Should there be more vegetarian recipes?

[Owlrust]

I wouldn't hate an overall cooking rework.

Stoves, ovens, chopping mechanics, salad tossing, plates, tables/chairs, baking, blenders, grilling, emphasized food temperature mechanics, etc.

[Bumber64]

8 hours ago, Azamagon said:

• Pumpkin Cookie. Make it drop 3 "charges" per cooking (similar to Jellybeans), and change its stats to something like 3 health, 25 hunger and 10 sanity and 20 days spoilage. Alongside that, it'd stack up to 60 cookies per slot, rather than just 20. All of a sudden they become pretty good snacks.

Are pumpkin cookies really that bad? They're like taffy without the health penalty, but more perishable.

Of course salsas fresca and vegetable stingers outclass them for sanity.

[Cheggf]

Raw crops have huge stat gains and last a long time. You don't need to cook em. 

[Mysterious box]

1 hour ago, Cheggf said:

Raw crops have huge stat gains and last a long time. You don't need to cook em. 

I don't see the point in having bad veggie crockpot recipes for the sake of it tho like afew fine but when most of them are bad I feel like that's a problem like why even be a thing other than to trick new players they don't even have to be very good just worth at least the some of their parts in same shape or form.

[Azamagon]

On 5/31/2022 at 11:40 PM, Bumber64 said:

Are pumpkin cookies really that bad? They're like taffy without the health penalty, but more perishable.

Of course salsas fresca and vegetable stingers outclass them for sanity.

Yes Pumpkin Cookies are absolutely terrible. Instead eating the 2 raw honey and cooked Pumpkin gives you 14 health and 56,25 hunger. Pumpkin cookies grant 37,5 hunger and 15 sanity. Arguably really not worth the tradeoff, especially considering Pumpkins being so valuable hunger-wise. Compare that to Taffy, which only needs 3 honey: Taffy grants -3 health, 25 hunger and 15 sanity (same sanity as Pumpkin Cookies). The 3 raw honeys are 9 health and 28,125 hunger. A far better tradeoff.

I mean, it's better to just eat a cooked Pumpkin and make Taffy - you get sanity, way more hunger and the health loss is more than negated by the cooked Pumpkin's +8 health. Making Pumpkin Cookies at the moment, aside from the cookies looking absolutely delicious, is a waste of ingredients.

[Nettalie]

Honestly I think it's a damn shame most decent crockpot dishes are meat based. To an extent it makes sense because the process of obtaining meat is usually more involved, requiring combat and whatnot, but that doesn't mean veggie foods should be relegated to 2 okay dishes, decent stats when eaten unprepared/cooked over a campfire and then a dozen crockpot dishes that range from mediocre at best if you use the """most efficient""" ingredients to literally a punishment for being lazy with ingredients.

More indepth thoughts about veggie foods [probably more close to rambling but whatever]:

Spoiler

 

While I don't consider a few dishes some might dismiss for being a bit underwhelming entirely useless veggie dishes have always been in pretty rough shape. Sure they're not as bad as something like fish tacos for instance [you could probably write an essay on that one] and veggies over all are still a really really good food source for pretty much every stat if you use them correctly, I just think it's a shame that putting in the extra effort to make a crockpot dish out of them rarely pays off well. Maybe if the crops had a more interesting dynamic with cooking where dishes offer less hunger/health in exchange for sanity [just as an example], then people would probably be more willing to give veggies a shot in general since I currently either see people using unprepared veggies a TON or only sticking to the same 3 or 4 meat based crockpot dishes, regardless of how good they actually are.

As a little sidenote, with leafy meat being added to crockpot ingredients I was hoping that we might finally at least get some veggie dishes that are wholeheartedly really good, but in the end all it ended up being was another type of meat. Oh but this one is """weird""" because its plant based.
I get that was always part of the point of leafy meat, that it was a bit odd because it's neither exclusively meat nor is it exclusively a plant, but I don't think anyone can really blame me for feeling a bit disappointed when the food just turned out to be used as purely meat, with all survivors commenting on how weird  and strange the food is. At least to me that always read more as "haha vegetarian meat-like food is weird" instead of it being weird for being a fusion of plant and flesh, which was the more likely point. Idk maybe that last part only bugs me so much because I'm vegetarian though. I'd love for the concept to be revisited at some point with less of an emphasis on what I just mentioned. Even if they're not veggie dishes, I'd at least like to see them be less one note in terms of writing. [Even if I do acknowledge leafy meat not being the most common ingredient there is.]

 

Anyway, I think I got a bit sidetracked, TL;DR: I think veggies in cooking could be given a more interesting role than "eat them raw, or lose out on stats" and the concept of leafy meat foods could also be revisited, without the ONLY comment survivors give ending up being "ew it's weird", only for the dish to restore 50 sanity.

[Mysterious box]

1 hour ago, Nettalie said:

Honestly I think it's a damn shame most decent crockpot dishes are meat based. To an extent it makes sense because the process of obtaining meat is usually more involved, requiring combat and whatnot

Meat is actually less involved when you consider the work that goes in to farming vs fighting. Most of the best meat recipes use normal meat and or monster meat both of which not only can be obtained very easily but often automatically  while even the auto giant crop method still requires tilling, water, and a talking and proper placements on the other hand you'll get meat by just swinging a weapon or having something else kill things for you.

[Nettalie]

10 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

Meat is actually less involved when you consider the work that goes in to farming vs fighting. Most of the best meat recipes use normal meat and or monster meat both of which not only can be obtained very easily but often automatically  while even the auto giant crop method still requires tilling, water, and a talking and proper placements on the other hand you'll get meat by just swinging a weapon or having something else kill things for you.

Well no not really.
Fighting takes kiting, has the risk of you losing health, monsters often have insanity auras meaning you'll probably lose out on some sanity, meat mostly just provides hunger unless you dry it [which takes a lot of resources and set up].
When it comes to farming meanwhile you do have ways to simplify almost every step, only exception being tilling pretty much. It's not entirely effortless, but it doesn't need to be to compete for meat. Especially since not only are giant crops entirely optional and you can totally just plant seeds and still get decent enough yields, but when you do go for giant crops you are more than aptly rewarded for watering and tending, which are both tasks that while you do have to repeat them once or twice a day take very little actual time.

[kiwikenobi]

I think that leafy meat is meat, because it's called leafy meat, not meaty leaves. It's meat that has leaf-like properties.

And I always welcome more recipes for the cookbook, I love collecting recipes and cooking.

[Mysterious box]

6 hours ago, Nettalie said:

Well no not really.
Fighting takes kiting, has the risk of you losing health, monsters often have insanity auras meaning you'll probably lose out on some sanity, meat mostly just provides hunger unless you dry it [which takes a lot of resources and set up].
When it comes to farming meanwhile you do have ways to simplify almost every step, only exception being tilling pretty much. It's not entirely effortless, but it doesn't need to be to compete for meat. Especially since not only are giant crops entirely optional and you can totally just plant seeds and still get decent enough yields, but when you do go for giant crops you are more than aptly rewarded for watering and tending, which are both tasks that while you do have to repeat them once or twice a day take very little actual time.

Fighting also has multiple ways of simplifying it namely followers, auto mob farms where mobs fight each other and you take the spoils etc. You can get stacks of meat without ever kiting or raising a weapon if you simply set it up with much less effort than farming. Also the most popular healing dishes are meat based and with the addition of leafy meat dishes they also have one of the best sanity dishes as well.

[HowlVoid]

Yes, I want to eat Wurt.

Adding Vegetarian recipes would be great, roasted Wurt, baked Wurt, Wurt soup, etc.

[sudoku]

8 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

Yes, I want to eat Wurt.

Adding Vegetarian recipes would be great, roasted Wurt, baked Wurt, Wurt soup, etc.

If were talking about a vegetarian diet, Wormwood would be the one on the menu *licks lips hungrily*

[HowlVoid]

1 minute ago, sudoku said:

If were talking about a vegetatian diet, Wormwood would be the one on the menu

Wormwood isn't a vegetarian, so he can't be on the vegetarian menu.

The recipes are of vegetarians, thus vegetarian recipes. Vegetarians also provide more energy than omnivores due to an all plant diet.

[sudoku]

1 minute ago, HowlVoid said:

Wormwood isn't a vegetarian, so he can't be on the vegetarian menu.

 

Wormwood salad with a side of Wormwood spring rolls and a nice tall glass of  fresh Wormwood juice, u lucky u got that speed boost boy -ur gonna need it 

[HowlVoid]

2 minutes ago, sudoku said:

Wormwood salad with a side of Wormwood spring rolls and a nice tall glass of  fresh Wormwood juice, u lucky u got that speed boost boy -ur gonna need it 

We don't know what a biologically correct Wormwood looks like. You could open him up and be surprised by all the blood and guts that pour out. 

His meat could be all fleshy with a mix of chlorophyll and blood.

[sudoku]

1 minute ago, HowlVoid said:

We don't know what a biologically correct Wormwood looks like. You could open him up and be surprised by all the blood and guts that pour out. 

I reckon that leaf on his head and his hands and feet would make for a mighty fine salad and i wouldnt mind a little protien to go with it

[Cloakingsumo198]

Roasted wormwood.

[Nettalie]

4 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

Fighting also has multiple ways of simplifying it namely followers, auto mob farms where mobs fight each other and you take the spoils etc. You can get stacks of meat without ever kiting or raising a weapon if you simply set it up with much less effort than farming. Also the most popular healing dishes are meat based and with the addition of leafy meat dishes they also have one of the best sanity dishes as well.

My point was less that you can't simplify fighting and more that farming isn't this arduous process that takes a ton of effort for way less reward than meat. Not to mention that the meat dishes that do provide good healing still require the player to find a source of vegetables [and also eggs which eat through your supply of meat pretty quickly, unless you go for honey ham, which in itself has additional effort to be set up due to honey].
Sure, you could go for a bunny farm, but at that point we're entering the territory of semi intended methods of obtaining food, not to mention that a bunny farm requires a lot of set up and know-how the game doesn't necessarily teach a player.
Saying that it takes way less effort to set up compared to farming would be a bit deceiving in this case imo.
Same goes for saying you won't have to kite at all exactly because of the time it takes to set up farms like that, it won't be needed to get the spoils from the farm itself, that much is true, but getting there basically requires it unless you want to live off of only seeds and berries... or y'know, vegetables.
As for hiring followers, they are a good way of getting meat for certain, but unless you're either webber or wurt or go down all the way into the caves to get bunnymen, you will need to resort to pigs which take meat to be befriended, which in turn also requires kiting. Pig skin could also be used, but that seems wasteful unless you're already so far into your world's lifecycle that nothing would really matter anyway.

Point is both farming and getting meat are processes that are involved in different ways, but one is not necessarily better than the other. Both have their merits for certain, but just saying one is clearly easier or gives more food I feel is not really true. You may feel this way because you're just used to the way combat works since its been in the game for way longer than rwys' farming and there was basically no competition for meat before then, I'm just saying that both meat and crops are about on the same level of over all pay off for the effort put in.

[Mysterious box]

12 minutes ago, Nettalie said:

My point was less that you can't simplify fighting and more that farming isn't this arduous process that takes a ton of effort for way less reward than meat. Not to mention that the meat dishes that do provide good healing still require the player to find a source of vegetables [and also eggs which eat through your supply of meat pretty quickly, unless you go for honey ham, which in itself has additional effort to be set up due to honey].
Sure, you could go for a bunny farm, but at that point we're entering the territory of semi intended methods of obtaining food, not to mention that a bunny farm requires a lot of set up and know-how the game doesn't necessarily teach a player.
Saying that it takes way less effort to set up compared to farming would be a bit deceiving in this case imo.
Same goes for saying you won't have to kite at all exactly because of the time it takes to set up farms like that, it won't be needed to get the spoils from the farm itself, that much is true, but getting there basically requires it unless you want to live off of only seeds and berries... or y'know, vegetables.
As for hiring followers, they are a good way of getting meat for certain, but unless you're either webber or wurt or go down all the way into the caves to get bunnymen, you will need to resort to pigs which take meat to be befriended, which in turn also requires kiting. Pig skin could also be used, but that seems wasteful unless you're already so far into your world's lifecycle that nothing would really matter anyway.

Point is both farming and getting meat are processes that are involved in different ways, but one is not necessarily better than the other. Both have their merits for certain, but just saying one is clearly easier or gives more food I feel is not really true. You may feel this way because you're just used to the way combat works since its been in the game for way longer than rwys' farming and there was basically no competition for meat before then, I'm just saying that both meat and crops are about on the same level of over all pay off for the effort put in.

See the problem is you can't just "just plant seeds" unless your planning to roll the crop lottery and not make it a sustainable food source you need to know what your doing sure someone could just follow a guide for the proper farming methods for the bare minimum effort you need to put in to get returns on your crops but the same goes for the mob farms your making setting up farms seem harder than they are for a bunnyman farm you simply enter the caves smash all the homes and pull the carrots proceed and grab a tier 3 spider den that's it for the starter farm.

[Nettalie]

2 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

See the problem is you can't just "just plant seeds" unless your planning to roll the crop lottery and not make it a sustainable food source you need to know what your doing sure someone could just follow a guide for the proper farming methods for the bare minimum effort you need to put in to get returns on your crops but the same goes for the mob farms your making setting up farms seem harder than they are for a bunnyman farm you simply enter the caves smash all the homes and pull the carrots proceed and grab a tier 3 spider den that's it for the starter farm.

Just planting random seeds doesnt work yes, but that's not what I'm saying.
The only effort you really need to put in to get crop sustainable is knowing which crops belong in which season and that tending to them once during the correct season will yield a seed back, making the process sustainable.
Anything else that could be learned is purely to get more seeds or get giant crops, and both of these benefits are well worth the small effort put in in my eyes.

Meanwhile when it comes to bunny farms like that, it still needs maintainance, since the spiderden wont just stay a spiderden forever and surviving bunnymen might eat some of the carrots youd get out of the farm [or worse, surviving spiders might eat all the meat].
Also sidenote but I was more thinking of farms involving winona's catapults because those have almost no risk of loot being eaten, i actually forgot about farms utilizing spiders. Either way farms are definitely a good source of food, I'm not denying that. I'm just saying they aren't quite as simple as you make them out to be either. Not any simpler than farming is anyway.

[Psychic Chicken]

I'd like some sort of healing recipe Wurt can use without a farm, even just a 20 HP recipe with somewhat difficult ingredients, just anything that doesn't require farms would be nice.

[Mysterious box]

1 hour ago, Nettalie said:

Just planting random seeds doesnt work yes, but that's not what I'm saying.
The only effort you really need to put in to get crop sustainable is knowing which crops belong in which season and that tending to them once during the correct season will yield a seed back, making the process sustainable.
Anything else that could be learned is purely to get more seeds or get giant crops, and both of these benefits are well worth the small effort put in in my eyes.

Meanwhile when it comes to bunny farms like that, it still needs maintainance, since the spiderden wont just stay a spiderden forever and surviving bunnymen might eat some of the carrots youd get out of the farm [or worse, surviving spiders might eat all the meat].
Also sidenote but I was more thinking of farms involving winona's catapults because those have almost no risk of loot being eaten, i actually forgot about farms utilizing spiders. Either way farms are definitely a good source of food, I'm not denying that. I'm just saying they aren't quite as simple as you make them out to be either. Not any simpler than farming is anyway.

For mantience all you do is destroy the tier 3 den that the bunnymen killed all the spiders to seems simple enough just reap the rewards otherwise.

Also I didn't include character perks because it wouldn't be fair to the comparison because simply add Wendy to the scenario and you instantly have a auto farm with no risks involved at all.

[ArubaroBeefalo]

6 hours ago, HowlVoid said:

You could open him up and be surprised by all the blood and guts that pour out. 

sausage, yummy!