Walter is the "pineapple on pizza" of Don't Starve characters.

[Copyafriend]

28 minutes ago, Jakepeng99 said:

Guys stop using potato cup as a dislike button.

No

34 minutes ago, Gashzer said:

And boss rushing is a great metric to use for determining the actual skill-ceiling of a character. Walter is bad for casuals i 100% agree. But by god hes awesome for good players.

Except he really really isnt.

you’re either blind ignorant or cant read.

speed is king ONLY in the context of speedrunning, not all good players speedrun.

WX78 is the “King of kings” when it comes to speed. Heck wormwood beats walter if he’s bloomed with a walking cane and magi.

you’re just being rediculous and you know it. Any perk thats replaceable in the first 20 days is not a major perk, and beefalo are not hard to tame at all.

heck a rider beef on a regular saddle is faster than walter, a regular beef on a regular saddle is only SLIGHTLY slower. You can get a bell bond a beef, slap a saddle on it, and go almost as fast as walter day 2 with just a bit of luck. 

so “king of kings” walter is very much not. You’re just trolling and it’s aggravating me much more than it should.

 

and no, people rarely check if theres a triple mac, and the ones that do probably play wanda, not walter..

[Fufuji]

36 minutes ago, Jakepeng99 said:

Guys stop using potato cup as a dislike button.

wait I thought it's cute and is used as a like button

[Gashzer]

9 minutes ago, Copyafriend said:

No

Except he really really isnt.

you’re either blind ignorant or cant read.

speed is king ONLY in the context of speedrunning, not all good players speedrun.

WX78 is the “King of kings” when it comes to speed. Heck wormwood beats walter if he’s bloomed with a walking cane and magi.

you’re just being rediculous and you know it. Any perk thats replaceable in the first 20 days is not a major perk, and beefalo are not hard to tame at all.

heck a rider beef on a regular saddle is faster than walter, a regular beef on a regular saddle is only SLIGHTLY slower. You can get a bell bond a beef, slap a saddle on it, and go almost as fast as walter day 2 with just a bit of luck. 

so “king of kings” walter is very much not. You’re just trolling and it’s aggravating me much more than it should.

 

and no, people rarely check if theres a triple mac, and the ones that do probably play wanda, not walter..

Speedrunning stresses the importance of character choice much more than having a nice and peaceful base building session. This is a fact. 

Im not trolling, i think you are getting mad coz i be sittin here spitting straight logical arguements and its messin with your wrong preconceptions about Walter 

Its ok Copyafriend, i know its difficult to see the light of truth when you have been in the dark for so long. 

That truth is that Walter is one of the best designed characters in DST 

[KeshS]

@Gashzer I don't want to sound mean, but you are delusional at this point. The "secret" Walter hat0r community ommited it's own reasons multiple times why Walter isn't a great pick. If you you want to prove his viability, create your own youtube channel and show his unmarveled skills of what underrated potential he has to everyone. Attacking every user that disagrees with Walter strengths is condescending, while your rambling only further solidifies their opinion on Walter being bad. You can write a page or whole book about how glorious Walter is - it won't change our opinion.

 

P.S. Wendy or Willows main before their rework were also considered weak picks, but they didn't care because they were simply having fun playing.

P.P.S. It's a (you) problem

[Jakepeng99]

9 minutes ago, Fufuji said:

wait I thought it's cute and is used as a like button

Sadly the one in this thread was used as a dislike

[Yuuko]

12 hours ago, Cheggf said:

A glass cannon could work if they had a downside where armor was less effective on them. Such as a portion of damage leeching through armor, and the rest going through the normal calculations. Or if they just straight-up couldn't use armor at all, and had a natural resistance that couldn't be improved.

Pubs aren't where you go to find good players.

Nothing about glass cannon means it can't use armor.  Wanda is sitting between 37 and 17 effective health in old age.  With classic 80% armor she gets about 187 to 87 effective health.  Basically with 80% armor she is as good as the rest of the cast naked.  How many people play the game naked though?  Most people play with at least 80% armor easily smoking her tankiness.  She can use night armor which bumps her up to 750 to 350 effective health but this armor is a lot more upkeep having to get 12 reeds per armor.  Getting a stack of reeds to have armor for a boss fight is a lot.

She also gets hit HARD with direct damage.  Overheating, burning, freezing, starving are all real threats to her.  That first day of winter where you probably don't need cold protection b/c you'll only be freezing for about a minute and will probably take only 25ish damage?  Yeah, she will die lol.

Its pretty factual that her ability to take damage is much worse then any other character.  Be in denial all you want, try mental gymnastics like comparing her health with night armor against an unarmored wilson lol  its not going to change reality.

9 hours ago, somethin said:

Yeah, she's neither made out of glass or is a cannon

I don't know why people keep calling her that

She is a glass cannon, ppl just don't realize why No True Scottsman fallacy is a fallacy...

22 minutes ago, Gashzer said:

The question is how much speed do you actually need for combat? Does kiting slightly faster even increase overall dps that much? Probably not. From playing Wx the insane speed can almost be too much sometimes.

A thulecite club and mag which you can obtain without needing to wait for mactusk, is more than enough to kite the majority of bosses easily. You can stack cheaply made cobblestone roads for shadow rook.

Speed is more important for getting from point A to point B. Because you will spend 95% of your time not fighting bosses. So wobys big speed boost is better than wormwoods for example.

Exactly! But they should! The entire community is sleeping on Walters strength because of stupid preconceptions. His downside is only a downside if you get hit so skilled speedrunners in our community shouldnt have any issues using Walter.

It would be cool to see some speed runs with Walter.  Even if they aren't setting global records, it would be cool to see where he stacks up.

I think Walter is in an odd spot because he looks and sounds like he should be a new player friendly character, but his mechanics add up to something only an experienced player can really take on.  If you are not at 100% health you are constantly draining sanity, something detrimental to new players but extremely useful to experienced ones.  You have to be familiar with living in low sanity, how to heal, how to kite, know what you're looking for to make use of your inventory space and speed boosts, etc.  You have to kill something to get monster meat before you even start gaining advantages from Woby so really, he is not for new players.

I don't think the speed boost is enough.  I think he needs some bigger payoff...  but tbh I haven't put that much time into him.  I do enjoy him but found him lacking even with his speed boost.  My favorite thing was being able to stay max sanity in a ruins rush so I could pick out the gem colors I wanted easier lol.

10 minutes ago, Fufuji said:

wait I thought it's cute and is used as a like button

I giv u cup <3 

14 minutes ago, Jakepeng99 said:

Sadly the one in this thread was used as a dislike

Don't say stupid things don't win stupid prizes.

[Copyafriend]

6 minutes ago, Gashzer said:

Im not trolling, i think you are getting mad coz i be sittin here spitting straight logical arguements and its messin with your wrong preconceptions about Walter 

Its ok Copyafriend, i know its difficult to see the light of truth when you have been in the dark for so long. 

That truth is that Walter is one of the best designed characters in DST 

I’m glad you were more opaque about the trolling, much easier to clear my poor sleep deprived head when you’re super obvious about it.

 

i’ll say it again and let it die.

walter is an okay choice for speedrunning, but not even great.

wolfgang is great, wanda is great, and wx78 is great.

each one can do whatever walter can do but better.

walter’s bonus stops being useful by day 20.

that makes it a bad bonus for any purpose other than speedrunning, and a “okay” bonus for speedrunning. It lasts about half of a good speedrun after all. But you’ll still probably want a beefalo, because they’re faster than woby. In other words for a speedrun as walter your best move is still to not use woby past the midpoint. 

 

now that i’ve “spit” my “logical arguments”

I’ll say this.

A proper speedrun is based on character, not just pure time. saying walter is good for speedruns is like saying that water is good for a water pitcher. Your time is going to be measured against other people playing walter.

its not better than a longer time of a player playing as wilson. they’d (logically) be in a different catagory, or at least measured by different standards, and their time may be objectively better than yours despite the longer time it took them: because they were playing a different character with less speedrunning advantages.

 

this condescension is the reason why i call speedrunners the vegans of dont starve, you want to act superior for playing the game in a certain way, when literally every single forum goer likely has similar hours to you, and could probably do fairly well on a speedrun without practicing.

 

you’re claiming superiority in a group of your peers, we’re all experienced enough to speedrun, we choose not to because it would lessen our enjoyment of the game. Our complaints about a character is no less valid because you happen to think they’re particularly good at one niche way of playing.

in other words:

you’re not special, stop acting like you’re better just because you speedrun, no one cares.

[Cheggf]

2 minutes ago, Shosuko said:

Nothing about glass cannon means it can't use armor.

 

2 minutes ago, Shosuko said:

She can use night armor which bumps her up to 750 effective health

Very glass. You make 10 or 20 mistakes back to back, you might need to start thinking about maybe healing when it's convenient!

[Copyafriend]

Also i’m sorry for the insults, i’m easily angered when i’m sleep deprived

[Yuuko]

4 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

 

Very glass. You make 10 or 20 mistakes back to back, you might need to start thinking about maybe healing when it's convenient!

750 to 350 health.  You're rarely at the top end b/c you can't heal until you hit the bottom end, and you're always draining health.  Considering enemies hit for 50-150 damage this is not very much lol  Especially with her gated healing.  Mind you other characters with night or marble suit are at about 3000 effective health...  I've already pointed out the mathematical slight of hand y'all are using, just give it up.  

[Fufuji]

23 minutes ago, Shosuko said:

I giv u cup <3 

Thank you! I love potato and I love potato cup. <3

[lenship2]

16 minutes ago, Shosuko said:

750 to 350 health.  You're rarely at the top end b/c you can't heal until you hit the bottom end, and you're always draining health.  Considering enemies hit for 50-150 damage this is not very much lol  Especially with her gated healing.  I've already pointed out the mathematical slight of hand y'all are using, just give it up.  

yea, and like wanda, wolfgang has his own synergy armour: marble armour. with 95% resistance, just like night armour, but unlike night armour it doesnt lower sanity on hit. with his marble armour wolfgang has 4000 effective health. so while wanda can hypothetically tank 10 or so hits with her night armour, wolfgang can literally tank 50-70 hits with his marble armour before he needs to heal (he has significantly easier healing btw). even staying middle aged, wanda has around 50 health, which is lower than wes

what is everyone's definition of a glass cannon anyways? being one shot isn't really fun in any game, and a majority of the time in at least the games i play, glass cannons can tank one or two hits from enemies. wanda, by definition, is a glass cannon

[Copyafriend]

5 minutes ago, Fufuji said:

Thank you! I love potato and I love potato cup. <3

I give you a nice potato cup, I only mean potato cup sometimes

[Jakepeng99]

41 minutes ago, Shosuko said:

Don't say stupid things don't win stupid prizes.

?

[Cheggf]

19 minutes ago, lenship2 said:

what is everyone's definition of a glass cannon anyways? being one shot isn't really fun in any game, and a majority of the time in at least the games i play, glass cannons can tank one or two hits from enemies. wanda, by definition, is a glass cannon

Is everyone, by definition, a glass cannon since everyone can tank at least 1 or 2 hits? The difference between 2 & 10 is the same as the difference between 10 & 50, which you're using to point out that Wanda is a glass cannon unlike Wolfgang. And the difference between 1 & 10 is even bigger.

[Copyafriend]

14 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

Is everyone, by definition, a glass cannon since everyone can tank at least 1 or 2 hits (which is a very different number from 10)? 

I mean it feels like you’re being a bit pedantic about this.

I’m not going to say that dont starve as a whole really supports the character archetype that is “glass cannon”

But as far as a “glass cannon” type character, wanda fits all the prerequisites. 

now 10 hits isnt very fragile, but its by far the least health out of every character, and its also more like 8 hits, all the big boy bosses hit for 100, not 75.

all i’m going to say is that one stomp slash combo from bearger kills a old wanda with a football helmet on.

thats two hits, less than five seconds apart, with what is widely considered adequate protection.

you can argue that she’s not a “true” glass cannon, and what i have to say to that, is that she is designed as one, and in many games “glass cannons” still have half the health of their fellow characters, wanda in “maximum dps” mode, which is at low health (a trait commonly attributed to glass cannons) has one forth the health of her compatriots. That makes her a glass cannon.

maybe not the archetypical “dies in two hits but nukes the enemy” glass cannon, but as far as a survival game goes. She fits the description.

[Cheggf]

Just now, Copyafriend said:

I mean it feels like you’re being a bit pedantic about this.

I’m not going to say that dont starve as a whole really supports the character archetype that is “glass cannon”

But as far as a “glass cannon” type character, wanda fits all the prerequisites. 

now 10 hits isnt very fragile, but its by far the least health out of every character, and its also more like 8 hits, all the big boy bosses hit for 100, not 75.

all i’m going to say is that one stomp slash combo from bearger kills a old wanda with a football helmet on.

thats two hits, less than five seconds apart, with what is widely considered adequate protection.

you can argue that she’s not a “true” glass cannon, and what i have to say to that, is that she is designed as one, and in many games “glass cannons” still have half the health of their fellow characters, wanda in “maximum dps” mode, which is at low health (a trait commonly attributed to glass cannons) has one forth the health of her compatriots. That makes her a glass cannon.

maybe not the archetypical “dies in two hits but nukes the enemy” glass cannon, but as far as a survival game goes. She fits the description.

Obviously Klei designed her with the intention of trying to make a glass cannon. All I said was that a true glass cannon (that can't spend 30 seconds straight just tanking every single attack) could work with a perk that lowered the effectiveness of armor, since health literally ranging from 1-20x kind of makes it hard to balance damage taken.

[Copyafriend]

14 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

Obviously Klei designed her with the intention of trying to make a glass cannon. All I said was that a true glass cannon (that can't spend 30 seconds straight just tanking every single attack) could work with a perk that lowered the effectiveness of armor, since health literally ranging from 1-20x kind of makes it hard to balance damage taken.

Well i have good news for you!

planar

[Cheggf]

Just now, Copyafriend said:

Well i have good news for you!

planar

How do I pick this "Planar" character? 

[Jakepeng99]

4 minutes ago, Copyafriend said:

Well i have good news for you!

planar

Yeah but what about Planar armour? The dreadstone helm comes with planar protection which most Wandas use normally.

[Copyafriend]

2 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

How do I pick this "Planar" character? 

You dont have to, with planar damage (likely) being more important going foward, it’ll be a lot more dangerous for wanda, its either wear planar armor or die in 4 hits from planar damage (planar armor has 80% damage reduction but you knew that) 

basically night armor cant protect her against planar enemies

[Cheggf]

25 minutes ago, Copyafriend said:

You dont have to, with planar damage (likely) being more important going foward, it’ll be a lot more dangerous for wanda, its either wear planar armor or die in 4 hits from planar damage (planar armor has 80% damage reduction but you knew that) 

basically night armor cant protect her against planar enemies

What you're saying is that theoretically in 5 years Wanda will become a glass cannon in late game worlds that've already done all the content from 2011-2023 if theoretically they add a bunch more planar enemies and theoretically most of them deal a large amount of planar damage.

But you also forget that Wanda is getting a skill tree, which will theoretically include "Actually, this planar mechanic is stupid!" like Wolfgang's skill tree has. 

[Mysterious box]

2 hours ago, Jakepeng99 said:

Sadly the one in this thread was used as a dislike

Yea....just this thread....

30 minutes ago, Copyafriend said:

You dont have to, with planar damage (likely) being more important going foward, it’ll be a lot more dangerous for wanda, its either wear planar armor or die in 4 hits from planar damage (planar armor has 80% damage reduction but you knew that) 

basically night armor cant protect her against planar enemies

I would imagine by the time planar damage becomes more relevant we'll likely get a planar version of night armor I highly doubt we'll stay at 80% I'd argue Woodie's weremoose's defense was designed with this inevitably in mind

[Dextops]

7 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

But you also forget that Wanda is getting a skill tree, which will theoretically include "Actually, this planar mechanic is stupid!" like Wolfgang's skill tree has. 

Honestly it’d be cool if while Wolfgang got all that planar stuff Wanda didn’t so she’d still suffer with later game content 

[Copyafriend]

2 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

Yea....just this thread....

I would imagine by the time planar damage becomes more relevant we'll likely get a planar version of night armor I highly doubt we'll stay at 80%

Anything is possible. But i think it is intended as a way to nerf the current “meta picks” while encouraging certain lategame picks. I’m not sure what the point would be if it had both high planar defense and high regular defense. I have to hope at least that we don’t get an equivalent because otherwise the planar equipment thing is simply chasing its own tail. Which it may be.