My thoughts summarized on the wolfgang rework

[Dextops]

Since i had a lot of people arguing with me and sadly i won't be able to respond to them in time anymore since i have finals ill just leave a little summarization of my thoughts if they wanted to see everything i thought about the rework if you do disagree feel free to quote but i won't respond

starting off with reason one. This one is a small one, but you can basically see all there is to see in a couple of minutes not counting for a lot of minor perks and the rework didn't add much perks that will always be something you can use/deal with

second point is that i don't see a lot of reason to be mighty while yes with this new hotfix it definitely added something i don't feel like its enough reason especially when alternatives exist such as other characters like wurt maxwell, more late game options such as bearger, and pigs which are a better alternative imo, but also the bigger point to be made here is that a 2x dps is not much and is over valued by the community it seems. The problem with this is the fact that most bosses are not worth killing twice if at all and the ones that are worth killing twice are either easy or just cheesable, so the gameplay gets really boring from time to time with the fact that i am just playing wilson for a while until the boss that is worth killing twice and can't be cheesed respawns which a lot of people overlook since a lot just went into creative and tested it (obviously not everyone) giving him a perk such as idk just throwing this out here randomly maybe possible a small chance it could be speed?

 the rework made him a lot more specialized and his mini perks are kinda useless/outclassed. First off the piggyback being carried with no speed loss was always a thing with mighty form and even if it wasn't beefalo/woby exist. I also feel that marble suit is an eh perk since if you're kiting even if you get hit once or twice with weaker and much cheaper armor like football helmet you should be fine and if you're tanking you won't see any difference and there is no point to keep it on outside of combat. Also removal of speed has made him a lot more specialized and nothing was really given to compensate. Beefalo/woby also outclass him in statue moving and mining/chopping faster was shown earlier.

last one (for now im kinda blanking rn as i write this) Wimpy form lacks an outstanding downside. Like mentioned before combat is pretty niche and most other scenarios can be avoided and since theres not much reason to be mighty theres not really a point of carrying a dumbbell so my next suggestion which obviously is speed because of course it is but it'd also be nice for him to have a speed up in mighty form mentioned earlier but also give him a speed down in wimpy form giving him a downside a reason to be mighty and a reason to carry a dumbbell for you currently which is some major problems i see with the rework if they were able to do this my judgement of the rework would be a lot better than it is currently.


Anyway thats it for now unless i edit it right after because i forgot something. basically this lesson is never let me write an essay there will be no capitalization most of the time and add wolfgangs speed back this is a written threat klei your ip address is 

Spoiler

123.123.12.123 (totally)

tldr: never let me near a keyboard ever again or else you'll get an unwell structured essay of nothing but rambling from a dumbass who should be studying for language arts obviously instead of showing why language arts is my lowest grade

 

[Porkus]

Wow your words make things happen in the social systems

[Well-met]

29 minutes ago, Dextops said:

second point is that i don't see a lot of reason to be mighty while yes with this new hotfix it definitely added something i don't feel like its enough reason especially when alternatives exist such as other characters like wurt maxwell, more late game options such as bearger, and pigs which are a better alternative imo, but also the bigger point to be made here is that a 2x dps is not much and is over valued by the community it seems. The problem with this is the fact that most bosses are not worth killing twice if at all and the ones that are worth killing twice are either easy or just cheesable, so the gameplay gets really boring from time to time with the fact that i am just playing wilson for a while until the boss that is worth killing twice and can't be cheesed respawns which a lot of people overlook since a lot just went into creative and tested it (obviously not everyone) giving him a perk such as idk just throwing this out here randomly maybe possible a small chance it could be speed?
 

"double damage is overrated"

"i dont bother with bosses and when i do i just abuse exploits"

huh.

[Toroic]

Have you ever considered that Wolfgang just isn't designed to appeal to your specific tastes? 

He's a character clearly designed to be aggressive and fight bosses, and that doesn't appear to be something you enjoy.

Yes, obviously you aren't going to value 2x damage when you do the minimal amount of fighting possible.  There's a lot of people who enjoy fighting bosses early and often, and both are ok.

If speed is what you care about, have you considered Wormwood, Woby, or Wx?

[Duck986]

3 hours ago, Toros said:

If speed is what you care about, have you considered Wormwood, Woby, or Wx?

that sounded like Woby is a playable character now lol

[Gashzer]

As a walter main, i love 60% speed boost woby gives, come join us walter mains Dextops. 10 bunnymen wreck both dragonfly and bee queen in first autumn with walter flinging marble or thulecite rounds as support.

Who needs wolfgang and his pitiful 2x damage? When you can have zero sanity drain, boosted winter and summer insulation by stacking clothing gear cause you don't need a backpack for walter cause of woby's 9 slots.

Even old wolfgangs speed boost of 20% sucks compared to walter lol

[Dextops]

20 hours ago, Toros said:

Have you ever considered that Wolfgang just isn't designed to appeal to your specific tastes? 

nah i do think i could get into him i just wish he was more in depth in his combat which is something i think i forgot to mention and i do like combat but i don't think wolfgangs combat style is really different from anyone elses per say he just makes them faster

 

22 hours ago, Well-met said:

"double damage is overrated"

"i dont bother with bosses and when i do i just abuse exploits"

huh.

this makes no sense. like at all. It's in the game and i think it should be considered when doing something also i didn't say i don't bother with bosses i said many aren't worth killing more than once.

anyway see ya im on break ill probably give my final thoughts when its finally released

[Porkus]

9 hours ago, Gashzer said:

As a walter main, i love 60% speed boost woby gives, come join us walter mains Dextops. 10 bunnymen wreck both dragonfly and bee queen in first autumn with walter flinging marble or thulecite rounds as support.

Who needs wolfgang and his pitiful 2x damage? When you can have zero sanity drain, boosted winter and summer insulation by stacking clothing gear cause you don't need a backpack for walter cause of woby's 9 slots.

Even old wolfgangs speed boost of 20% sucks compared to walter lol

Actually our group considers walter the strongest character thats why we don't consider wolfgang's speed so good, and why it doesn't have to be removed as others outclass him

22 hours ago, Well-met said:

"double damage is overrated"

"i dont bother with bosses and when i do i just abuse exploits"

huh.

Some bosses don't need to be killed several time - dextops explained that

[Yuuko]

22 minutes ago, Third Porkus said:

Actually our group considers walter the strongest character thats why we don't consider wolfgang's speed so good, and why it doesn't have to be removed as others outclass him

Walter speed runs incoming?  Or is this just hyperbole? lol

[Porkus]

28 minutes ago, Shosuko said:

Walter speed runs incoming?  Or is this just hyperbole? lol

Not talking about in speed runs

[Well-met]

1 hour ago, Third Porkus said:

Some bosses don't need to be killed several time - dextops explained that

then don't pick wolfgang if you intend to play this passive

[Porkus]

8 minutes ago, Well-met said:

then don't pick wolfgang if you intend to play this passive

Well thats just ignoring that it's not necessary, why should a character be built so heavily around that 1 stat, when he could have two and did have two that are both at different levels useful

[Seero]

On 12/14/2021 at 9:12 PM, Dextops said:

Beefalo/woby also outclass him in statue moving and mining/chopping faster was shown earlier.

How do beefalo/woby help you mine and chop faster?

[Mike23Ua]

I’m playing Wolfgang in the final hours before his rework.. I just effectively killed the eye of terror with very little actual skill required, EoT awards me a boss statue Blueprint, and an Eye Mask, Eye Mask is a Helmet that can be repaired by feeding it food (including Redcaps and Rot) I can use this Eye Mask to kill him a 2nd time and now have TWO Eye Masks to juggle between the two.. I Can also create two EoT statues in preparation to place them on his Gym tomorrow for Max Buff gains.. 

EoT has Deerclops levels health, and come tommorow: Wolfgang will half that without the strength diminishing mid fight. 
I am also eagerly looking forward to oddly enough: his animated short and Belongings skins.

[Gi-Go]

2 hours ago, Seero said:

How do beefalo/woby help you mine and chop faster?

Oh hey, the guy who said Wolfgang dosen't need a nerf half a year ago. How do you feel about this rework so far? I'm genuinely very curious. 

[Spep]

People keep talking about the old speed buff from mighty like it ever had a real effect beyond early game dragonfly kills or ruins rushing, but maybe my exclusive use of old people has made """travel time""" a foreign concept to me.

Damage is more consistent, direct upgrade, moving on.

i do personally think that wolfgang got the walter treatment in the form of 2 dozen perks so mild they may as well be useless, so that is pretty awful, alongside walter himself.

As far as i know mighty form post rework has no direct effect on hunger, so there really is no reason to not be mighty most of the time, unless building more than one gym on the map is anathema to your playstyle.



All and all i think wolfgang got a mild buff, alongside a severe case of garbage perk disorder. tune in next week where i will throw two thousand walter effigies into the sun to prevent his further corruption of character reworks.

[Mr Giggio]

you were everywhere in that thread, hard spammin and now makin ur own post to complain about the rework
we get it, you hated it
Now if its possible consider just let it go for good cuz its really starting to annoy the fact u cant get over stuff which doesnt fit ur taste.

[firoborn]

5 hours ago, Seero said:

snip

 

you can make bearger charge/run longer between stomps

[Mike23Ua]

6 minutes ago, firoborn said:

you can make bearger charge/run longer between stomps

Hit him with an Ice staff.. from further away.. or, just drop flower petals near him and then when you see him trying to walk towards them: just pick them back up so he gets mad and chases after you.

Interesting fact: Bearger is actually a PASSIVE Boss, you can walk right up under his feet and he will never attack you unless  A: You attack him first, B: you pick up a food item near to him or C: you End up in the misfortune of being hit by his attacks when he is fighting something else (like a angry Bee)

Other then that: you can walk right up to him and give him warm fuzzy hugs, you can also walk along behind him picking up the fur he passively drops to build yourself some nice stuffs out of it without needing to kill the poor adorable Bear  

He also gets bored of you and stops trying to attack you after a short while and returns to being passive: his quest is only to eat food.. not kill you.

[Yuuko]

16 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Hit him with an Ice staff.. from further away.. or, just drop flower petals near him and then when you see him trying to walk towards them: just pick them back up so he gets mad and chases after you.

Interesting fact: Bearger is actually a PASSIVE Boss, you can walk right up under his feet and he will never attack you unless  A: You attack him first, B: you pick up a food item near to him or C: you End up in the misfortune of being hit by his attacks when he is fighting something else (like a angry Bee)

Other then that: you can walk right up to him and give him warm fuzzy hugs, you can also walk along behind him picking up the fur he passively drops to build yourself some nice stuffs out of it without needing to kill the poor adorable Bear  

He also gets bored of you and stops trying to attack you after a short while and returns to being passive: his quest is only to eat food.. not kill you.

I put bearger on one of the lunar islands and decorate it for him, and deliver him foods.  When I need trees harvested, he's always there for me <3  He's definitely a better pet than boss XD

[Mike23Ua]

22 minutes ago, Shosuko said:

I put bearger on one of the lunar islands and decorate it for him, and deliver him foods.  When I need trees harvested, he's always there for me <3  He's definitely a better pet than boss XD

Bearger is also a really good example of Large oversized character like Wolfgang with Abnormal strength, it’s large… it has spurts of being fast.. but you can OUTRUN him..

The Juggernauts in state of Decay 2 they barrel towards you with speed but you can still OUTRUN them and they come to a halt needing to breath eventually.

Just like the Titans in the critically acclaimed game Batman Arkham Asylum, they were juiced up: Large and could charge at you fast temporarily but you could STILL OUTRUN them..

So: Is the large entity “faster” or do they only have “short bursts” of being faster before they tire themselves out?

Using WWE as a comparison in virtually any David Vs Goliath style match (Big Show Vs Rey Mysterio, Keith Lee Vs Ricochet) The big man is fast only until he runs out of stamina.. meanwhile the skinny little agile acrobatic dude is running circles around him and just can’t be caught.

I love the Titans in the Arkham games they charge at Batman then get frustrated they can’t catch him so they snatch up one of the smaller thugs in frustration and throw them towards him lol..

That to me capsulate’s what a large man SHOULD be.. & for Wolfgang to always be Speedy 24/7 it just didn’t make much sense.

if he had a Stamina bar and needed to take short breaks before “go fast” again.. maybe?

[Dragonboooorn]

2 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

The Juggernauts in state of Decay 2 they barrel towards you with speed but you can still OUTRUN them and they come to a halt needing to breath eventually.

They never rest against me tho. I once encoured two of them on my doctors rescue mission...Had to use artillery fun on them. State of decay 1

[Mike23Ua]

11 minutes ago, Dragonboooorn said:

They never rest against me tho. I once encoured two of them on my doctors rescue mission...Had to use artillery fun on them. State of decay 1

That’s just bad luck, they’re designed to stop chasing after awhile before chasing again (they’re also vulnerable and take more damage from melee attacks from behind during this time) 

But: I’m straying off-topic with talks of other games- I’m just using their portrayals of large entity that moves fast before needing to come to a rest, For Pre-Rework Wolfgang he never needed to rest at all..

And that playstyle only fit one category of gamer: Speed Runners.

[Dragonboooorn]

3 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

(they’re also vulnerable and take more damage from melee attacks from behind during this time) 

Thats the point. There was two of them, they literally used rhinocebros strategy from Forge. While one is resting － the other one defends him

[Blunty_x]

On 12/14/2021 at 8:07 PM, Toros said:

Have you ever considered that Wolfgang just isn't designed to appeal to your specific tastes? 

He's a character clearly designed to be aggressive and fight bosses, and that doesn't appear to be something you enjoy.

Yes, obviously you aren't going to value 2x damage when you do the minimal amount of fighting possible.  There's a lot of people who enjoy fighting bosses early and often, and both are ok.

If speed is what you care about, have you considered Wormwood, Woby, or Wx?

I took his point as saying, 2x DMG as a standalone perk is not that great with the removal of speed and makes him whatever into a late game. I agree with him here..to me at this point in time Wolfgang was more about the speed then the unreliable 2x modifier..you don't have 2x for very long into a fight anyway unless your just downing honey to top off. 

I'm my world I was in Mighty form all the time not because I could deal 2x damage but because I could get around so damn fast. I think Wolfgang mains can agree with me here. Speed is useful 100% of the time all the time. Whereas 2x dmg is only good in combat and let's be real here your  not gonna be in combat all the time..

I already miss the 300hp because with blue shrooms you were always at 300hp and damn near 2x dmg...it's funny to me that some idiot at Klei was like.."okay let's take his speed and HP boost and in return have him Chop faster, mine faster, Carey heavy things and let's just throw rowing faster cause ya know, everyone loves the ocean content" balance can't be the reason in a non competitive game..

Wolfgang you will be missed, but I will continue to play DS Vanilla to be reminded of your glory days in DST. Also they need to nerf Wendy and Wigfrid the 2 most popular characters.