable of doing things that are difficult. But the game does not inherently privilege victories by players who achieve them faster or with minimal gear in any objective way; it does not unlock a better ending, it does not score more points. Therefore the ability to do FW quickly and with minimal gear is not technically a metric of skill **at the game Don't Starve Together**, any more than the ability to consistently play games of Tic-Tac-Toe to a draw while simultaneously performing elaborate handstands is a metric of skill **at the game of Tic-Tac-Toe**. This is why when I praise someone like Lakurion I generally do not call him a "better/best DST player"; I say something like "he has the more/most impressive fundamental mechanical skills in DST combat, re: kiting / weapon animation cancelling".

There are infinite ways to voluntarily add challenges for yourself on top of the base goals of DST (or any other game). Speedrunning is a popular one because it is easy for speedruns to be objectively quantified against one another, they are beautiful and elegant to watch, and by definition they cost less time for viewers to consume than other types of playthroughs. But speedrunning is not inherently superior to any other expression of skills that are learned beyond what is necessary to survive. For example, JoeSchmo built near-perfectly symmetrical megabases without using Geometric Placement; that is a skill that requires an enormous amount of patience and precision and would intimidate many casual players in the same way that the idea of speedrunning would, but it is not the sort of skill that is often discussed when talking about what makes a player "good" at DST.

7 hours ago, Waynel said:

Are you talking about the pig skin mate ? Even in all boss runs people don't usually consume every available pig skin the world can provide; and it can always be renewed without much pain at the moonstone with the freshly acquired shield of terror and bone armor .

I'm not generally talking about pig skin. The nonrenewables that I have tended to see sacrificed in speedruns are grass tufts, saplings, blue and green mushroom spawners, and lichen. (Some speedruns destroy more than others, there's a lot of variation) Early consumption of pigskin in a speedrun has zero effect on the hypothetical long-term viability of the world IMO, because the amount of pigskin in a world can grow indefinitely as long as it does not become extinct--unlike grass tufts/saplings/shroomspawns/lichen.

That being said though. Pig skin is **technically** one of the resources that can go extinct, in theory. You need to lose all of the world's fossil fragments, then lose all of the world's pseudoscience stations, then lose all of the world's star caller staves, and then finally lose all of the world's pigskin and items/structures that can be hammered or deconstructed for pigskin; it's a tall order. But it's not inconceivable, on an infinite timeline...

[Third Porkus]

7 hours ago, Evelo said:

"The best DST player"
There is no such thing as "best". Time causes this to be the case. Sure some players are really good, but no one person is "the best".

There is a "best" if you define what the best is, if I define the best player as someone who has done Dragonfly 200% game speed no hit without walls then Guille is the best player. Very specific metric, but there are ways you can do it that encompass almost every player and gives everyone a fair way to be the best

[Dunk Mujunk]

I'd be willing to bet money the best, most skilled DST player is Chinese. They're not really able to represent themselves here so this thread is pointless.

[prettynuggets]

it isnt worth arguing tbh, why be best player in DST but play this games Solo 
rushing boss solo when the fun part is the chaotic play with other people join the fight then die from something silly and end the fight within minutes (with less boring repetition of kiting pattern)

for me best DST skill is gaining a friends, from randos to a gaming buddies that keep world alive for thousands day

fighting in this game is cool and stuff..  but when you already mastered the kiting pattern its become boring task 

fighting in zero lag world (that you hosted) with the kitting pattern that you mastered doesnt really impress me tbh 

i better watch cool video from splorange - YouTube that give many unexpected mechanic, unpopular tactic (like using food for temperature management) and many creative random stuff than people do boss rushing as proof of their so called skills 
 

[Third Porkus]

1 hour ago, Dunk Mujunk said:

I'd be willing to bet money the best, most skilled DST player is Chinese. They're not really able to represent themselves here so this thread is pointless.

I know of many good Chinese players: Peter Peng, Ultimate, Grief, Sakura, Greatwhite. Thread isn't pointless when you know about who there is. They have a bigger platform on Bilibili than westerners have on youtube.

[Dunk Mujunk]

15 minutes ago, Third Porkus said:

I know of many good Chinese players

And none of them are in contention for your list as far as you are concerned?

[Seero]

On 1/26/2023 at 6:01 PM, Maxposting said:

half of these people listed have been offensive to me and others in more than two ways.

No one cares, like I cannot stress this point enough. I'm going to say it in bold, italicized and underlined to emphasize it

No one cares.

also I'm reading all these replies and it's just too funny, there are so many people who are so BAD at this game they can't help but bring people with skill down.

[Third Porkus]

1 hour ago, Dunk Mujunk said:

And none of them are in contention for your list as far as you are concerned?

Peter Peng is on my list and he is literally my profile picture? He is Guille's profile picture too? What do you mean? And my list wasn't just the best players, it was some of my favorite players who are also skilled. I'm not sure if Don or Helical would currently even be in my top 5 but I wanted to mention them cause for their time they were great. The thing with many Chinese players is that they only really have skill, so I could talk about all the Chinese players skill but Guille has more records and does the same stuff better so I would just talk about Guille instead.

https://space.bilibili.com/16861112 - greatwhite

https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV16o4y1Z76d/ - peter peng

https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV165411W79a/ - grief

here are just a few, not gonna send all cause hard to find the links for them

And here is what I said about Peter