So hows Wolfgang?

[ArubaroBeefalo]

9 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

find Walter a interesting case of fun but weak

me too but sometimes i feel like "i really wanna grind sanity food for such little reward?"

[Yuuko]

1 hour ago, Dollmaker said:

I mean, speedrun isnt that good of an argument mate, the reason Wolfgang was so good was because of his speed.

I don't see why not - I think it presents the best context FOR Wolfgang to succeed since the best use case of his mightiness is spending an entire day fighting a boss.  Speedrun strats bypass the biggest downside of his setup, which would be chopping and mining a lot more to get the extra stone / wood he needs to set up a gym.  In a speed run we just smash some pig houses, its not that far out of the way.  Building the gym directly at the boss eliminates travel time too.  All of the things are lined up FOR Wolfgang.  And this isn't comparing newWolf to oldWolf speedruns, this is comparing newWolf to current cast.

Spoiler

 

If we were to talk about chopping trees, mining stone, basing at oasis or pk and walking to the ruins he'd lose by a lot even to a default character.

imo many people who think newWolf is good are just playing him and saying "I did something" and whether that something was better than Wilson or not, they think that's good...  But really, if Wilson can go out and accomplish combat related goals faster than Wolfgang and his 2x damage, wouldn't you see that as kinda a failing?  Take whatever you're doing with Wolf that you think is working so well, load up the same seed with Wilson and see how quickly Wilson completes the same tasks.  I think at best Wolfgang is going to break even, but is prone to falling behind.

[Vultureneck]

To me it feels like anyone who actually likes the change to Wolfgang appreciates the novelty of the rework, but are never actually going to play Wolfgang after the event dies down; I doubt anyone could play Wolfgang for any extended period of time without getting bored of the chore that is getting mighty.

1 hour ago, Dollmaker said:

mean with a good Gym you only stay there for a couple of seconds, and the Gembell helps you keep the Mightiness from dropping.

Man I'm soooo glad that Wolfgang no longer eats all the food from the icebox and instead eats all of our rocks and purple gems.

[Astraia]

I don't....like it, or do not like it, or have mixed feelings

I HATE IT 

[Echsrick]

its good, not perfect but just good, there could have been more things goin on, but its good, i just hope people start to calm down from that update, it realy was tiresome to see the forums, and everyone just sceaming

[luvu2bits]

Needs tuning for sure, there does come a point when working out becomes tiresome

[Milordo]

18 hours ago, Ohan said:

When will this agony end 

Wait! There's more!

Spoiler

 

[Mysterious box]

9 minutes ago, Dr.Medic said:

its good, not perfect but just good, there could have been more things goin on, but its good, i just hope people start to calm down from that update, it realy was tiresome to see the forums, and everyone just sceaming

I mean I can understand why people are upset about him in his current state he lost alot more than he gained and I'm personally becoming increasingly skeptical if he can even be considered the best combat character anymore. 

[Mike23Ua]

2 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

I mean I can understand why people are upset about him in his current state he lost alot more than he gained and I'm personally becoming increasingly skeptical if he can even be considered the best combat character anymore. 

He was never the best “combat” character only the best at his intended job of Boss Fights (we aren’t counting Wanda because she’s Paid DLC and in -insert any game ever here- Paid DLC characters usually outshine the Freemium ones.)

Now Excluding Wanda: Wolfgang is still single handedly the best at his job of being the go to choice for boss killing.

[Mysterious box]

1 minute ago, Mike23Ua said:

He was never the best “combat” character only the best at his intended job of Boss Fights (we aren’t counting Wanda because she’s Paid DLC and in -insert any game ever here- Paid DLC characters usually outshine the Freemium ones.)

Now Excluding Wanda: Wolfgang is still single handedly the best at his job of being the go to choice for boss killing.

But is he really the best bossing character and if so how specifically?

[Yuuko]

20 minutes ago, Dr.Medic said:

its good, not perfect but just good, there could have been more things goin on, but its good, i just hope people start to calm down from that update, it realy was tiresome to see the forums, and everyone just sceaming

I can understand people getting worked up though - I stared this game to play Willow, and dealt with her fire immunity being removed, and odd perks for a long time - and when they gave back her fire immunity and added Bernie it was a BIG improvement in the feel of the character.  It took a lot of fan insistence that fire immunity was still good for Klei to give that back.  When Wendy got her refresh she was originally given a risk/reward mechanic that asked you to be as low hp as possibly on Wendy so Abigail could do big dps.  Fan backlash was pretty strong as this was NOT the flavor of character they felt Wendy should have.  Within a week Klei put out the Wendy we have today, which both plays better thematically and works well mechanically.

People shouldn't shush up about Wolfgang.  I don't care if they add speed back or not, but current Wolfgang is no where near as good as he was and I honestly struggle finding a reason to play him.  Maybe someone likes super easy rhythm games, and perks that cost enough time that you might as well not have them...  idk, but that's what we got.  Klei could do a number of things to fix this, lots of good idea have been put forward that are genuine concessions giving up speed and absorbing the new workout assets.  Its unfortunate timing because Klei dumps this Wolfgang on us and then has 2 weeks holiday...  but we have no indication they are going to come back and do something about this.  No reason to shut up about it.  From my perspective it seems like Wolfgang's refresh is the only one intended to drive away his playerbase.

6 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

He was never the best “combat” character only the best at his intended job of Boss Fights (we aren’t counting Wanda because she’s Paid DLC and in -insert any game ever here- Paid DLC characters usually outshine the Freemium ones.)

Now Excluding Wanda: Wolfgang is still single handedly the best at his job of being the go to choice for boss killing.

I don't agree.  I think Wigfrid is the best boss character for anything earlier than it takes to get magic.  Once you get magic (gembells) you might as well run Wanda and get her whip.  Wolfgang used to be the high power early game character, with Wanda being the high power late game one, and Wigfrid being the new player / lag / group friendly one.  Now he's been pushed out of his role, and really doesn't excel anywhere.

[Dextops]

27 minutes ago, Milordo said:

Wait! There's more!

  Hide contents

 

if they nerf wicker instead of buffing her/making her more fun im finding the nearest cliff

[HowlVoid]

11 minutes ago, Dextops said:

if they nerf wicker instead of buffing her/making her more fun im finding the nearest cliff

Wicker has to sit down and read to fill her book meter.

You can only read books if you have enough book points in the book meter.

Wicker can craft 3 different types of encyclopedias that each fill the book meter at different speeds. 

Wicker can hit enemies with her encyclopedia, with the heavier encyclopedia doing the most damage.

Wicker's on tentacles will be removed because she's the Meta knight of boss farms and Winona can't shine as a result. 

Ps. This a joke please don't take notes Klei!

[Dextops]

1 minute ago, HowlVoid said:

Wicker has to sit down and read to fill her book meter.

You can only read books if you have enough book points in the book meter.

Wicker can craft 3 different types of encyclopedias that each fill the book meter at different speeds. 

Wicker can hit enemies with her encyclopedia, with the heavier encyclopedia doing the most damage.

Wicker's on tentacles will be removed because she's the Meta knight of boss farms and Winona can't shine as a result. 

...

[Cloakingsumo198]

4 hours ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

if you just found that means that you dont have experience with it.

Give me money arubaro ill go buy Wanda. Yeah, I haven't gotten my experience with her yet, I haven't played in a long time either but I can read, I've seen enough videos, and I have good game sense to some degree, so I can somewhat visualize how to utilize her kit.  She isn't risky at all if you aren't playing her that way, she has 150 hp total, she starts with a infinite healing item on cooldown, she starts with 3 time pieces so she can easily get invincibility frames, an extra heal, or free revives pretty early on in game. Or just go for her crazy weapon immediately and play risky. Those are CHOICES you CHOOSE which route you are gonna play her as. Getting more time piece parts is a easy, the archives have no enemies and monkey biomes have easy Thul walls.  Yeah playing with health that drains overtime is stressful but all that means is monitoring a number in the long run and if you can't  keep up you just keep that number as low as possible.  You can't use outside sources to heal? Well you have an infinite healing source go wild, wormwood's can't eat to heal, yet they don't cry. Alot of times people can't even get a healing source, yet Wanda has one that always comes back for her to use. The whip is useful in every form for Wanda she isn't forced to being old for every confrontation that's for "speedrunners" the most casual way to play is young, and your oldness will come when you fail to dodge, but oh look a little upside more damage to help finish the fight faster to come out on top Wanda is fluid and the literal definition of "I don't have time to bleed"

Wolfgang strong, Wolfgang slow, Wolfgang tedious, Wolfgang have no choice, blah blah I don't wanna type alot

[Dollmaker]

38 minutes ago, Dextops said:

if they nerf wicker instead of buffing her/making her more fun im finding the nearest cliff

I dont think they will, since shes was already nerfed when the Farming reworked happened.

I wonder what her refresh will be like though. 

But odds are Maxwell and WX are the most likely candidates to be next, since out of the 4 remaining they have the most issues, with one being nothing but a stat sponge and the other having a lot of inconveniences regarding his power. 

[Dextops]

10 minutes ago, Dollmaker said:

I dont think they will, since shes was already nerfed when the Farming reworked happened.

I wonder what her refresh will be like though. 

But odds are Maxwell and WX are the most likely candidates to be next, since out of the 4 remaining they have the most issues, with one being nothing but a stat sponge and the other having a lot of inconveniences regarding his power. 

yeah don't really agree with the nerf but i just hope they do buff her useless books/make her more interesting

 

[HowlVoid]

What if Wolfgang lost meter points when performing actions only, instead of a gradual loss?

His hunger could instead determine how many points he loses per action. With a fuller stomach having better returns than an empty one?

Like at full hunger he could lose 1 point every 4 hits and while empty he could lose like 10 points every hit. 

Numbers are an example only

[Dollmaker]

1 hour ago, HowlVoid said:

What if Wolfgang lost meter points when performing actions only, instead of a gradual loss?

His hunger could instead determine how many points he loses per action. With a fuller stomach having better returns than an empty one?

Like at full hunger he could lose 1 point every 4 hits and while empty he could lose like 10 points every hit. 

Numbers are an example only

I feel that would be beyond annoying early on and too OP later when you can keep hunger easily, it would allow you to keep the MF basically permanently, without having to maintain it. 

[HowlVoid]

22 minutes ago, Dollmaker said:

I feel that would be beyond annoying early on

Annoying how? Every time you work out you get full benefit, nothing is wasted by the simple passing of time. 

Do you mean because of having to be close to full? You already get penalized for not having near full stomach by the meter draining quicker. In this case if you don't do any actions that require the meter, the meter will wait until you eat.

Quote

 and too OP later when you can keep hunger easily, it would allow you to keep the MF basically permanently, without having to maintain it. 

Yeah but there is no benefit in being mighty other than a small amount of insulation. 

You use the meter when you attack, chop, etc. Essentially when you actually use the meter. 

You still have to work out to refill it, unless you never hit anything, chop, hammer, or mine for the rest of the game. And again there isn't any benefit the meter provides you other than when doing those actions. 

Oh I guess you mean wimpy wouldn't be a threat anymore. It's already an annoyance more than a threat tbh.

[Mike23Ua]

20 minutes ago, Dollmaker said:

I feel that would be beyond annoying early on and too OP later when you can keep hunger easily, it would allow you to keep the MF basically permanently, without having to maintain it. 

You can already do this by holding any heavy item, (boss statue, Antlion Boulder, large farm crop, those chunks of seashells you pull up out the ocean) and you can ride a Beefalo with the statue on the Beefalo & it still counts.

[Dollmaker]

44 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

Annoying how? Every time you work out you get full benefit, nothing is wasted by the simple passing of time. 

Do you mean because of having to be close to full? You already get penalized for not having near full stomach by the meter draining quicker. In this case if you don't do any actions that require the meter, the meter will wait until you eat.

I mean how early on properly maintaining high hunger can be a hassle, specially for newer players, and by having the Mighty Meter drain for everything basically (since it would also apply to mining and chopping) it would drain the mighty meter pretty fast. 

 

44 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

Yeah but there is no benefit in being mighty other than a small amount of insulation. 

 

The Piggybag penalty is removed when Mighty, extra slots are a big advantage, and we all know the RNG that the Krampus Sack has. 

Could also point out that his sanity drain is higher than other character, so being ready for combat in case you go insane would be wise. 

 

42 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

You can already do this by holding any heavy item, (boss statue, Antlion Boulder, large farm crop, those chunks of seashells you pull up out the ocean) and you can ride a Beefalo with the statue on the Beefalo & it still counts.

I mean yeah, but you cant do much besides moving, and not everyone is into Beefalo taming, specially in Wolfgang case, due to his dmg being higher. 

[HowlVoid]

47 minutes ago, Dollmaker said:

I mean how early on properly maintaining high hunger can be a hassle, specially for newer players, and by having the Mighty Meter drain for everything basically (since it would also apply to mining and chopping) it would drain the mighty meter pretty fast. 

 

The Piggybag penalty is removed when Mighty, extra slots are a big advantage, and we all know the RNG that the Krampus Sack has. 

Could also point out that his sanity drain is higher than other character, so being ready for combat in case you go insane would be wise. 

 

I mean yeah, but you cant do much besides moving, and not everyone is into Beefalo taming, specially in Wolfgang case, due to his dmg being higher. 

Well I'm not invested in the idea anymore because wimpy Wolfgang would stop being a threat. Klei wouldn't want that so the idea is a bust. 

[ArubaroBeefalo]

6 hours ago, HowlVoid said:

Wicker can hit enemies with her encyclopedia, with the heavier encyclopedia doing the most damage.

Don Quixote de La Mancha as weapon and aoe damage buff at cost of sanity :3

[ArubaroBeefalo]

7 hours ago, Cloakingsumo198 said:

you didnt mentioned that you cant heal while taking damage (you have to pay a lot more attention to weather), you cant heal if you take damage right after and that op infinity source of healing has cooldown. Most of the time, unless you are inexperience and pick wanda for some reason, you will play at old age which means that you have to wait until 72 years old to heal, if you fail that healing you might be done.

Dont come with weird situation where you cant heal because is near impossible (blue mush, lichen, butterflies, lightbulbs, everything heals) and bundle wraps+rwys is a thing, and unbalanced thing thanks to potatoe+tomatoe combo

sure, watching videos from people whith X000 hours makes wanda feel the easiee and opiii character in the entire game but, even if diying in the game has become a dumb thing that most of the time has no negative effect, you will die a lot more

for me wanda is easy and op and boring after a while but not all the people who play dst is like us so yeah, she is one of the hardest characters and is kinda balanced

i would nerf to the ground middle and young age plus a big nerf to the weapon but that is ME a guy with 4k hours, tell a poor guy with 500h that doesnt expend that time using console commands and rollback to learn to faceroll bosses and spoiling the game with tutorials and streams that wanda is easy

and again, why wanda cant be OP when we have wigfrid which feels like a mod character with 4828572 perks and just 1 stupid downside (she can eat taffy, jelly beans, mushcake... what a downside wow), wendy which has a 600hp 40 damage body ward for free or woodie who can fight, explore and gather resources for little cost