Nick777 Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 So I know the most common layout is to put all your power onto heavi-watt and run the heavi-watt across your base hidden in corridors just for them. But I have been seeing layouts where you can route power back to your batteries using transformers, which allows you to spread out the location of your generators. Everything is working as expected if I use one generator per line. But the math is getting wonky when I use multiple generators on one line. So where things work as expected is when I have one 2kW petrol generator: 1) (2 kW petrol) into (1 kW + 1 kW transformers) into heavi-watt power strip -> no overproduction, no circuit damage 2) (2 kW petrol) into (4 kW large transformer) into heavi-watt power strip -> no overproduction, no circuit damage Where things don't work as expected is when I replace the 2 kW petrol with one 800 W hydrogen and two 600 W coal gens: 3) (800 W hydrogen + 600 W coal + 600 W coal) into (1 kW + 1 kW transformer) -> circuit status reads 1800 W / 0 W and reports show overproduction of both coal and hydrogen but mostly hydrogen. 2 kW consumer network is flickering in and out of power. 4) (800 W hydrogen + 600 W coal + 600 W coal) into (4 kW large transformer) -> circuit status reads 2400 W / 0 W and wires burning up before transformer as it is filling up capacity, then it reads 2000 W / 0 W as the transformer's capacity stabilizes but reports show steady overproduction of the hydrogen generator, which is kind of crazy because my circuit is setup to use 2 kW continuously so to be having any overproduction with no power outage would mean that the gens are making more than 2 kW of power. I don't know if this is the intended use of power transformers because it allows you to easily bypass using heavi-watt wiring. I can basically build my petrol generator in the oil biome and use conductive wiring through walls to bring the power back to my base. This exploit could be fixed by only allowing transformers to output to lower wattage. So basically if you have 2 kW going into the transformer it can only bring the output up to 2 kW. Wonky Power.sav Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102591-power-transforming-into-heavi-watt-wire-math-not-adding-up/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lifegrow Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 I always find a buffer battery kind of fixes everything : Spoiler Not sure if i've missed the point, but this is generating 2kw and using 2kw - the smart battery will never fill, and merely facilitates the request of the transformers. 5c5c3532772c9_WonkyPower.sav Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102591-power-transforming-into-heavi-watt-wire-math-not-adding-up/#findComment-1152396 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neotuck Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 58 minutes ago, Lifegrow said: Not sure if i've missed the point, but this is generating 2kw and using 2kw - the smart battery will never fill, and merely facilitates the request of the transformers. when I loaded the save the two transformers were pulling 1.8kw I have no idea why Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102591-power-transforming-into-heavi-watt-wire-math-not-adding-up/#findComment-1152436 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lifegrow Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 30 minutes ago, Neotuck said: when I loaded the save the two transformers were pulling 1.8kw I have no idea why The original save or the fixed one in my post? Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102591-power-transforming-into-heavi-watt-wire-math-not-adding-up/#findComment-1152447 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neotuck Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Just now, Lifegrow said: The original save or the fixed one in my post? original, I couldn't figure out what was wrong so I didn't reply Here's a pic of the original, the pull is 1.8kw Here's a pic with the smart battery added, the pull is 2kw I understand that fixed the problem, question is: how? Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102591-power-transforming-into-heavi-watt-wire-math-not-adding-up/#findComment-1152449 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saturnus Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 47 minutes ago, Neotuck said: I understand that fixed the problem, question is: how? It might be related to how the first tick of a liquid pump is always less than 10kg. Sometimes it's 9990g, sometimes 8kg, sometimes 6kg, but always less than 10kg for some reason. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102591-power-transforming-into-heavi-watt-wire-math-not-adding-up/#findComment-1152468 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neotuck Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 2 hours ago, Saturnus said: It might be related to how the first tick of a liquid pump is always less than 10kg. Sometimes it's 9990g, sometimes 8kg, sometimes 6kg, but always less than 10kg for some reason. ok first nether coal or hydrogen generators use liquid pumps to run and I'm talking about the pull from the 2 transformers each has 1kw worth of fridges and lamps to power Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102591-power-transforming-into-heavi-watt-wire-math-not-adding-up/#findComment-1152564 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saturnus Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 6 minutes ago, Neotuck said: ok first nether coal or hydrogen generators use liquid pumps to run I didn't say that. I said it might be related to the same issue. That being that there from some machinery seem to be some "frames" lost each time they're turned on because it doesn't make sense either that a pump already used, so the internal storage is filled, and fully submerged wouldn't give the full 10kg in the first second. Note that for pumps the issue goes away if you hook them up to a liquid storage. As soon as a liquid storage is connected directly to the pump then the first second from the pump does give 10kg. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102591-power-transforming-into-heavi-watt-wire-math-not-adding-up/#findComment-1152566 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neotuck Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Okay but it still didn't answer my original question We have two coal generators and one hydrogen generator generating 2kw. We have refrigerators and lamps totaling 2kw divided between two Transformers. But for some reason the two Transformers only pull 1.8kw. adding a battery on the generator side seems to fix the problem so that they are pulling 2kg. My question again is how did that fix it? Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102591-power-transforming-into-heavi-watt-wire-math-not-adding-up/#findComment-1152577 Share on other sites More sharing options...
biopon Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 You can simplify the problem into this: Odd things: - A purely nonfunctional battery added to the generator side does indeed fix the problem. - Using a single 2KW generator instead of 600+600+800 also fixes the issue. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102591-power-transforming-into-heavi-watt-wire-math-not-adding-up/#findComment-1152624 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrRoguelike Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 My guess is that in the 600 + 600 + 800 no battery case one of the transformers is pulling 1k out of the 600 + 600 and losing the other 200, and then the second transformer pulls the 800. A battery means the transformers can try to pull from the battery (unlimited) and the battery can pull from the generators (also unlimited input) Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102591-power-transforming-into-heavi-watt-wire-math-not-adding-up/#findComment-1152642 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neotuck Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 26 minutes ago, DrRoguelike said: My guess is that in the 600 + 600 + 800 no battery case one of the transformers is pulling 1k out of the 600 + 600 and losing the other 200, and then the second transformer pulls the 800. A battery means the transformers can try to pull from the battery (unlimited) and the battery can pull from the generators (also unlimited input) That makes the most sense Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102591-power-transforming-into-heavi-watt-wire-math-not-adding-up/#findComment-1152657 Share on other sites More sharing options...
biopon Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 10 minutes ago, Neotuck said: That makes the most sense It also happens with a single large transformer though. Transformers do draw in 1KW 'ticks', even the large ones, so maybe the 200w needs to be buffered in the battery for a short amount of time; short enough for it to not show up as charge. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102591-power-transforming-into-heavi-watt-wire-math-not-adding-up/#findComment-1152664 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saturnus Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 7 hours ago, biopon said: Transformers do draw in 1KW 'ticks', even the large ones, so maybe the 200w needs to be buffered in the battery for a short amount of time; short enough for it to not show up as charge. That's exactly what I saying as well... or more less so. There's some weirdness going on with the underlying ticks. I also think that as the game gets more multi-thread it's something we have to get used to for a while until the game is finished completely where these quirks will probably disappear. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102591-power-transforming-into-heavi-watt-wire-math-not-adding-up/#findComment-1152795 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick777 Posted April 5, 2019 Author Share Posted April 5, 2019 On 2/8/2019 at 11:39 AM, Lifegrow said: The original save or the fixed one in my post? Aye lifegrow! The master himself. I watch you on twitch from time to time. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/102591-power-transforming-into-heavi-watt-wire-math-not-adding-up/#findComment-1175192 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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