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Ranking characters on how much they need a re-work and explaining why.


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I decided to try Maxwell and he is in my opinion in need of a rework. All wood and mining he can do can be outdone by Wurt save for stumps, plus if a treeguard shows up Wurt and her army of merms can dispatch it must faster. Shadow Duelists are all but useless. His only real perk seems to be that he can be permanently insane to farm nightmare fuel. All in all I don't believe his frailty is backed up by any positive boosts to his character to justify such a low health stat, especially when other characters can do what he does, some much better than he can, and they receive no penalty for it.

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On 8/11/2020 at 4:03 PM, ShadowDuelist said:

That was part of its previous bad design, why would he need it? Also beaver idols require wood to craft so you indirectly still eat wood. It was absolutely pointless being a lumberjack and having to eat most of what you produce over time just to remain as human.

He doesn't have to make a better job, he's better at chopping the trees, being a fighter is not his thing.

He can be a tank if there is noone else in that role, or to support fighter classes EG: Hound wave or depth worms comes, moose charge can keeep most enemies busy while the warrior players quickly finish off everything one by one.

Weremoose is more of free armor, with a decent attack and decent crowd control + okay dps, it doesn't turn woodie into another fighter charcter, its something else.You basically get a free thul armor (90%!) you can access just at the exchange of food.

Also his charge is unique as no other charcter can kill groups of strong enemies at the same time completely alone like he does, giving him an alternative usage over Abigail. EG: can kill up to 40 treeguards at the same time, up to 3 people's late game hound wave, frog rains, up to 4 spider queens, dozens of terrorbeaks at the same time during nightmare phase, etc.

During very late game when you have access to thul armors, bone armor and dark swords you will use the moose less, but I still use it mostly as an offtank/crowd control weapon, and a main way to farm lots of treeguards at the same time. Also keep in mind that moose lets you fight in complete darkness for free.

He doesn't gain more hp because he gains a ton of armor, which is basically even stronger than duplicting his hp. You can tank A LOT without jellybeans, all you need is to know the proper timing of how much damage can you take and when to retreat of a battle.  

The main way to fight without jellybeans is to use the form and when you reach 10 hp, move away from the battle (using charge) turn to woodie, eat 1 healing food immediately (eg: a jerky, perogi or surf and turf)  mostly to prevent more hunger damage, then heal quickly with healing salves/honey poultices, and when you reach 150 hp again eat another moose idol to continue fighting. It may sound like a lot or trouble but in reality all of this I've mentioned happens in less than 10 seconds.

I should probably show in a video a highlight of advanced uses of Woodie and his weaknesses at some point, Woodie certainly doesn't need changes.

this!! Woodie is so damn amazing I'm always puzzled when people think he needs a rework... IMO he is pretty much the most diverse character rn in the game by far... locomotion, aoe tank, miner/logger. I love Woodie post rework!

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This discussion sure was fun to read.

But, just to leave my opinion, Woodie's Rework gave him more of a Generalist role than just being a Canadian pun, since now he collects resources fast, can be a support, is able to explore faster AND through water, and in Weremoose he's a goddamn damage Sponge, yeah, sure he isn't the best on these tasks, but he can make them all without sacrificing other perks, like Maxwell, Wolfgang or Wigfrid do, Willow's rework adding her Bernie, yes, sure, was dissapointing, but that doesn't means it's bad, Bernie has to be the greatest tool Willow has by now, specially if you're fighting agaisnt a boss and there's Terrorbeaks messing around, and Wendy's rework finally made Abigail something more than just an Ectoplasm Shield, she can finally take care of at least Deerclops by herself properly.

The only rework that i'm not 100% happy with is Winona's Rework. She's just a "Change-and-go-back" character, and, ye, i agree about Wurt being terribly dissapointing and a bad character, which is even more dissapointing considering she's a DLC character.

Also, Walter is a GREAT character, not the best, but sure a great one. Y'all forgetting he can slingshot enemies while riding Woby AND can do literally anything without dropping sanity (And if you're in late games and need to be insane, just damage yourself collecting cactuses or Charlie's Flowers and then heal the health you've lost. Walter doesn't need that much damage to be completely insane,  so it's enough with just the pick of a single cactus or eating a few Kelp Fronds, Blue Caps or even a single Red Cap is enough to get back to 0 sanity if you've killed a terrorbeak, so the "I recover sanity when killing Terrorbeaks" argument is not valid here).

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9 hours ago, Kommu said:

Weremoose he's a goddamn damage Sponge

im truly enjoying woodie, i like the other 2 forms a lot (goose is just hilarious) but having weremoose to clean the ruins feels so refreshing

so for me, even missing the old woodie, his rework was 10/10. Its strong but nothing so OP and is so fun

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On 8/11/2020 at 4:25 PM, SinancoTheBest said:

Willow: I too would have liked a little more pronounced pyromancy but she is perfectly fine where she is. Her rework made her the ultimate survivalist, outclassing Wilson at everything. She is now often played and her view as the Griefer character is diminsihing. She still has meaningful fire quirks through her immunity, effective firestarting and resistance to overheating. She doesn't have meaningful downsides but it doesn't hurt her character as she doesn't bring anything unbalanced to the table; if antyhing she's the ultimate vanilla character excelling at surviving herself.

Willow has no downsides at all. The most outstanding one is "fragile to col" which is untrue, we are talking about a character who can stand in the fire. And is almost immune to overheating. You can be 90 degrees hot and you wouldn't notice it hurting.

In vanilla, however, I still see her the same. It is not hard to drop tons of grass on your feet, light it up and watch your sanity go up. You don't even need 450 grass unlike in guide videos, a stack is more than fine. Reminder that you can kill any type of mob in seconds using fire, which Willow is immune to.

  

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On 8/10/2020 at 10:43 PM, Theukon-dos said:

Snip the Hedgehog

I agree with most of the things said here, except for the "spiders are useless in combat"

While they do need a Webber exclusive buff, they are somewhat competent in combat

I developed a saying from one of my Webber play-throughs, "Never Underestimate Spiders", because I saw just 2 level 2 nests kill an entire Big Treegaurd

On 8/22/2020 at 7:47 PM, hoppin mandrake said:

Snip the Hedgehog 2

While Max NEEDS a buff, it's not too easy to keep going to the swamp every time you need to commit mass deforestation

On 8/11/2020 at 9:36 AM, Mike23Ua said:

Snip the Hedgehog 3 and Knuckles

Charlie HATES Maxwell, given by her comments on some of the character's quotes once hidden in the game files

It's likely she didn't want to free Maxwell, or she was waiting until someone will a lot less knowledge of her and the constant was trapped on the throne (ei. Wilson)

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Tbh I don't know why woodie's totems give hunger, when you transform you always have the wereme meter full .Everytime you revert back to the human form you're starving anyways.

And from wormwood I would boost his ability to plant in general, maybe anything that wormwood plants gives a guaranteed additional seed. And bring back his downside of being flammable, that was super fun.

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