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ONI is a very good game, in my opinion the best in this style of game, however KLEI urgently needs to launch a quality of life att, to reduce this insane lag that the game has. From cycle 70 on my colony I can no longer play above 30 fps, and if I put it to 3x then it drops to less than 20, and the problem is not my pc, I can run games like FORZA 5 on ultra more 80fps easily.

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1 hour ago, Timmmy said:

ONI is a very good game, in my opinion the best in this style of game, however KLEI urgently needs to launch a quality of life att, to reduce this insane lag that the game has. From cycle 70 on my colony I can no longer play above 30 fps, and if I put it to 3x then it drops to less than 20, and the problem is not my pc, I can run games like FORZA 5 on ultra more 80fps easily.

It is just made this way that eventually it will lag out any system, the only question is how much will it take.

The fact that you can play other games, even with better graphics doesn't proof anything about your PC suitability for ONI. As much as I've read for ONI you want max speed on single core, low memory latency and fast operating memory, GPU don't play a role here, unless like additional operating memory. Of course having any dedicated GPU card would still be better than integrated, 'cause integrated card uses CPU and RAM, basically slowing down performance.

I play with 4-5 FPS and I am still happy that my computer, thought not made for gaming, but handles oxygen somehow.

Ryzen 5 2500u RAM 8 GB GPU integrated Vega 8.

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Your forza does nearly only depend on your graphics card. The rest... negligible. Oni is the opposite. It depends on CPU and RAM for 99,999999% of the load thats going on. You dont even need a dedicated GPU, a simple iGPU is enough for this game, while you do not want to run any other game with that chips. 

 

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3 hours ago, SharraShimada said:

Seu forza depende quase apenas de sua placa de vídeo. O resto ... insignificante. Oni é o oposto. Depende da CPU e da RAM para 99,999999% da carga que está acontecendo. Você nem precisa de um GPU dedicado, um simples iGPU é o suficiente para este jogo, enquanto você não quer rodar nenhum outro jogo com aquele chip. 

 

 

3 hours ago, SharraShimada said:

Seu forza depende quase apenas de sua placa de vídeo. O resto ... insignificante. Oni é o oposto. Depende da CPU e da RAM para 99,999999% da carga que está acontecendo. Você nem precisa de um GPU dedicado, um simples iGPU é o suficiente para este jogo, enquanto você não quer rodar nenhum outro jogo com aquele chip. 

 

Not really, although it seems that forza only uses GPU, it is one of the heaviest games in terms of CPU. Running on Ultra or Extemo, the game reaches almost 60% CPU usage on my Ryzen 5 3600, other ''old'' games don't go far from that either, like Witcher 3 and Assasins Odyssey, the point is that the game is poorly optimized since a long time ago, and you say you play the game at 5fps and ''everything's fine'', but not.

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Nope. it does not use 80% of your CPU. It uses 80% of the relevant parts of the cores, and they report back, they are at heavy load. You could always do other work on the CPU just fine, while playing Forza. (If you find workload that does not use the same parts). The game is using primarily the parts for calculation the geometry of the graphics. And yes that scales up with higher resolutions. 

ONI on the other hand uses way more different parts of your CPU, and thats why even an older CPU can compete, but scales with frequency that hard. Its a huge difference if you run 1 or 2 cores on 5GHz, or 10 cores on 3GHz. Forza would benefit from the more cores. Oni will not.

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1 hour ago, SharraShimada said:

Não. ele não usa 80% de sua CPU. Ele usa 80% das partes relevantes dos núcleos, e eles relatam que estão com carga pesada. Você sempre pode fazer outros trabalhos na CPU muito bem, enquanto joga Forza. (Se você encontrar carga de trabalho que não usa as mesmas peças). O jogo está usando principalmente as peças para o cálculo da geometria dos gráficos. E sim, isso aumenta com resoluções mais altas. 

O ONI, por outro lado, usa muito mais partes diferentes de sua CPU, e é por isso que até uma CPU mais antiga pode competir, mas escala com frequência tão difícil. É uma grande diferença se você executa 1 ou 2 núcleos em 5 GHz ou 10 núcleos em 3GHz. Forza se beneficiaria com mais núcleos. Oni não vai.

Exactly, what you just said is that FORZA is a well-optimized game, which was made to be used by several cores, while ONI only uses 2 and that overloads the game. And that's what I wanted the developers (among other improvements) to change, because ONI is a game that came out of BETA for over 1 year, and it's not possible that no one had the great idea to improve the game's performance.

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1 hour ago, Timmmy said:

Exactly, what you just said is that FORZA is a well-optimized game, which was made to be used by several cores, while ONI only uses 2 and that overloads the game. And that's what I wanted the developers (among other improvements) to change, because ONI is a game that came out of BETA for over 1 year, and it's not possible that no one had the great idea to improve the game's performance.

oni uses more than two cores, but problem is that most off calculation is made at main thread what may feel like its 2 core game

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18 hours ago, Timmmy said:

Exactly, what you just said is that FORZA is a well-optimized game, which was made to be used by several cores, while ONI only uses 2 and that overloads the game. And that's what I wanted the developers (among other improvements) to change, because ONI is a game that came out of BETA for over 1 year, and it's not possible that no one had the great idea to improve the game's performance.

No, what he said is that Forza is not comparable to ONI for performance. They are drastically different games with drastically different performance bottlenecks. It'd be fair to compare performance between ONI and Factorio, because they both have a CPU bottleneck. It's unreasonable to compare performance between ONI and Forza, because Forza has a GPU bottleneck.

The way ONI is designed by it's going to slow down at some point, there's simply just that many calculations that need to be made to keep the simulation going. Honestly any performance they saved with optimizations was probably spent with the additional calculations needed for the new radiation layer in the simulation.

 

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43 minutes ago, Slavon Blue said:

Não, o que ele disse é que o Forza não é comparável ao ONI em desempenho. Eles são jogos drasticamente diferentes com gargalos de desempenho drasticamente diferentes. Seria justo comparar o desempenho entre ONI e Factorio, porque ambos têm um gargalo de CPU. Não é razoável comparar o desempenho entre ONI e Forza, porque Forza tem um gargalo de GPU.

A forma como o ONI foi projetado vai desacelerar em algum ponto, simplesmente há muitos cálculos que precisam ser feitos para manter a simulação em andamento. Honestamente, qualquer desempenho que eles economizaram com otimizações provavelmente foi gasto com os cálculos adicionais necessários para a nova camada de radiação na simulação.

 

Yes, we can compare ONI with factorio, and even then we will see a big difference, Factorio even after 100 hours of gameplay, I can still play normally above 100 fps, even if my base has more than 5k drones, trains, factories, reactors nukes working all at the same time. The point here is that I can't understand why even after so long since the game's release, they still haven't done any quality of life att... it seems that people just accept it and say: ''it's all right''

(I have more than 200 hours of factorio and more than 400 of ONI in the base version of the game, because DLC is simply unplayable, since as I said, from cycle 70-100, the game gets so lag, I can't play )

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20 hours ago, Timmmy said:

Exactly, what you just said is that FORZA is a well-optimized game, which was made to be used by several cores, while ONI only uses 2 and that overloads the game. And that's what I wanted the developers (among other improvements) to change, because ONI is a game that came out of BETA for over 1 year, and it's not possible that no one had the great idea to improve the game's performance.

Nope. Let me explain it this way. 

Forza is a huge bunch of small items, you can put on thousands of very fast cars and transport them to the target. 

Oni is a big chunk of something, and you need a really heavy lifter to even think of tranporting that thing. But throwing more and more and even more lifters at it, wont speed up the process. Your fast cars are completely useless for the task. 

ONI is the one exception that confirms the standard rule "more cores are better" while it does not apply to it.

You just cant parallelize everything. Its just not possible. For example 1+1=x | x+5=y | 7/x+y=z | z*x/y=A. How do you parallelize this? Right, you dont. You need the results for x,y and z before you even begin to calculate A, because without them your lost. You cant start calculating A until you have the other results. So core 4 would be idle until the very end, when core 1-3 have finished the work and are useless again. One core can calculate this with the same speed as 4 cores could. Yes even faster, if you count in a very big CPU with >16 Cores and you have to move the results to another cache for another core first. 

If you have one potatoe. How much faster can you make fries from it, when you put 80 people in the same room instead of one?

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8 minutes ago, SharraShimada said:

Nope. Let me explain it this way. 

Forza is a huge bunch of small items, you can put on thousands of very fast cars and transport them to the target. 

Oni is a big chunk of something, and you need a really heavy lifter to even think of tranporting that thing. But throwing more and more and even more lifters at it, wont speed up the process. Your fast cars are completely useless for the task. 

ONI is the one exception that confirms the standard rule "more cores are better" while it does not apply to it.

You just cant parallelize everything. Its just not possible. For example 1+1=x | x+5=y | 7/x+y=z | z*x/y=A. How do you parallelize this? Right, you dont. You need the results for x,y and z before you even begin to calculate A, because without them your lost. You cant start calculating A until you have the other results. So core 4 would be idle until the very end, when core 1-3 have finished the work and are useless again. One core can calculate this with the same speed as 4 cores could. Yes even faster, if you count in a very big CPU with >16 Cores and you have to move the results to another cache for another core first. 

If you have one potatoe. How much faster can you make fries from it, when you put 80 people in the same room instead of one?

even tho im agree with you about that, i to see that there is possible make performance

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2 hours ago, gabberworld said:

even tho im agree with you about that, i to see that there is possible make performance

I know your oppinion and your arguments. Do you want to share them here again? I guess while the current day here is only a few hours old, you havent made your statement today?

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7 minutes ago, SharraShimada said:

I know your oppinion and your arguments. Do you want to share them here again? I guess while the current day here is only a few hours old, you havent made your statement today?

well, first off lets scroll back, this game had more fps. but after at one version fps drastically drop down. you forget that already?

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11 minutes ago, gabberworld said:

bem, primeiro vamos rolar para trás, este jogo tinha mais fps. mas depois de uma versão, os fps caem drasticamente. você já se esqueceu disso?

as i said, the base game was playable despite the technical issues... now the final version of dlc is totally broken.

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1 hour ago, gabberworld said:

isso não é verdade. intel i7-12700 mostra que este jogo funciona bem a longo prazo. problema é que houve queda de fps, o que é mais provável de consertar novamente, também conhecido como aumentar o desempenho

So instead of the developers fixing their game, I need to upgrade my pc? What about people who don't have the conditions or don't want to upgrade their pc? Can't they just play the game?

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1 hour ago, Timmmy said:

or don't want to upgrade their pc

that is not really they issue.

1 hour ago, Timmmy said:

I need to upgrade my pc?

nope. you not need

1 hour ago, Timmmy said:

What about people who don't have the conditions

now this is the right text where every developer should think that they product needs better performance. 

but as always there is also hardware limitation, when app reach to that point. then there is nothing what they can todo about that.

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Always the same discussions over the years. Hopefully Klei continues to work on the game, maybe they manage to do an ground breaking cpu update in 5 years or so. I wonder how life will be in 2026 on planet earth and in dupe land. :p

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7 hours ago, gabberworld said:

mas, como sempre, também há limitação de hardware, quando o aplicativo chega a esse ponto. então não há nada que eles possam fazer sobre isso.

So why is this not reported on steam? When we look at the minimum and recommended requirements at no time does it say that we need a super processor to run the game... So people buy the game, play for 10-15 hours, which is the time to reach a cycle between 100-150, the game starts to become extremely unstable and it is no longer possible to refund, because the 2 hours have already passed... image.png.70a264d5611a6ec6dbb6717cb6936f76.png

The game has been out of beta for years, and even after so long, they forgot to update the minimum requirements, because of course you don't just need a 64bit processor to be able to play this game.

 

(When I say playing the game, I'm talking about after a few hours the game starts to get unstable... Because it's possible to open the game with a 64bit processor, but I very much doubt that after 20 hours of playing you with a dual core will still be able to same performance as the beginning...)

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1 hour ago, Timmmy said:

extremely unstable

 

define unstable. i can play this game with my old MSi qt70 2qd laptop easily. fps is not the issue in this game because test shows that this game is possible run even at very low fps

are you sure that you have at-least 4 gib free memory when you start play this game? because i to seen that allot players tell that they have 8 gib memory in they pc. that may not enoh because all your pc programs eat memory as well

my laptop i have currently over 11 gib memory usage without play the game. that shows to me that i need atleast 16 gib memory.

note i have 32 gib tho for make sure that this is not issue

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26 minutes ago, gabberworld said:

definir instável.

define unstable: A game that you start with normal FPS and after 15-20 hours of gameplay it drops to 30 or less (we are talking about normal people with normal PCs, not super computers) and over time it drops further.

But what is normal for you? Play at 10 FPS? Sorry, but I think you're talking like someone who loves the game, because any new person who joins the game right now and you tell them that in 20 hours of gameplay they'll start playing with less than 30 FPS, and from now on 30- 40 hours she will be playing with less than 10, I doubt that person would want to play the game.

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30 minutes ago, Timmmy said:

define unstable: A game that you start with normal FPS and after 15-20 hours of gameplay it drops to 30 or less (we are talking about normal people with normal PCs, not super computers) and over time it drops further.

But what is normal for you? Play at 10 FPS? Sorry, but I think you're talking like someone who loves the game, because any new person who joins the game right now and you tell them that in 20 hours of gameplay they'll start playing with less than 30 FPS, and from now on 30- 40 hours she will be playing with less than 10, I doubt that person would want to play the game.

i hate low fps as well but im also developer so i to know that this type games what not have limits start at some-point use more recurses.

FORZA 5 is not this type games. you cant build at there unlimited building and so on

note i can play just fine also this type game with my old laptop

like

final fantasy 7 remake

Red Dead Redemption 2

GTA 5

and allot other titles

but most off them are 3d games. this game is 2d and does handled 99% from cpu and memory,

i to hope that they find one day a way use more GPU and less cpu . for make it run with more fps. but currently it is like it is

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