Algae Farm

[Neotuck]

8 hours ago, lupineways said:

Do you have enough slime output to justify more than one distiller? I was doing some experimenting with algae farming myself and even with 6 tame Pufts with enough high pressure PO2 to consume full time, one distiller isn't working full time. Maybe I am missing some way to improve their slime output. It doesn't seem very useful to use pufts for an algae farm at this point.

24 tamed pufts run one distiller, that's why I'm making a room to stack the pufts

 

45 minutes ago, suicide commando said:

How did you breed so many morbs?

lots of outhouses 

[suicide commando]

ahh, using my math I see
Just keep in mind, that is based on TAMED pufts, they eat/make 4 times as much slime as a wild one. So you will have to build 6 ranches in total to run it.
24 pufts is also good for 4800 calories per day from eggs.

 

 

[Neotuck]

14 minutes ago, suicide commando said:

ahh, using my math I see
Just keep in mind, that is based on TAMED pufts, they eat/make 4 times as much slime as a wild one. So you will have to build 6 ranches in total to run it.
24 pufts is also good for 4800 calories per day from eggs.

 

 

I figured that so I made another design that allows stacking 100 tamed pufts in one room

 

[suicide commando]

I don't think that will work, as tame overcrowded pufts will become unhappy, and lose happiness, once it reaches 0, they become wild again.

 

[Neotuck]

2 hours ago, suicide commando said:

I don't think that will work, as tame overcrowded pufts will become unhappy, and lose happiness, once it reaches 0, they become wild again.

 

Is that new? Before they didn't go wild, they just stop laying eggs

[DyingCrow]

17 hours ago, lupineways said:

Do you have enough slime output to justify more than one distiller? I was doing some experimenting with algae farming myself and even with 6 tame Pufts with enough high pressure PO2 to consume full time, one distiller isn't working full time. Maybe I am missing some way to improve their slime output. It doesn't seem very useful to use pufts for an algae farm at this point.

You need a bunch of pufts to support one destiller, theres a few vids with such experiments on youtube. Imho, pufts suck as for how they are right now, with the 24 tile space requirement and how much po2 they suck to produce snippets of slime

Oddly enough, the reason i couldnt figure how to spawn morbs was just me being silly. Now i have outhouses that havent been cleaned in a long time and just keep spawning morbs over and over. Go figure.

[lupineways]

1 minute ago, DyingCrow said:

You need a bunch of pufts to support one destiller, theres a few vids with such experiments on youtube. Imho, pufts suck as for how they are right now, with the 24 tile space requirement and how much po2 they suck to produce snippets of slime

Yeah I agree, their benefit as it pertains to algae and indirectly oxygen production makes them a - more or less - useless alternative for of oxygen production. Isn't the Ratio for PO2 to slime 2:1? Then that slime converts to algae at 3:1. And that algae produces at slightly worse than 1:1 (11:10). Just filtering PO2 is a 10:9 ratio and that needs minimal setup and you don't waste an excessive amount of PO2. Sure you don't have pufts making eggs, but hatches are easier for that as well.

I may be missing something, but the effort to set up anything with pufts seems to have very little payoff (possibly even wasteful of an oxygen production opportunity (deodorizer). And i really wanted pufts to be a way an alternative oxygen production method. I feel like the game needs more sustainable options that don't rely on having a good source of water. Some maps that can be a real bottle neck to colony growth with the new geyser setup.

I am not asking for more water, just more ways to use what i have available. Hopefully that is to come. 

[DyingCrow]

There are already some really good synergies, but there could be more.

One way i look at pufts is the same way i look at slicksters: tame a few, hatch eggs and let them lose to do their thing. The issue with that is, i dont want a dupe to tie a whole cycle just to go grab some random ball of a few grams of slime some puft dropped in the corner of who knows where. The fact the we actually need a ton of morbs and compactors full of polluted dirt to support just a few pufts dont make sense. All in all, they are not that valuable outside some crazy experiment ran in full test mode, like those crazy youtube contraptions. Its more like they are a pita to deal with. I wont even mention the current lure system. Ill do alt+q all day instead of beelining lures across the map.

[Luminite2]

Pufts right now are not at all good for oxygen production. However, they are necessary for sustainable mushroom farming (which itself is probably only necessary if you're really tight on water and/or have a PO2 geyser).

[DyingCrow]

5 minutes ago, Luminite2 said:

Pufts right now are not at all good for oxygen production. However, they are necessary for sustainable mushroom farming (which itself is probably only necessary if you're really tight on water and/or have a PO2 geyser).

Thats a good point. I havent done the math, but it will surely take more then a couple pufts to feed some 15-20 dupes. Still, mushrooms and eggs could be good, cheap way to feed dupes without wasting tons of water, with the occasional barbeque from hatch meat and free range peppers,  and pepper bread, also free range. Berries are good, but in long runs, the hit on water is real.

[badimo]

Stupid question: Why do you want algae?

[TheExceed]

In terms of oxy production, I agree, pufts aren't worth it unless you're converting the ph20 from the distiller to water. Even then, probably not worth it. Unless you make an absolutely massive farm separated so each room is efficiently maximized.
However, turning the slime/algae into coal and using the slime for mushrooms instead of bristle berries is very useful. I am currently trying to switch to that as water is pretty tough on me right now.

Best thing I have found for oxy is a ph2o vent. Mine emits 5Kg of ph2o 450/675s and a dormant period of 15 cycles.
Use the sieve to convert the water into a tank, heat the tank till the germs are all killed and pump the water into a cooling system with an entropy station and you're golden.  With my vent, I sustain 6 fertilizers and 2 electrolyzers which produce enough oxygen for my 12 dupes and 8 atmo suits.

I have 3 steam geysers in total, so once I get them all set up to be cooled properly and get a good store of clean water from the ph2o vent, I should be set to use that vent mainly for the Ngas powerplant.

[Neotuck]

12 hours ago, suicide commando said:

I don't think that will work, as tame overcrowded pufts will become unhappy, and lose happiness, once it reaches 0, they become wild again.

 

Ok I just checked and this Puft has been at 0% happiness for about 5 cycles now and is still tame.  Who said they become wild because even during the preview there was no way to turn tamed critters wild again.

At least we know now it's possible to stuff unlimited tamed critters into one room for resource production 

1 hour ago, badimo said:

Stupid question: Why do you want algae?

mostly looking for ways to save water

[TheExceed]

1 hour ago, Neotuck said:

Who said they become wild because even during the preview there was no way to turn tamed critters wild again.

When I was messing with critters the other day, when moving hatches for example from one area to the next via wrangling or trapping would reset its to tame.

[lupineways]

On 4/3/2018 at 8:52 PM, Neotuck said:

Ok I just checked and this Puft has been at 0% happiness for about 5 cycles now and is still tame.  Who said they become wild because even during the preview there was no way to turn tamed critters wild again.

I think their output decreases as their happiness goes down though. Someone may have more details on that but i think i was getting about 600g per poop at 100 percent but it went down significantly at 0 happiness.

Not sure that matters much if you have enough pufts and conversion rate doesn't change, but something to keep in mind.

[Neotuck]

15 minutes ago, lupineways said:

I think their output decreases as their happiness goes down though. Someone may have more details on that but i think i was getting about 600g per poop at 100 percent but it went down significantly at 0 happiness.

I wouldn't say significantly

I did a test while back and on average a tamed puft at 100% happiness dropped 65 kg per cycle

and at 0% happiness 60 kg

[lupineways]

1 hour ago, Neotuck said:

I wouldn't say significantly

I did a test while back and on average a tamed puft at 100% happiness dropped 65 kg per cycle

and at 0% happiness 60 kg

You are right it is nowhere near as significant as I thought (just tested again). But I did notice that, at least for me, it is closer to 20 - 25 kg per cycle depending on happiness after running various happiness pufts through a few cycles And yes, the air pressure was high enough pressure to prevent evaporation. So that's enough to run the algae oxidizer for 15ish seconds maybe. Seems like pufts are more useful for shroom farms and eggs.

Has anyone else tested the production rates?

[Neotuck]

2 hours ago, lupineways said:

Seems like pufts are more useful for shroom farms

agreed, I mainly built this farm to see if it can be done but unless critter production gets a significant buff in Mk 2 then pufts are only good for Dust Caps

[Jigsawn]

Got some puft farm questions:

Question 1 -  I have a 2 puft farm (yes its early days hahah), and have an autosweeper collecting the slime and putting it onto a conveyor going to my mushroom farm. But most of the time the slime doesn't seem to be reaching the farm.

Is it possibly evaporating during the transportation? I see the conveyor hoppers but often am seeing nothing stored in the mushroom farm receptacle. If it is evaporating, how can I get the slime to my farm otherwise? Only move it once a day maybe?

Question 2 - How many pufts would I need to feed a 10 mushroom farm, assuming they are happy and well fed?

Question 3 - How do I capture or move pufts? I tried the lure but it just lures them from a small distance. I have pufts in various caves around the world but no clear line of sight to my puft farm, so I can't make some "lure corridor" and slowly bring them in.

[Repseki]

If you have the slime conveyor route travel through liquid, or high enough gas pressure to stop off-gassing (1.8kg?), it should stop the evaporation. It might stop when behind tiles too. I haven't done a whole lot with conveyors so I'm not 100%.

As for getting more Pufts, have you tried breeding them yourself? Might be easier than long distance luring.

[PhailRaptor]

1 hour ago, Jigsawn said:

Question 1 -  I have a 2 puft farm (yes its early days hahah), and have an autosweeper collecting the slime and putting it onto a conveyor going to my mushroom farm. But most of the time the slime doesn't seem to be reaching the farm.

Is it possibly evaporating during the transportation? I see the conveyor hoppers but often am seeing nothing stored in the mushroom farm receptacle. If it is evaporating, how can I get the slime to my farm otherwise? Only move it once a day maybe?

Slime will off-gas up to a local atmospheric pressure of 1.8 kg.  You can get around this by keeping your Conveyor Rails behind Tiles, and your Loader/Unloader under a liquid.

1 hour ago, Jigsawn said:

Question 3 - How do I capture or move pufts? I tried the lure but it just lures them from a small distance. I have pufts in various caves around the world but no clear line of sight to my puft farm, so I can't make some "lure corridor" and slowly bring them in.

Yeah...  flying critters are a massive pain to move.  If you have Debug, just select them and alt + Q where you want them.  If not, I think Repseki has the better idea of simply hatching your own.  The Aerial Critter Lure is a joke.  Your only other option is to box them in, then slowly build/Deconstruct the box, to force them into the area you want.  Or attempt the "Hall of Doors".  Etc.

[lupineways]

7 hours ago, Jigsawn said:

Question 2 - How many pufts would I need to feed a 10 mushroom farm, assuming they are happy and well fed?

I think you should be able to feed a 10 mushroom farm with 2 tame pufts pretty easily. You would only need 1 if you get outputs of 65kg per cycle as @Neotuck reported from his testing but my testing showed closer to 20-25kg per cycle. You will need some decent po2 production to keep that up.

Did some experimenting with the rates that polluted water off gasses po2. I found that one tile of 800kg dense polluted water will gas off about 2kg of po2 per cycle. I don't know what factors directly impact this but it seems that as the water density goes down so does the rate of off gassing. I think it may be a direct percentage of the amount of water so 400kg may only produce 1kg per cycle. More testing needed to validate (this may even be documented somewhere on the forums but i haven't run across it yet.

[Luminite2]

22 minutes ago, lupineways said:

Did some experimenting with the rates that polluted water off gasses po2. I found that one tile of 800kg dense polluted water will gas off about 2kg of po2 per cycle. I don't know what factors directly impact this but it seems that as the water density goes down so does the rate of off gassing. I think it may be a direct percentage of the amount of water so 400kg may only produce 1kg per cycle. More testing needed to validate (this may even be documented somewhere on the forums but i haven't run across it yet.

The wiki says that, each tick, there is a 0.1% chance of a polluted water tile gassing off 0.1% of its mass. That means 0.0001% of the mass gets converted each tick (on average). When the wiki entry was written, tick rate was 4/second, so 0.000001/tick * 4 tick/sec * 600 sec/cycle = 0.0024 (0.24%) converted per cycle. 800kg * 0.0024 = 1.92kg (slightly less because rate will slightly decline as more and more converts). Since then, I believe the tick rate was increased to 5/sec, which makes the calculation come out to 2.4kg (0.3%/cycle). The numbers you observed seem very reasonable.

So, each full tile of polluted water can result in about 1kg/cycle of slime (given 2:1 ratio for pufts).

[lupineways]

2 minutes ago, Luminite2 said:

The wiki says that, each tick, there is a 0.1% chance of a polluted water tile gassing off 0.1% of its mass. That means 0.0001% of the mass gets converted each tick (on average). When the wiki entry was written, tick rate was 4/second, so 0.000001/tick * 4 tick/sec * 600 sec/cycle = 0.0024 (0.24%) converted per cycle. 800kg * 0.0024 = 1.92kg (slightly less because rate will slightly decline as more and more converts). Since then, I believe the tick rate was increased to 5/sec, which makes the calculation come out to 2.4kg (0.3%/cycle). The numbers you observed seem very reasonable.

So, each full tile of polluted water can result in about 1kg/cycle of slime (given 2:1 ratio for pufts).

Good to know my testing was in line with the wiki information. Silly me didn't even think to check the wiki for that information. 

[Neotuck]

43 minutes ago, lupineways said:

Silly me didn't even think to check the wiki for that information. 

Wiki isn't always updated for every patch so no worries