Suggestion: This could be implemented in game as a way of cooling that would fit with the theme

[TheOlz]

With the introduction of radiant piping we really have all the pieces to solve just about any heat puzzle.

If you think putting wheezeworts in Hydrogen in too complicated, you might be playing the wrong game. lol

[KittenIsAGeek]

6 hours ago, Smuch said:

How about the argment for an /efficient/ or at least not complete S@8*! simple building that remove the heat ?

(Seriously the hydrofan is awfull, it requires tons of water and duplicant labor and it barely works. The aera it works in teribly small and it cools things by what ? 0.1 degree if you're lucky ?

I'd rather we had a regular electrecity powered fan who moved heat aroud (well cooled a column/rowof air tiles but at the price of generating heat behind it or somthing) but at least did it reliably.rather than thise monment of uselesness.

(Or at last some rebalancing to make it more usefull))

The Hydrofan used to be way unbalanced.. a dupe could give themselves hypothermia in about 1/4 cycle using it.  Now its barely effective, but it does work.  Here's a screenshot of it in action.  Its difficult to tell, but there IS a temperature gradient.  Before I built the fan (for the demonstration) the right side was 2c warmer than the left.  Now it is 3c colder.  It cools 40 watts and the research station produces 5 watts of heat...

Spoiler

 

[Smuch]

31 minutes ago, KittenIsAGeek said:

The Hydrofan used to be way unbalanced.. a dupe could give themselves hypothermia in about 1/4 cycle using it.  Now its barely effective, but it does work.  Here's a screenshot of it in action.  Its difficult to tell, but there IS a temperature gradient.  Before I built the fan (for the demonstration) the right side was 2c warmer than the left.  Now it is 3c colder.  It cools 40 watts and the research station produces 5 watts of heat...

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Allright fair enough, I wasn't playing the game when they were effective.

Still, givenhe investement in space, duplicant labor and water needed to use this thing, it would be nice if there was a smal bump in effectiveness to hit a beter spot betwen 'barely effective' and 'overpowered'.

 

[KittenIsAGeek]

10 minutes ago, Smuch said:

Still, givenhe investement in space, duplicant labor and water needed to use this thing, it would be nice if there was a smal bump in effectiveness to hit a beter spot betwen 'barely effective' and 'overpowered'.

 

Yep.  I never use them because they're a water hog, continually use a duplicant's labor, AND have less effect than a single potted wheezewart.

[Mayveena]

8 hours ago, Smuch said:

How about the argment for an /efficient/ or at least not complete S@8*! simple building that remove the heat ?

(Seriously the hydrofan is awfull, it requires tons of water and duplicant labor and it barely works. The aera it works in teribly small and it cools things by what ? 0.1 degree if you're lucky ?

I'd rather we had a regular electrecity powered fan who moved heat aroud (well cooled a column/rowof air tiles but at the price of generating heat behind it or somthing) but at least did it reliably.rather than thise monment of uselesness.

(Or at last some rebalancing to make it more usefull))

This is what I mean. Heat seems to be a core part of the game, and from what I can see is not addressed by core solutions. As I said before, you have core solutions for food, water, bathrooms, stress and germs. There are obvious answers to those problems. What's cool is that you can work with those answers in a simple way (which won't be the most efficient way) or you can create a complex answer that will be efficient but time intensive and may not have the stability of the other answers.

I don't see why that can't happen with heat. And for all I(we) know that may be in the next update, there's been a ton of discussion on how to address heat as it is.

[KittenIsAGeek]

I don't understand what you mean by "its not addressed by core solutions."  We have aquatuners and thermo regulators to move heat elsewhere, space heaters and tepidizers to add heat, the hydrofan and constant-output buildings to remove heat.. Are buildings provided by Klei part of the "core solutions" or not?  Heck, do a little exploring, there are wheezewarts and AETNs to destroy heat directly.  Or you can vent to space.

In the early game, the best way to avoid heat-death is to keep hot things outside your base.  You can have solutions for dealing with heat by cycle 30.  Use the aquatuner or thermo regulator to move heat to somewhere you can manage it.  

Late game you can experiment with various set-ups and maybe turn the extra heat into a boiler.  Up to you.  There are plenty of solutions that are a part of the game.

Play around with things.  Experiment.  The tools are there.

[Mayveena]

If I spent the time to post links to the multitude of threads both here and on reddit regarding trying to solve the issue of heat, it'd be at least an hour. The tools that are given don't apparently solve the issue. And there are so many one doesn't know where to start. The ones that are currently  ingame don't appear to do much as described in the game, and they haven't done much that's sustainable when I use them. 

 

[BlueLance]

On 07/07/2018 at 3:59 PM, Mayveena said:

You can look up my public Steam profile and see that I have played 773 hours. My name here is the same as it is on Steam, so no, I'm not new and I do explore and use the ice biome, mostly for the reduction of heat. 

So, you have played more than me and say your a casual player... and here i thought I was a veteran.

On 08/07/2018 at 1:07 AM, Mayveena said:

Not putting wheezeworts in a hydrogen atmosphere because that sounds super complicated if I'm using the wheezeworts to cool my plants.

ehhhh it isnt complicated, a pump and a room and your sorted, Wheezeworts work in any closed space but they cannot battle with intense heat, so if you are heating it up then its your own fault for not preparing, Also there is an a device for cooling air that you get access to fairly easily, but it would be wasted unless you put it in a room with a gas like hydrogen.

20 hours ago, Mayveena said:

This is what I mean. Heat seems to be a core part of the game, and from what I can see is not addressed by core solutions.

It is, you just refuse to make the most of your wheezeworts which are relatively easy to get, and you can couple it with a thermo regulator for even better results. You can liquefy most gasses using just a regulator, hydrogen and wheezeworts. Although that is more complicated.

[KittenIsAGeek]

54 minutes ago, Mayveena said:

If I spent the time to post links to the multitude of threads both here and on reddit regarding trying to solve the issue of heat, it'd be at least an hour. The tools that are given don't apparently solve the issue. And there are so many one doesn't know where to start. The ones that are currently  ingame don't appear to do much as described in the game, and they haven't done much that's sustainable when I use them. 

 

The tools that are given very much solve the issue.  Right now I'm attempting to run a base using only a slush geyser for cooling.  It isn't going that well, I need the other tools. However, in my previous bases where I made use of aquatuners and fixed-output buildings, heat was only an issue when I didn't use them.

In case you didn't see them, here are a couple of easy-to-build systems for dealing with heat:

There are many many other alternatives.

[JonnyMonroe]

1 hour ago, Mayveena said:

If I spent the time to post links to the multitude of threads both here and on reddit regarding trying to solve the issue of heat, it'd be at least an hour. The tools that are given

I promise you every single one of those threads will have multiple solutions posted in them. You mentioned further up the thread about things like food and water having direct simple solutions but they're no more or less complex than heat. Food starts out simple and gets more complex as you develop to higher throughput, quality and sustainability. Water is the same. So is heat. The simple solutions are there but they aren't sustainable or scaleable. This is true for every system in ONI. Even power starts out as a hamster wheel, 5 tiles of wire, a battery and a research station and ends up a complex network of power stations, heavy wires, smart batteries and transformers. If you think a wheezewort in hydrogen or separate water systems is complex I'm not sure there's much help I can offer beyond 'open creative mode and paint in cold water'. That seems to be what you're asking.

[Sevio]

You don't need to move to a sustainable solution right off the bat either, especially not with heat. There is a lot of stored cold on the map in the ice biomes. You can run a big radiator pipe through one, add some tempshift plates and have cold water to cool the important parts of your base for hundreds of cycles.

Although you will be giving up free harvests of sleet wheat there when you melt an ice biome, that's something you can work around with other foods.

[Keylan]

Heat is diffrent from other issues as it is more of a mid t late game mechanic.

As long as one walls of his base a little and keeps heat in mind while exploring it's a non issue for the first 100 cirles. if one is aware how watersuplly and oxygen production affects heat it's totaly possible to reach cirle 150-200 without colling the base and just prevent heating it.

As far i i'am concernt the solution the topic opener aks fore is already there in form of weezeworts. They are an mid game solution to get accustomed to heat issues and have an early and super easy solution.

Keep in mind that weezeworts and the ATEN are already game solutions far of realism for the sake of an easy solution. In reality there is no way to destroy heat only to transfer it. Big diffenz indeet is that the universe is a much bigger system than the ONI map and in general it is much cooler than the map.

The problem why most people lose their base to heat is, that most of the time when one realises an issue it's already too late to reolve. Cooling an bheat up base is incredible difficult compared to keeping a tempered base stable. Furthermore heat solution usualy take a good amount of time to set up and take at least several cycles to show effect.

Even more relevant, almost everything to resarch an build and aquire new materials adds to the heat production. So peaople are exited about refining metals but wherent aware of those refinign facilitys killing them without setting up cooling beforehand.

So here are my tree basic rules for dealing with heat early:

• Wall of: Isulation tiles are a priority tech and seperating in and outside of the base and furthermore heatzones in the base. An open base usualy dies when exploring and expanding..
• Keep Cool: this sounds stupid but it means to reduce heat sources inside the base. To build an refrigerator early is a dathtrap. For one it consumes tons of energy and the energyproduction usualy brings heat, but it also produces a lot of heat itself. Also oxygen from electrolysers is not managable without cooling. Every piece of power consumer is a risk as well as bringing in hot materials from outside,
• Collect the Cool Stuff consume the Hot Stuff: Ice bioms are exploration priority. Not only for weezeworts but at least that much for ice.Brining ice into the base not only tremendosly inceases the early water supply but also cools the base. Almost all lategame colling solutions build on water as the amount of thermal energy is huge and it can be transported. Bringign ice, snow and poluted ice from one or two ice biomes sould buy at least 80 circles more like 150 cirles of tempreature controll. If heat still is an issue keep in mind to consume hot resources first. Keep serveal ponds of water and use the hottest possible for electrolysers or watering plants.

If one realizes his base as a heat issue, usualy it's time to jump back to a save 10 to 30 circels old to solve the issue. Solving it after it occured often is extremly hard. 

If anything i think ONI could use more or bigger cold biomes. At least on earth we usualy have more of a problem keeping things hot than cold. To find a cold place anywhere in the world you are either there or just have to dig a 10meter deep hole and expand it to a cave. Almoste everywher in the world u get a nice place at 18°C or colder. Compared to this ONI is increadibly hot. Shure dupes are realy temp resistant, but to mee it's odd that ever earlygame hot is more of an issue than cold.

The other thing ONI could use is more help functions for mid game issues like water supply and heat. Toilets, oxigen and food get addressed early, water supply and heat too early when ther are not of concern jet. It's an alpha game so no complaints, but for me some of the advices come at a bad timing.

 

 

 

 

 

[FIXBUGFIXBUGFIX]

No one want to talk about that paper?

This is the abstract

Quote

The high density of heat generated in power electronics and optoelectronic devices is a critical bottleneck in their application. New, high thermally-conducting materials are needed to effectively dissipate heat and thereby enable enhanced performance of power controls, solid-state lighting, communication, and security systems. We report our experimental discovery of high thermal conductivity of 1000 ± 90 W/m/K at room temperature in cubic boron arsenide (BAs) grown through modified chemical vapor transport technique. Such thermal conductivity is a factor of 3 higher than that of silicon carbide and surpassed only by diamond and the basal plane value of graphite. This work establishes BAs as the first realization of a new class of ultrahigh thermal conductivity materials predicted by a recent theory, and a potential revolutionary thermal management material.

If I don't miss something, these scientists use CVT to produce a material called BAs, which has a very high thermal conductivity, nearly half of diamond. Nearly half of diamond.

BTW, CVT looks like CVD. It is not easy. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemical_transport_reaction#opennewwindow