Changes to the Ancient Fuelweaver

[Frosty_Mentos]

I think fuelweaver shield should perhaps come back if he's getting damage too hard on his second phase. Some characters got insane damages with goat jelly and all while less powerful characters don't get as many good windows to do massive damage.

So it would work like this- fuelweaver shield would regenerate after some amount of time, depending on the damage done to him would cut down on the regeneration on his shield time. It would take all the damage he could during that frame even in massive burst before he sets a shield back up so that gunpowder strat still remains viable. To addition, to that cooldown check he'd have an extra time of setting his shield up, being a window of couple of seconds or less before he casts his spell for characters to do as much damage as they can.

In conclusion with smaller damage modifiers characters would gain a higher amount of time to strike at him than those with really high ones or in combinations of a few people to do a lot of that damage, kinda like how Celestial sets up his shield at phase one when he feels threatened.

[grm9]

14 minutes ago, IAmAFurrz said:

yea only teleportation can beat it, most characters have to lazy explorer out

you can dodge bone cage, he casts it if you're within a 12 tiles radius around him and you get caged if you're within a 15 tiles radius around him by the time his hand hits the floor

15 minutes ago, IAmAFurrz said:

what in the hell suggested this?

figuring out how the boss works and thinking that if there are very slow things that are moving towards it, you should keep them away by making it walk away from them?

15 minutes ago, IAmAFurrz said:

i know how it spawns and common strategies, doesnt mean margin of error is still stupidly small, not to mention when you fight him, if you want the fight to be 'exciting' and 'not boring' like you said the changes would do, you wouldnt just want to walk him around the edges

you still need to dodge bone cage while doing that and occasionally kill woven shadows that are too close

16 minutes ago, IAmAFurrz said:

not in this game where bosses have too much hp, especially the type of boss that can heal massive amounts, that is fought in a far off place away from all escape, takes forever to get there, and if you die you're not gonna escape without a life amulet on you/outside the arena with extra gear

rollback/do that in a test world? you can also look at the code

17 minutes ago, IAmAFurrz said:

yea knowing all of this still doesnt make the fight more fun. its got the ck-ism of 1 mistake drawing the fight out for so much longer, just not as bad bc he doesnt perma freeze you. all of this knowledge for 1 single fight and you cant **** up even once. the fight isnt fun or exciting atp, so much skill required for an annoyingly low reward and reseting ruins/opening rift that doesnt have much to offer

bone helm solves sanity and going to ruins during nightmare cycle, bone armor allows you to tank without taking damage and getting interrupted or walking away, thurible trivializes killing FW and allows you to use reanimated skeleton for chopping and moonstone and is the best thing to use as maxwell on a beefalo and rifts allow you to get a 88.8 damage weapon and rewards being bad is unrelated to how good a fight is, imo it's fun and a boss not forgiving mistakes is a good thing, makes it so there's risk

[Juanasdf]

28 minutes ago, grm9 said:

you still need to dodge bone cage while doing that and occasionally kill woven shadows that are too close

My main problem with that strategy, and it's incredibly infuriating: one woven shadow steps too close to AFW (good luck hitting them with the targeting system) and he stops to start eating every single one of them unless you have a backup weatherpain (and you can end up stunlocked next to him if you're caged and he has a shield at the same time due to the immunity AOE knockback). It's cool that he'll stop attacking you to eat them, but i'd rather get attacked than him stopping dead on its tracks on a non convenient place and heal non-stop. SPECIALLY SINCE THE SHADOWS ALWAYS SEEM TO SPAWN IN THE WORST PLACE POSSIBLE.

Just that change alone would make that strategy more bearable: making him absorb the woven shadows without stopping.

I've also suggested this in the past and some people said that it would ruin the "no break pace" of the fight:
The main reason why I think CK is easier than AFW (debatable) is that you can always freeze him to buy time, repair your boat, kill claws, and go back to the fight. Same for toadstool, and that one even has the ponds to your advantage. AFW can't be put to sleep or frozen.

I'd love to have a way to stop AFW that isn't a maxwell cage. Heck, it's one more slot to take care of if "preserving the difficulty of inventory management" is one of your concerns.

EDIT: Also maybe if the game had a better and faster detection system for switching targets the weatherpain wouldn't be as needed, but it's very hard to manually click each single woven shadow, and holding / spamming f to switch between them makes it way longer to initiate new attacks against them. (and thus more shadows reach AFW)

Edited March 20 by Juanasdf

[Guille6785]

I think the fight is perfect as is besides a few minor bugs (I wish the telepoof deaggro bug got fixed but it's not an issue if you just dodge the bone cage which is way more fun)

[HowlVoid]

I think the healing effect of woven shadows needs to be toned down for less players. That's the minimum I think.

That's usually the biggest grip for me as it can make just learning the boss very difficult. Small mistakes are heavily punished by the boss regaining thousands of hp back.

Every other boss in the game you can come out victorious if you prepare enough. Fuelweaver can literally be an infinite resource sink, which is incredibly frustrating.

Edited March 20 by HowlVoid

[Juanasdf]

3 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

Fuelweaver can literally be an infinite resource sink

[grm9]

1 hour ago, Juanasdf said:

My main problem with that strategy, and it's incredibly infuriating: one woven shadow steps too close to AFW (good luck hitting them with the targeting system) and he stops to start eating every single one of them unless you have a backup weatherpain (and you can end up stunlocked next to him if you're caged and he has a shield at the same time due to the immunity AOE knockback). It's cool that he'll stop attacking you to eat them, but i'd rather get attacked than him stopping dead on its tracks on a non convenient place and heal non-stop. SPECIALLY SINCE THE SHADOWS ALWAYS SEEM TO SPAWN IN THE WORST PLACE POSSIBLE.

Just that change alone would make that strategy more bearable: making him absorb the woven shadows without stopping.

I've also suggested this in the past and some people said that it would ruin the "no break pace" of the fight:
The main reason why I think CK is easier than AFW (debatable) is that you can always freeze him to buy time, repair your boat, kill claws, and go back to the fight. Same for toadstool, and that one even has the ponds to your advantage. AFW can't be put to sleep or frozen.

I'd love to have a way to stop AFW that isn't a maxwell cage. Heck, it's one more slot to take care of if "preserving the difficulty of inventory management" is one of your concerns.

EDIT: Also maybe if the game had a better and faster detection system for switching targets the weatherpain wouldn't be as needed, but it's very hard to manually click each single woven shadow, and holding / spamming f to switch between them makes it way longer to initiate new attacks against them. (and thus more shadows reach AFW)

pretty sure that keeping him away from woven shadows without AoE and teleportation is consistent 

[goblinball]

4 hours ago, IAmAFurrz said:

its a strategy thats not really intuitive.

“Not really intuitive” is an understatement. I never knew that the woven shadows only spawn near the gateway until reading this thread.

[IAmAFurrz]

2 hours ago, goblinball said:

“Not really intuitive” is an understatement. I never knew that the woven shadows only spawn near the gateway until reading this thread.

yea pros will say anything about you being lazy when that stuff is both not intuitive and try to gatekeep changing the boss to be more enjoyable for people

[Guille6785]

3 hours ago, goblinball said:

“Not really intuitive” is an understatement. I never knew that the woven shadows only spawn near the gateway until reading this thread.

the area where they spawn is explicitly marked with a circle on the floor

[Faintly Macabre]

9 minutes ago, Guille6785 said:

the area where they spawn is explicitly marked with a circle on the floor

This is implicit, not explicit. I think you can reasonably intuit that it serves as somewhat of an indicator, but it's at least as easy to dismiss as just decoration.

[Guille6785]

1 hour ago, Faintly Macabre said:

This is implicit, not explicit. I think you can reasonably intuit that it serves as somewhat of an indicator, but it's at least as easy to dismiss as just decoration.

it's not "somewhat" of an indicator, it's their exact range, they don't spawn any further than the circle

[Szczuku]

2 hours ago, Guille6785 said:

it's not "somewhat" of an indicator, it's their exact range, they don't spawn any further than the circle

The circle doesn't have a sign saying "Woven shadows spawn within me" now does it?

Neither does it glow or change in any way when they spawn.

So it is very much implicit

[hoxi]

2 hours ago, Guille6785 said:

it's not "somewhat" of an indicator, it's their exact range, they don't spawn any further than the circle

I think you're missing the point, they didn't mean it's not an accurate indicator, but rather that it's easy to think it's just decoration instead of an indicator.

Edit: oh oops, was typing as the comment above was posted.

4 minutes ago, Szczuku said:

Neither does it glow or change in any way when they spawn.

I'm actually surprised this isn't the case given how Klei tends to be about details like that.

Edited March 21 by hoxi