Morb Oxygen Generator Experiment

[Targa_X]

Just a little video of my Morb > Contaminated Oxygen > Liquid Oxygen > Gaseous Oxygen experiment. I used just over the minimum number of coolers to produce liquid oxygen. I initially went with one less, but the results weren't reliable. Sometimes it just pumped gas instead of liquid. Lots of the setup you see in the video is from testing, and not needed. Mobs can make a VERY high density of contaminated oxygen. At this point in the experiment, it was 12,400g per square. The main limitation I encountered was power generation. In the video I have the coal generators disabled. I'm also not using electrolyzers/hydrogen generators. I'm wondering if I had more dupes and hamster wheels if that would have made an appreciable difference. Unsure, since more dupes would use more oxygen. I also didn't have any dupes with diver's lungs. The batteries below the liquid oxygen vent weren't needed (I actually put them there later, for more power storage). Without the batteries under the vent, the liquid oxygen was still immediately evaporating. Maybe someone can take inspiration and improve on the design.

 

Edit: Attaching the save file for anyone who wants to experiment, or just look at it, and doesn't want the hassle of setting up a morb farm.

Morb test.sav

[Saturnus]

Or the faint of heart that doesn't like to kill of a lot of dupes to get them

[doot_toot]

I've been tinkering with a similar setup and I don't think it's possible to generate a net positive using pure dupe power. I do think it's a good place to throw your spare coal though. I just couldn't get a dupe on a treadmill to produce more than 200kj a day, and it costs about 220kj to produce 45kg of oxygen for a diver's lung dupe for a day.

Maybe you could shave the numbers a bit but you'd still need like 10 treadmill dupes to keep one misc dupe alive. Impractical.

[SpoonsOnMyElbows]

You would probably be better off just looping the one thermo insted of having such a large series, as there is no way they are running at full load.
I say this because your setup would produce such little clean oxygen, compared to the amount of power it would need.
I had a setup with just the 1 thermo, a couple gas pumps, and a water pump, all run on 2 wheels (1 most of the time), with around 20 morbs.
Even this only produced around 2500g Oxygen per min (i'm assuming a game min is 1 real min set on regular game speed, and this is what i used to time it). A dupe uses 100g/s or 6000g per min of Oxygen.
 

[doot_toot]

If it's not running full time then you can build up a buffer of contaminated O2 at the input pipe.

The problem with looping is it complicates running the thing, whereas a linear setup you can throw spare power into it whenever you can and get some useful results.

2-3 Air pumps should max out the thermocoolers full time though.

[SpoonsOnMyElbows]

Why does it make things more complicated? 5 times smaller, much less power, toggleable.
The problem i am pointing out is that to produce that "spare power" takes a hundred times more resources / oxygen / etc to create than what you get back.
The idea is to make it so it can almost run itself. 

[doot_toot]

If you loop it, it can't run itself.

If you keep it straight it does run itself.

Solid O2 is bugged at the moment, if you loop it you run the risk of wasting resources.

[SpoonsOnMyElbows]

What do you mean? Of course it can run itself. You couldn't get solid O2 with a single loop because as soon as it's a liquid you can have it drip out over the top of your single thermo.

Here is a screenshot of my current compact fully automatic self-running [contaminated water to clean water] system.
Don't worry about the 2 red symbols, they switch between on and off continuously.

Chamber 1 (left) is just storage for the cont. water, so you could just have an outlet leading into it (there isn't one in this example).
Chamber 2 is the heating chamber, it pulls in cont. water and drips it onto the thermo. Once it becomes steam, it moves to chamber 3.
Chamber 3 is the cooling room. The steam loops from here to the thermo in chamber 2, and back into the room again.
As soon as it's cold enough to become a liquid, it condenses in chamber 3 and drips to the floor, being sucked up by the water pump, and being sent to chamber 4, the water tank.

Even though there are 2 wheels above, it barely even needs 1.
It requires no resources, just time on a single wheel, and turns c.water into clean water.

[doot_toot]

That's a neat design, but it seems impractical if it were to run on Oxygen.

The thermocooler would permanently run under-capacity and you're effectively doubling the power cost of running it since you have to pay the pumping cost every time you push gas into the cooler instead of just once at the start of the line.

To convince me a condensing O2 machine is worth it you'd need to beat the efficiency of 17 coolers + 2-3 pumps in a line. Otherwise you're just using your wheel generator time inefficiently.

 

[SpoonsOnMyElbows]

Sorry, got confused between 2 topics.
This was for water purification.

[Mast3r07]

Do you need to feed morbs with other gases in order to produce contaminated oxygen? Or they make it from nothing?

Someone said they function like a converter, but i dont see any gas vents in your room.

[Saturnus]

They convert gases but if none are present they generate it themselves to a stable pressure of 1382g/m3

[Mast3r07]

Ahah... and i was sending all the chlorine generated by hand sanitizer into a hydrogen generator to destroy it. Well, now it has a real purpose.

[Targa_X]

2 hours ago, Saturnus said:

They convert gases but if none are present they generate it themselves to a stable pressure of 1382g/m3

In my game I posted above, the density of contaminated oxygen in the morb room is as high as 16,900g. All squares in the room are over 15,000g.

[Saturnus]

Strange. If that is the case then why is my base not exploding as I have literally over 100 of them in the basement. 

[Lothalin]

Well, I am kind of running into a little of an issue because a lot of things generate gas but nothing seems to actually remove it.  At this point, all my gas vents will not work because every square in my base is over 3kg of pressure.  I imagine at some point pressure will maybe have consequences?  Hopefully there is just a better way to manage pressure.

[SpoonsOnMyElbows]

Lothalin, an easy way to remove gas is to pump it through a vent and pump repeatedly.
Gas is destroyed by doing this.

[Saturnus]

There are a few ways to reduce pressure. The "easiest" is to see if there is a void somewhere on your map but that seems to be fairly uncommon so no a safe bet. The safe way is to just digging out huge areas as that in itself reduces pressure, especially if you avoid "popping" high pressure bubbles. And then you can also liquefy gases but takes a very long time to set up, and huge amount of power to do on a scale where it would actually have a major pressure reducing effect.

There's also the exploit abusing way of setting up a very large number of automatic airlocks in a row and just have a dupe run from one end to the other, over and over.

[SpoonsOnMyElbows]

4 minutes ago, Saturnus said:

There are a few ways to reduce pressure. The "easiest" is to see if there is a void somewhere on your map but that seems to be fairly uncommon so no a safe bet. The safe way is to just digging out huge areas as that in itself reduces pressure, especially if you avoid "popping" high pressure bubbles. And then you can also liquefy gases but takes a very long time to set up, and huge amount of power to do on a scale where it would actually have a major pressure reducing effect. 

No, this is the easiest way to remove any gas / pressure:
Just a simple gas pump and vent on a loop (preferably on a switch to save power).

Edit : To be more clear, 1 vent is pumping in the undesired gases (for me it's everything that is not oxygen).
and the pump feeds back to the other vent on a loop.

[Saturnus]

That would be my 2nd exploit abusing tip but you had already posted it so it didn't see a point of mentioning it.

[SpoonsOnMyElbows]

Is it an exploit that gas and liquid is partially destroyed with pumps and vents?

[Masterpintsman]

Which both (airlock and pump/vent loop) hopefully will be fixed soon as it takes, together with the gas it destroys, the fun out of the game - at least for me. It's a bug.

 

[Lothalin]

What % of loss happens when pumping?  I tested it with just a water pump and was only seeing about 1% loss which to me is understandable.  Is it different with gas?

[SpoonsOnMyElbows]

1 hour ago, Lothalin said:

What % of loss happens when pumping?  I tested it with just a water pump and was only seeing about 1% loss which to me is understandable.  Is it different with gas?

I think it depends on a bunch of factors, such as the amount being sucked up to the pump, and if there are multiple paths on the pipe chain.
For example, when i pour exactly 10kg of dirty water into a heating room, it creates 10kg of steam.
The 10kg of steam loops through a thermo, vent, and pump (back to the thermo again) for 2 mins and 35 seconds.
This gives me exactly 1.08kg of clean water when the system is empty.
This is a loss of 89.2% by looping through the pump for 2 mins 35 seconds.

[Lothalin]

I'll try it tonight, thanks!