Swanky Psammead

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  1. Had same issue here when I was running Catalina 10.15.6. Now that I've installed 10.15.7, I don't even get a crash window, the game just starts running for a few seconds and then stops with no visual indicators.
  2. Main branch works fine, but the Forgotten Knowledge beta always crashes instantly on OSX (10.15.6). I have tried deleting the old save files in Klei/DoNotStarveTogetherReturnOfThemBeta, figuring the issue might be incompatibility with the new unlimited save format, but so far the problem remains.
  3. I mean, gamers and game designers have been on about how to deal with the complications of cheese for decades, we were never going to resolve it in one thread of discussion lol. I'm happy to keep going as long as original arguments are being made and/or as long as people are learning about others' perspectives.
  4. Thursday dev stream that accompanied release of YotPK event. They demonstrated the PK gold bait cheese in one of their own pub servers, said outright they knew about it before it went live and made the choice to leave it in. EDIT the full dev stream seems to be gone but someone clipped a relevant part here https://www.twitch.tv/kleientertainment/clip/CheerfulBraveCardSpicyBoy I think that if you are being that broad, *everything* is always at risk of being changed or removed as long as Klei is actively updating the game, whether it is considered to be cheese or not. No one considered dragonpie farming to be cheesy, but Klei raised the difficulty in obtaining initial dragonfruit seeds when they added more rare RoT crops. No one considered the ability to carry stacks of 40 fish to be cheesy, but Klei removed it in Hook, Line, and Inker. Meanwhile, pillar stunlocking the Ancient Guardian is still here. The vague, informal, intersubjective playerbase consensus of what is and is not cheese is not a very reliable predictor of what features are most likely to change IMHO. The Fuelweaver snare-cancel, in particular, is a useful example and I'm glad you raised it. I don't believe many people considered hugging the edge to cancel bone snares vs. pre-RoT Fuelweaver to be cheese, because it made sense in-universe (he shouldn't be able to sprout bones out of the void and have them float there unsupported as a continuous barrier), and because it took significant skill to use it to the player's advantage (poor timing could lead to a significant loss of DPS or opportunities to kill Unseen Hands by hugging the edge too early or too late). I am disappointed that it was patched out for the same reason I would have been disappointed if kiting had been patched out; imo, it was an elegant strategy to conserve equipment at the price of needing to learn a more elaborate pattern of attack and retreat within FW's arena. Strategies usually come to earn a reputation as cheese for one or both of the following reasons: either they contradict the proposed diegetic logic of the game world (e.g., passing out of bounds in the caves and abyss walking) or they allow otherwise-challenging tasks to be accomplished trivially (e.g., Mighty Wolfgang armed with Spicy Chaud-Froid and blow darts, fighting any raid boss). But both of these reasons require subjective judgments from individual players about how the Constant's logic "should" work (accounting for the fact that absurd cartoon physics are part and parcel of its in-universe logic already), and about what degree of ease counts as "trivial". Ultimately, all strategies with a high probability of success are going to fall somewhere within a continuum of cheese by someone's metric, rather than falling neatly into discrete categories of objective cheese and non-cheese. Hence the hesitation to make authoritative rulings about them in most cases. Personally I would just change Fuelweaver so that he is still able to perform melee attacks / Mind Control insane players / summon Unseen Hands and Woven Shadows even while stuck, rather than try to prevent players from getting him stuck in the first place. There are a lot of ways to get him stuck besides using Lureplants, and getting rid of most of them would probably require a deep overhaul of the way collision detection currently works for almost all plantables and structures. I agree that getting him stuck shouldn't turn the fight into a completely free win, but I generally prefer to err on the side of rewarding players who care enough about the game to discover these sorts of out-of-the-box solutions, rather than punishing them.
  5. Yeah I'm gonna have to disagree with this. With most cheese, the devs have left it ambiguous whether or not they intended it. With other cheese, they've explicitly stated that they DID intend it (e.g., they deliberately left the gold-baiting cheese in as a way to beat Pig King's wrestling match solo). A lot of cheese strats may indeed survive the full lifetime of the game. The main argument against cheese strats should not be developer intent in any case, imo; it should be about whether the cheese is ultimately harmful to the experience of the game or not. Kiting was not always a mechanic intended by the devs, but it makes the game much more interesting, and I am glad they chose to embrace it rather than patch it out in favor of an armor/facetanking meta. I can see cases for and against the specific cheese strats being discussed here, my mind's not made up.
  6. I will not give my opinion on whether or not it is philosophically valid to patch out these specific cheese strats at this time, but I would like to make some points about your proposed method of patching them. 1) Deerclops is not a true structure-destroying mob. He does passively destroy trees and boulders by walking over them, but he must use an active ability to smash structures. Bearger, Klaus, Fuelweaver, and Toadstool are true structure-destroyers, and they already do pass through fossil walls (as well as statue walls) exactly as you have described here. Deerclops' inability to pass fossil walls is consistent with the existing limitations on his destructive behavior and is probably intended to reflect that Deerclops destroys as an act of deliberate malice or desire, rather than as an act of oblivious trampling on his way to get to something else. (I do agree that it would make sense for him to be able to target planted fossils in the same way that he targets structures, but I do not think it makes sense for him to break them passively by walking) 2) Deerclops can already target and kill Lureplants that block his path, as they are mobs with HP and he is automatically hostile to most entities with HP. 3) Your proposed change to Lureplants will not prevent Fuelweaver cheesing, as the Lureplant's hitbox when placed would still be enough to push him into the atrium fence and trap him, even if the plant is destroyed afterward--similar to how Toadstool can be pushed into compromising positions while frozen/asleep with a single Fossil that is placed down to push him, destroyed by his passive structure-breaking AOE, then placed down again, ad infinitum.
  7. No worries : ) Yes, but it must be asleep before you disconnect. If you dismount and then disconnect too quickly--i.e., before its fall-asleep animation completes--it could unload in its "awake" state (which, similarly, is permanent while unloaded, and drains Domestication constantly).
  8. No, it's a fair point. Exploits involving loading/unloading are controversial and the line where they cross different players' point of disengagement from the game fantasy will always be subjective. I make no judgments or prescriptions about use of the infinite beefalo domestication trick--use it or ignore it as you prefer--but either way, it does exist as part of the game RN, just like pillar cheesing the Ancient Guardian and manipulating lavae pathing with stone walls.
  9. 1) wait until the beefalo goes to sleep (they do this automatically at night, but you can also force it with pan flute / STS) 2) move about 76 game units (~19 pitchfork tiles, how many screens this is depends on how far you are zoomed out and whether you use any mods to zoom out further) away from the beefalo before it wakes up 3) your beefalo will now remain asleep until you (or another player) loads it again by coming within ~15 pitchfork tiles / ~60 game units of it; it will not lose any domestication, or take licks from nearby salt licks, while sleeping. Simplest way to do this is to dismount your beefalo at night, in a place that you and your fellow players don't normally visit and won't visit for the foreseeable future until you want to ride the beefalo again. Then run away. You will know that it's working if you make it ~19 pitchfork tiles away before morning comes.
  10. Trade secret: Unload your beefalo at night, while it is sleeping. It never loses domestication while asleep--and if it is unloaded while asleep, it never wakes up until it is loaded again. Preserve your Salt Lick durability, and never worry about domestication loss again. (and yes, because of this, Salt Licks are completely unnecessary in Lights Out worlds)
  11. Aw shucks, thank you. In turn, I ought to be clear that I respect your analysis and am aware that I'm in a minority here even when I strongly disagree ^_^ This is fair, although I have to point out that post-rework Abigail does not actually die very quickly to bosses anymore, and I find that for surface bosses (and most other purposes on the surface shard) Wendy with an ornery beefalo and war saddle is now by far the least resource-intensive character, if not considering automated or semi-automated boss farms with fling-o / bunnyman / catapult cheese; this is due to her near-Wolfgang-level DPS, lack of need for any armor and weapons, only needing blue caps for healing which are faster to gather than mass-cooking crock pot healing foods even with a 6-pot kitchen setup, and not needing to change shards / run to friendly mobs or tooth traps during hound attacks. (I don't actually value Wendy's spider-farming potential much in the lategame, when I get all the silk and glands I need from automated farms, but I still love her for hounds and depths worms) I swap to Warly for a day every few years to make spicy chaud froid for the 304.92 damage thunderbeef, and Wolfgang sometimes for cave bosses, but that's about it. Though this is a bit of a digression since this is about beefalo in general and not just their specific synergy with Wendy. I recognize this might be counter-intuitive, but it is an equivalent effect. The purpose of wearing armor is twofold, to increase your effective HP (giving you more time to react to near-lethal damage before it is too late) and to increase your heal effectiveness (allowing you to bring fewer healing resources to a fight, and to spend less time performing heal animations). 80% DR from a football helm increases your heal value by 5x--two Deerclops hits now deal 30 damage instead of 150, meaning two hits can be healed with 1 honey ham instead of 5. Wigfrid's innate 25% DR behaves similarly, increasing her effective heal value by 1.33x; the Weremoose's innate 90% DR increases its effective heal value by 10x (though since it has no access to Woodie's inventory, it can only use this effect by consuming Jellybeans before transforming or by receiving heals from other players such as Wortox). The beefalo's high base HP of 1,000 accomplishes the first purpose. The beefalo's 4x healing-received bonus accomplishes the second, as if it were wearing 75% DR armor. This is weaker than a football helm's 5x effective healing-received bonus, but is offset by the beefalo's passive periodic healing. That's fair. I tend to carry pan flute with me everywhere whether I'm mounted or not, just because of how useful and renewable it is; but I suppose not everyone may see it that way, especially if they don't kill DFly or reset the ruins very often and need to ration their green gems. Getting bucked off during a boss fight should not happen with a fully-tame beefalo though--they take nearly two days to buck, and dismounting/remounting resets the timer to full. I'd be very supportive of the idea of a revive item specifically for tamed beefalo. Players get multiple revive options for themselves, after all, and very cheap ones at that. My issue is mainly that if both options are available at the start, the choice to rush beefalo taming the hard way becomes something I have to *justify*. There is a case for rushing the Ruins (early Ruins gear, unlocks potential for a lot of boss rushes), and a case for doing the Ruins in summer (more prep time, efficient use of a season where surface survival can be difficult, fits a more relaxed playstyle). If a chill Beefalo taming option is unlocked as early as the current options for a Beefalo rush, it will be objectively the superior option because it will prevent the risk of mistakes. Pre-crafting a feed station would tame a beefalo in (days to find Beefalo + 20), while rushing without a feed station would do it in (days to find Beefalo + 20 + sum of time lost due to player error). I could see a compromise where a feed station is available to craft early, but only grants Domestication at ~66% the rate of feeding by hand and riding? Then the feed station would tame in 30 days and there would be benefits to weigh with each option, depending on playstyle preference. Dragonfly is actually an example I would have cited as being particularly easy for (post-rework) Wendy with a beefalo, in contrast to Wolfgang. You absolutely can heal on a beefalo (it requires more actions and finesse to time your dismount/heal/remount, but you can do it) and Dragonfly gives you a long period to do it for free while she is summoning lavae. Wendy with a beefalo can thus do it with higher DPS than Wolfgang with a fresh hambat, using the same amount of healing items, no weapons, and no armor. If her ping is good enough to animation-cancel her attacks, she can even get the stunlock on DFly for a second scale, which Wolfgang usually needs a dark sword or better to do. Wolfgang with a fresh hambat: 119 damage per hit, ~2 hits per second, ~238 DPS total Wendy with a war-saddled ornery beefalo and Abigail at night (or using Nightshade Nostrum): 101.64 damage per hit, ~2 hits per second, +40 DPS from Abigail, ~243.28 DPS total I would definitely support the ability to feed your mount while mounted though, I would see that as a QOL change (Walter should be able to feed Monster Meat to Woby while mounted too and maintain her top speed, imo). The main raid boss fight that I would consider difficult with an ornery beefalo right now would be Crab King, although in fairness I haven't practiced him nearly as much as the others yet. Shadow Pieces can also be a little tense since you can't pause the fight with the Pan Flute if it's going badly, but their relatively low collective HP makes this a minor issue imo because the fight doesn't go badly very often. Not really; flute uses are really abundant if you are killing DFly or regenerating the ruins semi-regularly. Every green gem is worth 37.5 flute uses (0.2 uses of a con amulet to make deconstruction staves for 1 green gem apiece, then 1 use of a decon staff to renew 9 uses of a flute = 1.2 green gems to renew a flute 5 times for 45 total uses = 1 gem per 37.5 uses); megabasers have so many flute uses that they are literally using them just to capture mobs like tallbirds or krampii for cosmetic zoos, lol. If you aren't killing DFly or regenerating the ruins semi-regularly, I can understand this price of upkeep sounding high--but no higher than other endgame items that require a fight with Fuelweaver / Bee Queen / etc. I don't see a war-saddled ornery beefalo as a "mere mount". It is a speed boost greater than a walking cane (8.75 units/second vs. default player speed with cane at 7.5 units/sec), it is an infinite-use Glass Cutter (or infinite use Blow Darts if I am Wendy with reworked Abigail's damage buff), it is a 100% DR armor item that repairs itself for 33% of its durability automatically every day and can be repaired for an additional 8% of its durability per Blue Cap if the natural regen isn't fast enough for you; and it is all of these things simultaneously, without requiring you to use any of your head/hand/chest slots. That's worth the upkeep IMHO.
  12. Players could still work together to elevate a single person's friendship, then use that person as their ambassador to Pearl for resources. Not dissimilar from how one player gets the initial rare blueprint from bosses, and is then responsible for producing the team's bundle wrap/scaled furnaces etc. until more blueprints are obtained.
  13. might as well repeat thoughts I've had on Wigfrid abilities for a while here in case it's not too late to influence things 1) ~25% speed boost that is obtained on hitting a mob, and decays after ~5 seconds of not hitting (so that it can be used to help her kite, but not to explore or ferry items). never made sense to me that Wolfgang has more damage AND more combat speed than Wigfrid when she visually appears leaner / more agile than him, the Muhammad Ali to Wolfgang's George Foreman if you will. this would go a ways toward ameliorating that difference 2) maybe periodic AOE damage buff with war cry like she had in the Forge? that's about it, I mostly like Wig as she is
  14. As someone who finishes taming an ornery beefalo during the first year's winter in 90% of worlds I play on, I would like to respond to some of these points Reworked Wendy gets up to 101.64 damage with it, which is much higher damage than any other character can achieve with melee weapons aside from Wolfgang (third place is Wigfrid with a morning star on wet targets, at 90.3125 damage). I feel that "pretty high damage" is a slight understatement, at least in her case. 66 damage on other characters is more reasonably described as "pretty high". Beefalo get 4x healing from food, which is an effect equivalent to wearing 75% DR armor. They also heal passively over time. I find it is simpler to think of a beefalo as a vegetarian character with 250 HP, 75% permanent DR, and a passive heal of 1.75 HP/10 seconds, for purposes of their tankiness in combat; this puts them into perspective in stat values we are more familiar with in traditional combat. Another perk of beefalo combat that I feel you have overlooked is the fact that they do not require players to spend their chest/head/hand slots on weapons and armor, as traditional combat does. This leaves players free to use all three slots for whatever non-DR equipment buff provides best utility in the current combat situation (lightning-proof gear for Moslings, lantern/miner hat/moggles for nighttime fights with no Star Caller's Staff, bee queen crown for insanity auras, scalemail to tank Klaus' fire spell, insulation against heat/cold in winter/summer, backpack, etc.) I have to disagree strongly on this point. The only possession in the game that I consider comparable to an ornery beefalo in its combat utility is double bone armor, which takes ~40 days to acquire. The beefalo is a very swift acquisition by comparison. This, I can agree with, though I have learned to tolerate it for the sake of the beefalo's other perks. The main place it is a liability is the Crab King fight, where one must dismount to repair the damage dealt by Imposing Claws. In my playstyle I tend to do all of these sorts of activities in large chunks while dismounted after leaving my beefalo at its salt lick, so that there isn't much repeated mounting/remounting. Pan flute / STS fixes this problem for everything but tentacles. I drive tentacles extinct pretty early into a world's lifetime for this reason. The lasso sounds interesting, but the feeder would greatly diminish the experience of taming for me unless it is all-but-impossible to acquire early game, needing ingredients that are gated by time (glommer's goop, walrus tusks, steel wool, etc.). Part of what attracts me to the process of taming is the fact that it requires such personal involvement and intense focus, similar to what is required to rush AG / Shadow Pieces / Fuelweaver for an early Bone Armor. This makes the bond between rider and beefalo feel much more meaningful to me. I would not experience a very profound sense of attachment to a beefalo that I simply allowed to idle by a feeder for 20 days while I went about my business elsewhere. The armor, I don't have a problem with aesthetically, but I think it would add enormous amounts of unnecessary strength to an already-powerful combat tool. You are giving the beefalo bonus DR which would stack multiplicatively with its 4x healing bonus. It would dwarf WX, Wolf, and Wigfrid in tankiness if the amount of DR was even as high as a grass suit's (1000 HP with 60% DR is 2,500 effective HP; Wigfrid with a battle helm has only 1,333.33 effective HP, fully mighty Wolf with a football helm has 1,500, fully upgraded WX with a football helm has 2,000)
  15. I love Pearl. As someone who actually appreciates the occasional lore/narrative drop into the game, the value of her backstory and evolving relationship with the player to me cannot be overstated. There are two issues that currently bother me with how she is implemented though. 1) It is impossible to lose her friendship once gained. This puts her in a unique position among creatures of the Constant--players can only ever interact with her positively. All other relationships are exclusively hostile, or a choice between friendship and hostility to be determined by the player. Certain actions should be available that strain Pearl's friendship, such as destroying the berry farms or flower gardens set up on her island by other players (I note that there are already unused lines in the .lua files where she responds to attackers; I would be overjoyed to have my butt kicked by crabby grandmom). Since she is an important community resource, it should not be possible to kill her; I would suggest that if she is given HP, she retreat into her shell at 0 and regenerate over the course of a few days (possibly dropping loot in the process??). Crab King's "defeat" animation and the Rock Lobsters' tenacity already allude to the Constant's crustaceanfolk being hardy individuals who can endure near-limitless punishment. 2) Her friendship level is stored in world data, rather than being specific to each individual player. This can be very depersonalizing on large shared servers, as her demeanor is usually not being changed by *your* acts of kindness, but someone else's. It's especially silly to see her describe literally everyone who comes to her island as her "favorite visitor" post friendship level 10. In combination with issue 1), it also permanently denies the experience of befriending her to the vast majority of the server's playerbase, since she can never be reset to friendship 0. Hope to see more content like her in updates to come!