Tempshift Plate - how does it work?

[Parusoid]

I may have some troubles understanding the description of what would the purpose of this item.
Does it block heat? Transfer? Absorb? What is the example of use?

Does it affect all five tiles it touches or only the center one?

[sadovsf]

I guess based on material used  it can be heat / cool buffer or spreader etc..

[Parusoid]

4 minutes ago, sadovsf said:

I guess based on material used  it can be heat / cool buffer or spreader etc..

What do you mean exaclty?

[sadovsf]

Simply depends on what material you use for building plates. Based on that plate behaves as temperature buffer making it hard to chagne its temperature or heatsink moving heat / cold away from soruce to surroundings

[Risu]

Think of it as a heat sink that covers a 3x3 area. Effectively averages out the temperature.
 

[Guest]

Do these things also work in a vacuum?

[donutman07]

It's just a building that interacts with 3x3 as mentioned. If you build an unused shower there out of same material, the effect would be similar.

It will work in a vacuum, as long as something is within it's 3x3 tile range to interact with

[clickrush]

I think the important mechanism to understand is how heat works in general. If you understand that, then it is obvious why you want tempshift plates an what they do.

Heat exchanges tile per tile and there are 2 factors involved: Mass*capactiy and conductivity. A material in any form that has high capacity and high mass will store more heat, or in a sense buffer it. A material with high conductivity will exchange heat faster.

If you want stability in a room then you typically want a lot of mass and capacity. @donutman07 suggested in another thread that he uses dirt tempshift plates to achieve that, which makes a lot of sense. Plates themselves always have a lot of mass (which makes them so expensive) and dirt has a high capacity, so they suck up heat changes in a way.

A practical example of that would be an oxygen production that is a mix of hot (electrolyzer) and cold (hydrogen bubbler) oxygen. You can use automation to mix the oxygen based on the temperature you want to achieve, but the temperatures are far away from eachother and 1 drop of liquid oxygen cools down the temperature massively. If you add a lot of heat capacity and mass to the room you are mixing the temperatures in, then it will stabilize the temperature and not react that quickly to the up and down changes. That is a decent use case for dirt plates to buffer the temperature.

Now another use case would be transfering heat over an area, evening out quickly. Diamond and tungsten plates are good for that, because they have very high conductivity.

For example you are pumping hydrogen to cool down something to an exact temperature. You can use automation and an entropy device to cool down the hydrogen. Since hydrogen has a conductivity of 2 but diamond has a conductivity of 60 (I think) the diamond will transfer heat faster over the room than the hydrogen, so you can achieve a more precice temperature over a room quickly by adding diamond plates.

[Parusoid]

56 minutes ago, Risu said:

Think of it as a heat sink that covers a 3x3 area. Effectively averages out the temperature.
 

Wchich material makes it a heat sink? And does it need to touch the heat source or just be in its vicinity?

4 minutes ago, clickrush said:

diamond will transfer heat faster over the room than the hydrogen, so you can achieve a more precice temperature over a room quickly by adding diamond plates.

The game says if heat travels between two items with different conductivity, the speed of transfer is based on the lowest conductivity

[clickrush]

6 minutes ago, Parusoid said:

Wchich material makes it a heat sink? And does it need to touch the heat source or just be in its vicinity?

The game says if heat travels between two items with different conductivity, the speed of transfer is based on the lowest conductivity

Yes exactly. So in my example it goes like this: If you have a room lets say 3 tiles high and 12 tiles wide and fill it will hydrogen, then the heat will transfer at conductivty of hydrogen. Now if you add diamond plates with the plates touching eachother then the plates will exchange heat to eachother faster, reaching either end of the room quickly. The heat exchange between the plates and the hydrogen is gated by the conductivty of the hydrogen, but it can even out more quickly because the diamond is touching the diamond.

[Parusoid]

11 minutes ago, clickrush said:

If you want stability in a room then you typically want a lot of mass and capacity. @donutman07 suggested in another thread that he uses dirt tempshift plates to achieve that

So if i want to keep constant temperature in a sleet wheat farm or pepper farm i can add dirt plates to keep that temperature?

[donutman07]

6 minutes ago, Parusoid said:

Wchich material makes it a heat sink? And does it need to touch the heat source or just be in its vicinity?

The game says if heat travels between two items with different conductivity, the speed of transfer is based on the lowest conductivity

yes, but tempshift plates can conduct between themselves. so you can build a heat pipe between two things.  Let me show you some pictures:

In this one I am using dirt tempshift plates as a temperature stability tool around my electrolyzers which constantly produce heat.  I also occasionally cool it with the system on the right via pipes.  This outputs my oxygen at a nice cool 18C (though you can pick nearly any temperature you like).

 

Here I am using diamond tempshift plates (though tungsten also works well) to connect a cold source (the pool of petroleum below) to a hot source, the plastic production.  This quickly moves the heat from the plastic down to the pool.

 

Some additional info at:

 

 

[clickrush]

Just now, Parusoid said:

So if i want to keep contasnt temperature in a sleet wheat farm or pepper farm i can add dirt plates to keep that temperature?

Yes, the heat will spread amongst the gases tiles and plates etc. Dirt plates store a lot of heat so they stabilize the room. that doesn't mean that the temperature doesn't change at all. It just means that it changes more slowly.

[Parusoid]

4 minutes ago, clickrush said:

Yes, the heat will spread amongst the gases tiles and plates etc. Dirt plates store a lot of heat so they stabilize the room. that doesn't mean that the temperature doesn't change at all. It just means that it changes more slowly.

But tungsten and diamond does the same thing only faster? Do they stabilize the room?

[clickrush]

7 minutes ago, Parusoid said:

But tungsten and diamond does the same thing only faster?

Dirt has about 10x more heat capacity than tungsten. Tungsten is also way more expensive/rare than dirt. Check the pictures @donutman07 posted. To compare the two materials simply: You can use tungsten to even out heat quickly and dirt to buffer it.

Edit: So yes you are right. All the plates do the same thing.

[Coolthulhu]

2 hours ago, clickrush said:

The heat exchange between the plates and the hydrogen is gated by the conductivty of the hydrogen, but it can even out more quickly because the diamond is touching the diamond.

Pretty sure it's not the case. Buildings do not exchange heat directly so this would need to be an exception to the rule.

It's easy to test it though: build a bunch of adjacent plates in complete vacuum (no gases, no liquids, no tiles). If they exchange heat, then I'm wrong. If they don't exchange heat in the vacuum, then they do not touch and can only exchange heat by exchanging it through environment and thus the speed of exchange is limited by environment.

[donutman07]

5 minutes ago, Coolthulhu said:

Pretty sure it's not the case. Buildings do not exchange heat directly so this would need to be an exception to the rule.

It's easy to test it though: build a bunch of adjacent plates in complete vacuum (no gases, no liquids, no tiles). If they exchange heat, then I'm wrong. If they don't exchange heat in the vacuum, then they do not touch and can only exchange heat by exchanging it through environment and thus the speed of exchange is limited by environment.

Seems to be a bit of both somehow.

left side hot CO2, right side cold O2, middle vaccum.  Wolframite doors, diamond tempshift plates, neutronium for all else.  The middle 4 are holding steady and have never changed temperature from when they were built.  The side 2 obviously have interacted with the doors however.

[Coolthulhu]

34 minutes ago, donutman07 said:

The side 2 obviously have interacted with the doors however.

Looks like I forgot a case there: buildings that occupy an entire tile (that is, can't share a tile with gas, liquid or solid tile) "count as" tiles. Doors do occupy a whole tile as long as they're closed. Open doors let in gases and so can't directly interact with buildings.

Not sure how do they interact with mesh tiles.

[clickrush]

I'am pretty sure you can even switch out the doors with abyssalite tiles and the plates would still exchange heat. Haven't tested this seperately but plates do exchange heat beyound or with tiles when they are in the 3x3 space. I noticed this when building a sleet wheat farm with plates touching the abyssalite walls. They warmed up (warmer outside) until I deconstructed the plates that touch the walls.

This is why I assumed that plates transfer heat between themselves and with tiles.

edit: just tested it and it doesn't seem that way. I may have had something else going on there. Wonder what it was.

[donutman07]

31 minutes ago, clickrush said:

I'am pretty sure you can even switch out the doors with abyssalite tiles and the plates would still exchange heat. Haven't tested this seperately but plates do exchange heat beyound or with tiles when they are in the 3x3 space. I noticed this when building a sleet wheat farm with plates touching the abyssalite walls. They warmed up (warmer outside) until I deconstructed the plates that touch the walls.

This is why I assumed that plates transfer heat between themselves and with tiles.

edit: just tested it and it doesn't seem that way. I may have had something else going on there. Wonder what it was.

they do seem to exchange with all tiles, but I think you might not have had enough of a temperature difference to get past the clipping.  Explained elsewhere in that heat explained thread, if the temperature change is too small, then no energy is transferred.

 

 

Left to right, abyssalite insulated tile, abyssalite tile, sandstone insulated tile, sandstone tile, 400kg uncut abyssalite.  Tungstun shiftplates.  Hot O2 on bottom, cold O2 placed on top.

All 5 combos exchanged some heat.  The abyssalite insulated tile hit the clipping threshold pretty quickly and stopped exchanging.  Abyssalite tile did better than insulated sandstone.  Insulated sandstone and uncut abyssalite did about the same.

Not in picture, but same test without shiftplates and no heat exchanged.  Moral of the story, don't connect your shift plates to your tiles that are meant to act as an insulator.

 

Edit: at least don't connect it to both sides of your insulation tiles.  One side doesn't seem to matter too much

 

[clickrush]

7 minutes ago, donutman07 said:

they do seem to exchange with all tiles, but I think you might not have had enough of a temperature difference to get past the clipping.  Explained elsewhere in that heat explained thread, if the temperature change is too small, then no energy is transferred.

 

 

Left to right, abyssalite insulated tile, abyssalite tile, sandstone insulated tile, sandstone tile, 400kg uncut abyssalite.  Tungstun shiftplates.  Hot O2 on bottom, cold O2 placed on top.

All 5 combos exchanged some heat.  The abyssalite insulated tile hit the clipping threshold pretty quickly and stopped exchanging.  Abyssalite tile did better than insulated sandstone.  Insulated sandstone and uncut abyssalite did about the same.

Not in picture, but same test without shiftplates and no heat exchanged.  Moral of the story, don't connect your shift plates to your tiles that are meant to act as an insulator.

 

Ok thanks for that, I thought I was going crazy!

So what I assume is that both you and @Coolthulhu are right according to your tests. The plates do exchange heat over a tile but not between themselves. So the way they conduct heat faster over lets say hydrogen is by creating intersecting 'mini-highways' over 3 tiles. The heat transfer in the gas/liquid itself can jump over a tile with a higher conductivity.

[The Flying Fox]

My own experiments with the Shift plates while constructing my prototype hot room mirror this.

 

Shift plates do not touch other plates, or buildings, but do touch tiles.  It's why I used this checker-board pattern to transfer the heat into the metal tile beam.  I've also discovered that they don't touch Air or Mesh tiles either, for some reason.  And yeah, having them touch insulated tiles is a bad idea.  You'll be wasting dumping heat or removing cold from them for no reason.

[Parusoid]

18 hours ago, donutman07 said:

Here I am using diamond tempshift plates (though tungsten also works well) to connect a cold source (the pool of petroleum below) to a hot source, the plastic production.  This quickly moves the heat from the plastic down to the pool.

So to summarize :

If I put shift plates in a row between two areas it creates a "tunnel" for heat if they are made of high conductivity material. 

If i put a single plates inside sealed room it will try to even out the heat and keep it if it made of low conductivity material. 

If I put  single plate between two areas it will act as heat blocker (insulated tile) when material is low conductivity. 

Is that correct? 

[donutman07]

I don't see how it can be used as an insulator. The air is still going to transfer heat all the same.

 

Temperature stability is gained in an enclosed area because the tempshift plates take a lot of heat to warm up when made of a material with high specific heat.

[Parusoid]

So i tried do something to stop heat from spreading and it dont seem to work. Plates are near  liquid teptidizer. They are made from dirt. Heat keeps coming and i had to instal thermo regulator to cool down my meal lice area. I also placed plates near that. they all are made from dirt. What am i doing wrong?

Image here

Spoiler

@donutman07 @clickrush @Coolthulhu