Abigail's flower shouldn't take nightmare fuel

[FameFortuneGold]

As I don't want to go insane trying to summon Abigail's plus it is extremely inconvient. Also mentioning Abigail died and I couldn't see her flower on the map so thats how i found out it takes nightmare fuel. Flower's are bad enough since they go extinct pretty quickly on dedicated servers.

[rezecib]

Well, it's important to keep tabs on Abigail... You really shouldn't let yourself fall into a situation where you lose the flower.

 

Maybe a spider gland would make sense instead of nightmare fuel? Similar colors and stuff, and easier to obtain (seeing as stacking or sharing flowers isn't abuseable, I don't think there's a good reason to not have the recipe be really easy).

 

That being said, I think the new recipes involving petals is problematic right now. Fortunately when RoG comes flowers will spawn while it's raining, so that will help a lot.

[FameFortuneGold]

I like the idea of using spider glands instead.

[Chesska]

The idea of crafting a precious memento and keepsake of your dead sister kind of ruins a lot of things for me.

[Bahlsen]

What if we could craft it with dark petals ? They'll be less rare with RoG.

[GuyNamedChris]

What if we could craft it with dark petals ? They'll be less rare with RoG.

yes. perfect. let's craft an irreplaceable memento of a dead sister with DARK PETALS

[DarkXero]

You can make 1 nightmare fuel with 4 dark petals.

[Bahlsen]

@Chris1488, your irony actually made some sense. Blame the devs if you're not happy with the fact that the flower can be crafted now. It feels wrong to me but a solution had to be found for all these wendy without abigail, even if I wouldn't mind if things go as before. Nevertheless darkxero's right I forgot fuel can be crafted with four dark petals as I never build magic machines.

[Asparagus]

Umm... I guess Abigail's flower and Willow's lighter was nerfed because people could steal them... but now they're too inconvenient that it becomes an issue... shouldn't we just keep the old Flower and Lighter but make them unusable to other characters (or players using profiles and what-not?)

 

r___r

 

Or make the flower permanent but make it so that summoning Abigail requires 1-2 nightmare fuel to be summoned... like Maxwell's Codex Umbra which needs Nightmare fuel to create... Kage... bunshins...

 

OH. MY. GOD. I just realized that Maxwell uses Shadow Clone Jutsu! O__O

[ryouryou]

Requiring nightmare fuel to summon Abigail really just removes her from the early game, which is where she is also the most useful. It would be a huge decrease in usefulness of the character as a whole.

The very best advantage Wendy has over other characters is the early game. She is the easiest character to set up bees with, as Abigail distracts them while you take hives, and it has very little risk for the player. She is the easiest character to grab a few glands with before you have armor and such, at least in terms of time consumption. No traps (resources) or hitting them (also resources, plus sci machine needed if spear), no risk to the player in terms of damage if you allow her to tank correctly. She is the easiest character to move your first t3 spider den closer to the base with. 

Abigail has an advantage over weak-hitting, AOE-able creatures like spiders and bees. Those creatures pose no threat to a player that is heavily equipped. Abigail is also rather efficacious against the early hound waves, allowing players to focus on things besides armoring up right away. Bigger critters, such as bosses, will kill Abigail easily, so she isn't good against those. Even a few beefalo will make short work of her (though she does pose an alright distraction for a short time). Later hound waves with more hounds in them will also manage to kill her. These things make Abigail a significantly less useful perk for the endgame. She also tends to piss off nearby neutral treeguards sometimes for no good reason, which makes her a bit of a liability, but treeguards are also a mid-late game concern as chances increase.

Wendy is an amazing early game character and making you farm dark petals or go insane in order to reap any of her benefits would destroy that. The flower was already not able to be used by other players, because it wouldn't bloom for them, so I'm unsure what this fixed. Were people stealing the flower upon Abigail's death and running off with it? Was that really such a major problem?

Maybe character-specific items need to be unable to even be picked up by anyone besides the original owner. Not in terms of character, but player. 

One of the reasons the death mechanic works alright in this game is that it leaves that element of hope. That is, if you get back to where your stuff was dropped, you can have it back. Even if it is days away, even if you need to spend a while stocking up before you go get it, you can go get your things. If literally THE most important item your character needs will be gone by the time you get there, that is very discouraging for players. Especially new players, who will die a lot. 

I can see the current mechanic leading to more players just rage-quitting when they die and they know their things would be hard to retrieve.

It also makes the character unnecessarily punishing of death compared to others. Wilson dies? Okay, you lose some beard growth, I guess. Willow dies? The lighter (even in its nerfed state) will await your return. Wendy dies? OH ****, BETTER RECKLESSLY RUSH OUT THERE AS SOON AS POSSIBLE OR YOUR BEST CHARACTER ATTRIBUTE IS GONE. Well, until you can farm Nightmare Fuel, which might leave you with not enough sanity to safely summon her anyways. 


Edit: This is partially about the current crafting recipe, and partially about the proposed replacement of the summoning itself taking nightmare fuel by Asparagus, making sure that that is unambiguous.

[applebottom]

Huh. This is surprising. I never played Wendy and wasn't aware that the flower was also changed together with Willow's lighter.

 

Nightmare fuel/dark petals seems fitting story wise. You're summoning the ghost of your twin sister after all. But it seems like too much work for a single use of summoning.

 

I wish dead Abigail just turned to a grave or Abigail plant instead which you can dig or pick up on a full moon (a new moon? so it's completely dark?) to get the flower back. It's enough of a deterrent to avoid hoarding of Abigail flowers, but also not too difficult that resurrecting almost isn't worth it.

[rezecib]

But it seems like too much work for a single use of summoning.

 It's not single-use. The flower still drops when Abigail dies just like before. This just allows you to have backup flowers or replace flowers that get lost.

[applebottom]

It's not single-use. The flower still drops when Abigail dies just like before. This just allows you to have backup flowers or replace flowers that get lost.

 

Ah I see. I should've researched the update before suggesting things. Thanks for the correction.