Using clear but germed water in showers

[Parusoid]

What will happen when dupes cleaning themselves with germed water either by shower or directional bathing stations? 

[Guest]

Absolutely nothing (for now, they might change it). So it is safe to use it for showers, toilets and sinks.

[Saturnus]

11 minutes ago, turbonl64 said:

Absolutely nothing (for now, they might change it). So it is safe to use it for showers, toilets and sinks.

Absolutely correct, and worth pointing out. I see a lot of people trying to remove germs from their waste water loop when it's completely pointless to do so. Currently at least.

[chemie]

10 minutes ago, Saturnus said:

Absolutely correct, and worth pointing out. I see a lot of people trying to remove germs from their waste water loop when it's completely pointless to do so. Currently at least.

To add to Saturnus said>:

Crypticfox has a nice youtube video on how to setup a bathroom-filter loop which generates water.

I would modify it since you should use it to destroy heat.  Add in a metal refinery before the filter since the filter outputs at 40C thereby removing a lot of heat from your system.  Do the same if you prefer to burn the PW in fertilizers.  I always max out water temperature (clean or PW) before sending to electrolyzers or fertilizers or filter.

[Saturnus]

And to add to what @chemie just said. You can use the water sieve heat destruction twice. Use the polluted water before the sieve and the clean water after the sieve to cool things down and you have double use as sinks/showers/lavatories also destroys heat.

[chemie]

5 hours ago, Saturnus said:

And to add to what @chemie just said. You can use the water sieve heat destruction twice. Use the polluted water before the sieve and the clean water after the sieve to cool things down and you have double use as sinks/showers/lavatories also destroys heat.

I thought they changed toilets and showers?  Mine output equal to input now (70C in my case) vs before at fixed 30C....

[Saturnus]

5 minutes ago, chemie said:

I thought they changed toilets and showers?  Mine output equal to input now (70C in my case) vs before at fixed 30C....

It's possible that it's so in the tubular beta. I have not played it very much yet only tested and rejected it at first release. To me, it did not feel like a worthwhile use of my time.

[chemie]

1 minute ago, Saturnus said:

It's possible that it's so in the tubular beta. I have not played it very much yet only tested and rejected it at first release. To me, it did not feel like a worthwhile use of my time.

My game is still AT, and showers output equals input.

[Saturnus]

Just now, chemie said:

My game is still AT, and showers output equals input.

See, I don't actually use showers, so I apologize for assuming they were the same as they've always been before. I will need to test that again it appears. Lavatories and sinks output water at the temperature of the lavatory though. That is certain.

If showers output water at input water temperature you should make a bug report as that is most definitely not intended. It would mean that if you use input water at above 55C you automatically disinfect the output polluted water.

[chemie]

1 hour ago, Saturnus said:

See, I don't actually use showers, so I apologize for assuming they were the same as they've always been before. I will need to test that again it appears. Lavatories and sinks output water at the temperature of the lavatory though. That is certain.

If showers output water at input water temperature you should make a bug report as that is most definitely not intended. It would mean that if you use input water at above 55C you automatically disinfect the output polluted water.

On AT, I have 80C water going to toilets, sinks and showers and all output at 80C (and there are germs, but they die in along enough pipe).  The room is at 22C and so are the building.

 

I updated with today tubular update and get the same result.  Output=inlet temp at 80C

[Saturnus]

1 hour ago, chemie said:

On AT, I have 80C water going to toilets, sinks and showers and all output at 80C (and there are germs, but they die in along enough pipe).  The room is at 22C and so are the building.

I updated with today tubular update and get the same result.  Output=inlet temp at 80C

Make a bug report.

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Saturnus said:

Make a bug report.

Is it a bug though? I think this is something they fixed. I also believe this was fixed together with the input temp on hydroponic tiles actually affecting surrounding temp.

On the other hand, no update seems to refer to this.

[Coolthulhu]

3 hours ago, Saturnus said:

If showers output water at input water temperature you should make a bug report as that is most definitely not intended.

There was a long standing bug with shower and lavatory output temperatures. The code clearly and unambiguously shows that the temperature of output should be equal to temperature of input, not hard-set, not capped.

The idea that it's intended for the temperatures to be capped was cooked up on the forums, from misunderstanding on how does shower output temperature work (back then when it was bugged).

[Michi01]

5 minutes ago, Coolthulhu said:

The idea that it's intended for the temperatures to be capped was cooked up on the forums, from misunderstanding on how does shower output temperature work (back then when it was bugged).

It was introduced with the Outbreak Upgrade and I am very certain that it was a completely intentional change to prevent geyser water to instantly kill germs when used for lavatories and showers. I'm not saying that I think it's good, but it's highly likely intended.

[chemie]

43 minutes ago, turbonl64 said:

Is it a bug though? I think this is something they fixed. I also believe this was fixed together with the input temp on hydroponic tiles actually affecting surrounding temp.

On the other hand, no update seems to refer to this.

Yes, I think they both changed at same time

[Saturnus]

8 minutes ago, Michi01 said:

It was introduced with the Outbreak Upgrade and I am very certain that it was a completely intentional change to prevent geyser water to instantly kill germs when used for lavatories and showers. I'm not saying that I think it's good, but it's highly likely intended.

Yup. If it is indeed not a bug that input and output temperature are the same why even have germs on the output as it's pointless.

It's not a big deal really but it's just another weird decision that makes no sense. And quite frankly, although I still like the game, I'm liking it less and less with each weird unannounced ninja change. At the very least the devs should note the changes they make in the updates... or don't make them at all.

[Coolthulhu]

22 hours ago, Michi01 said:

I am very certain that it was a completely intentional change

"Very certain" as in "I recall someone from Klei talking about it", "It was a perfectly reproducible behavior with well-defined output temperature that is always capped at the same value" or just "It makes sense to me"?

[Michi01]

4 minutes ago, Coolthulhu said:

"Very certain" as in "I recall someone from Klei talking about it", "It was a perfectly reproducible behavior with well-defined output temperature that is always capped at the same value" or just "It makes sense to me"?

It's just very plausible to me. Pretty much one of the first things that came to my mind when playing with the Outbreak Upgrade was using geyser water for my lavatories to automatically kill the germs it produced, so I'm quite certain during the many weeks during which both the devs and experienced players tested the preview, someone must've had the same idea and the devs must've taken notice and since geyser water is most of the time the only thing that people will be using for their lavatories once they have access to a geyser, it would make sense for them to change how the output temperature works to prevent this from partially making a feature that they'd been working on for weeks obsolete. I'm not certain if this was ever confirmed to be intended by the developers, but perhaps one of the people that were testing the preview knows more.
If this was unintended, how would it come to be anyway? Why would it only affect two buildings related to germs but nothing else?

[Coolthulhu]

2 minutes ago, Michi01 said:

If this was unintended, how would it come to be anyway? Why would it only affect two buildings related to germs but nothing else?

But it did affect other buildings too. Farm tiles, gas generators, it even broke thermo regulators at one point.

The bug wasn't a cap on temperature. That's how players misinterpreted it.

The actual behavior of the bug was lack of normalization of temperature in entities in buildings, combined with buildings storing 0g of any material that was in them since last save. So you could pump 1g of 0C natgas into a generator, then follow it up with 100g of 100C natgas, but the end temperature would be 0C.

At some point the above bug was combined with lack of heat exchange in liquids stored in buildings. Then heat exchange for liquids was added, creating this weird result that looked like a cap, but wasn't it.

If it was intended then why would it always result in different temperatures, clear on loading of a save, not be explicit in code but rather be completely arcane, affect buildings totally unrelated to germs, and exchange a small problem (easy removal of germs) for a much bigger one (heat deletion)?

[n37runn3r]

The germy water being safe won't last forever, but  it's a "low priority" fix compared to more important game mechanics. The devs are very interested in making the heat mechanics of the overall game better first. They can either make the decision that the showers "magically" make shower temperature water or that we have to heat or cool it. When the shower made the water the same temperature regardless of the input I figured the showers were somehow making the water "neutral" when it was cold going in, thus making the tepidizer pointless for that purpose. That the dupes should get chilled (i.e. stressed) by cold showers and scalded by geyser water showers makes sense, and you would have to control the temperature somehow eventually, but it's not an important mechanic to the core game.