Wicker books rework?

[Lord Cafe]

Hello, i was wondering if anyone else think that wicker need a rework on her books, we have now a book for, twigs, grass, trees and one for plants, since farms are enough to self sustain you will never use this book in farms and the book only affect 10 berries and if they are transplanted consumes two uses for each plant that means only 5 berries per use(preety bad) but this isn't a problem, starvation was never a problem in this game so would be great if wicker had books to do more things like, start a rain? this would help farms in a indirect way instead of just reading a book and making everthing grow. The End Is Nigh this books is ONLY USEFULL when you're playing with a wx  friend, can we please make this book usefull for other things? i have this game for almost three years and this book was only  a WX Charger, would be awesome if we could focus the light strikes or if they at least did a good amount of damage, this ins't a pvp game so there's no problem if each strike deal 10 - 20 damage per strike in mobs.

Imagine if the book summoned 10 strikes and each one did 10 damage is only 100 damage, this is barely usefull but is way better than reading a book with a rain coat and 3 strikes hitting you, 6 strikes hitting nothing and only one hitting the GIANT BOSS IN FRONT OF YOU nobody would try to create large amount of this books to kill monster without even fighting, but as i said at least this would give the sensation of having a good use for the book and not a WX Charger.

The others books like, tentacle book, book of the birds and the sleep stories are fine, we can use them to a lot of things not so often but is a power which you can use and save a good amount of time(Traps, Krampus farm and feather farm or food)

I'm not complaning about the farms and the books, i complained before cus the new book was announced to make only 10  plants(no matter which type) grow and this was terrible and they reverted and splited the book in two and that was great, i almost never use the horticulture book anyways but we have this almost useless The End Is Nigh for so long... can we please update that?.

Cheers

Edit: If The End  Is Night did 25 damage per strike we could use it to insta kill birds after reading Birds Of The World if each strike focused the nearby enemy(not the player if he's using a rain coat).

Edit: My main uses of the end is nigh is WX Charge or to charge Volts to make them drop a better loot. 

[Well-met]

Wicker's character refresh will come in due time.

[Lord Cafe]

35 minutes ago, Well-met said:

Wicker's character refresh will come in due time.

I think wicker is fine in all aspects beside the book "The End Is Nigh" we need a rework on other characters like, webber, max, wolfgang(super broken) so Klei don't need to refresh wicker since she's fine, just tweak the book to focus targets beside the players(if is not using a rain coat) and do  more damage, this would open a lot new uses for the book and would not consume Klei's time. 

[SilverBisexual]

6 minutes ago, Lord Cafe said:

I think wicker is fine in all aspects beside the book "The End Is Nigh" we need a rework on other characters like, webber, max, wolfgang(super broken) so Klei don't need to refreash wicker since she's fine, just tweak the book to focus targets beside the players(if is not using a rain coat) and do  more damage, this would open a lot new uses for the book and would not consume Klei's time. 

I also think that the lightning should not cause the target to be on fire. I don't want a boss's loot or everything is the vicinity to just burn to ashes.

[Mike23Ua]

I think that Wickers Rework will be absolutely amazing.. Why? Because Klei already made risky moves with her- by nerfing the heck out of her books, before fan feedback was heard and they re-tweaked things to be more acceptable.

I personally think that you shouldn’t try to fix something that was never broken, Wicker was designed as this OP Merlin level book casting character.. and if Klei hits her with too big of a nerf, she loses her identity of who she originally was. 

I think that if something is intended to be OP it should remain to be OP however- maybe it can be rebalanced in a more acceptable way so that it is Over Powered.. but it is a rewarding type of Over Powered.. you had to work for it to achieve it.

For example- Splitting the books into two different books still allows Wicker to do the things she has always done... but now she needs two books instead of a one stop shop for all resources.

I think the higher tier books could use “slight” modifications such as requiring new harder to get ingredients from various locations around the constant in exchange for better uses and results with the books.

I also want Wicker to get Waterballoon/Wortox style casting range circles so I can aim at and effect exactly what I want to effect... (didn’t she have this type of casting in the Forge Event??)

Thats about all I really want to see with Wicker, no super heavy identity losing Nerfs, just proper rebalancing.. harder to get ingredients requiring us to explore the map more often, and new books that do exciting new things!

[Lord Cafe]

24 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

I think that Wickers Rework will be absolutely amazing.. Why? Because Klei already made risky moves with her- by nerfing the heck out of her books, before fan feedback was heard and they re-tweaked things to be more acceptable.

I personally think that you shouldn’t try to fix something that was never broken, Wicker was designed as this OP Merlin level book casting character.. and if Klei hits her with too big of a nerf, she loses her identity of who she originally was. 

I think that if something is intended to be OP it should remain to be OP however- maybe it can be rebalanced in a more acceptable way so that it is Over Powered.. but it is a rewarding type of Over Powered.. you had to work for it to achieve it.

For example- Splitting the books into two different books still allows Wicker to do the things she has always done... but now she needs two books instead of a one stop shop for all resources.

I think the higher tier books could use “slight” modifications such as requiring new harder to get ingredients from various locations around the constant in exchange for better uses and results with the books.

I also want Wicker to get Waterballoon/Wortox style casting range circles so I can aim at and effect exactly what I want to effect... (didn’t she have this type of casting in the Forge Event??)

Thats about all I really want to see with Wicker, no super heavy identity losing Nerfs, just proper rebalancing.. harder to get ingredients requiring us to explore the map more often, and new books that do exciting new things!

Great feedback and great ideias of how make her better but how wicker is op? making food and resources grow is op? unless you're playing in a great server  you almost don't use her books, i used two times her power in day 78 to make some  grass grow so spamming wicker books isn't a good thing only players who have low experience would do that, we don't need 4  stacks of berries and 400 grass, logs and twigs on day 5 so wicker was never OP.

Look at wolfgang he's a OP character, you don't need anything to do well on him, he has high HP and double damage and 130% movement speed and almost the same sanity as wicker you can beat deerclops with axe with no armor and still have 120 sanity, if you use wig and  spear  you gonna have to stop the fight in the middle to beat shadow creatures also and  she's not afraid of monsters right? so why one guy who has fear of monsters deal with a monster better than a bold warrior like her? beside that, wolf can sleep and eat any food without problems(wicker don't get much benefit from yellow foods and can't sleep).

I think each character should be good at one thing and with  a deep gameplay like wicker, can't sleep, so you need to do foods to get health and manage her sanity with foods and items, she have a great power but drains drasticaly her sanity so you can use purple amulet or read only when insane and then get your sanity back(things only good players do) but let's compare wolfgang again.

He's good at everthing, you need to grab food? no problem double damage and 300hp plus 130% speed, don't even need a spear, use axe and beat everyone, aren't you fighting? no problem, don't stay in might form and he has 200 hunger which is enough to sustain you for days  without problem  while you  grab  resources like others characters, your sanity is low? use food, items or just sleep, you can clearly notice that he's op  and don't have deep gameplay and that's why i don't like wolfgang he's to boring and overpowered if he was overpowered but with a deep gameplay he would  be great.

Another thing is,  people always hated wickers because of her powers claiming that she's op because she can beat bosses even being a farmer character, this is a problem? we really need to  always have a wolfgang to beat a boss? nobody can knock down DF unless you're playing wolfgang but we can still fight normal and win with more preparation using our powers and strategies and not just dodging without armor because he runs super fast and deals a insane damage.

Worm can't heal so you need to use other types of healing and always have a bed to sleep but he can do thousands of usefull items and now with this new updates he can do much more and  better, we need things like wicker and worm(but not everyone hard) but characters good in one thing with a good gamplay.

[viberr]

2 hours ago, Lord Cafe said:

this is a problem?

well yeah it is. wicker doesn't kill bosses in the normal way she can just use on tentacles and kill tons of bosses with little to no effort.at least wolfgang has to fight the bosses .

 

2 hours ago, Lord Cafe said:

we really need to  always have a wolfgang to beat a boss?

most play solo and most play characters other than wolfgang(example.me im a wendy main still kill all the bosses)and characters like wendy have an advantage against bosses like beequeen or woodie being good against toadstool.but the thing about them is that they still need to actually fight the boss which wicker doesn't have to do so to answer your question.no wolfgang doesn't have to kill every boss bur wicker shouldn't either

anyways would like to say you mentioned wolfgang a lot in your reply.to the point some might consider it off topic so do what you will with that info 

also i don't know if you know this but wicker was really op because if you had one wicker in your team and 5 wolfgangs she could supply them all with food in mere minutes 

too da loo

[Mike23Ua]

47 minutes ago, stranger again said:

1- wicker doesn't kill bosses in the normal way she uses on tentacles and kills with little/ no effort. at least wolfgang has to fight the bosses.

2- also wicker is really op because with wicker in your team and 5 wolfgangs she can supply them all with food. 

#1 is highly subjective, does EVERY character Have to fight bosses by traditional methods? Wicker having unique ways of doing it makes her more unique, just like Walter is best used while using Woby as a Mount and using his slingshot as the ranged character he is designed to be, Wurt can recruit an entire Army to kill stuffs for her, Willow can have Bernie single handed rage war on all Shadow constructs.. 

Wickerbottom using books to fight is just part of her design, not something broken that needs fixing.

#2 Okay so your right about this one.. but Wolfgang is a boring character that was designed for single player gameplay in mind, and he should have to do a little more then just eat food and be Mighty, in my opinion the dude is like Superman without any Kryptonite.. He NEEDS to be Reworked, he should need to “Perform” mighty activities to get (and keep) himself in mighty form, such as lifting dumbbells, lifting heavy objects, lifting other players, carrying heavy objects with less movement speed penalty, and Maybe as a compromise he would be able to be mighty on less full stomach but only if he stays at like 65% hunger and continues doing mighty actions..

in other words: Wicker being able to supply 5 Wolfgang’s with plenty of Food is less of a Problem with Wicker... and more of a problem with Wolfgang having no Kryptonite.

[Maxil20]

1 hour ago, stranger again said:

wicker doesn't kill bosses in the normal way she can just use on tentacles and kill tons of bosses with little to no effort.at least wolfgang has to fight the bosses .

While Wicker is my favorite in terms of a utility character, I really don’t find on tentacles good. It’s:

A. Exceptionally risky, since while Wolfgang won’t take recoil damage from having 2X damage, Wicker can’t say the same with on tentacles. There is an extremely high chance you will get stunlocked and die in a tentacle setup both when you are trying to lure the boss to it and pick up the loot from the boss.

B. Farming up the initial set of books is tedious. Tentacles only drop spots 20% of the time, and the only consistent method is big tentacles, which is 50%X2 (since both ends die and drop loot) of the time.

C. Tentacles don’t heal, so after awhile you get to a point where a setup that relies on them slowly needs to be restocked, and potentially won’t even kill a boss if they are weak enough unless you manually clear them out yourself.

D. Winona’s catapults exist, and basically outperform tentacles in every way. Easier to setup, they actually can heal, and AoE damage is really strong in some boss fights (Fuelweaver + bee queen come to mind).

It’s better then doing damage as a default character, sure, but I barely find it worthwhile compared to the effort and the high risk associated with it.

1 hour ago, stranger again said:

also i don't know if you know this but wicker was really op because if you had one wicker in your team and 5 wolfgangs she could supply them all with food in mere minutes 

I never liked this argument, since said Wolfgangs could also just destroy whatever stands in their way and also get enough food for all of them without much effort either. It’s not hard to fight and get the food you need to sustain that many Wolfgangs when you can kill any non boss mob in seconds, even if all of them were Normal. Alternatively, you could stay normal and kill butterflies for 3/4ths of the seasons, since butterflies are directly proportional to the amount of players on a server.

[viberr]

46 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

does EVERY character Have to fight bosses by traditional methods?

no but im just saying that her form of attacking is pretty lame(in my opinion of course)compare it to walter who has some strategy involved with what ammunition he should use(just saying the word strategy made me think of chess)wicker just makes a little place for all the tentacles and there nothing else required other than waiting for the boss to die

 

50 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Wickerbottom using books to fight

you mean one book right?(no actually uses the end is nigh for fighting right?)

 

51 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

and more of a problem with Wolfgang having no Kryptonite.

i don't think you got what i fully meant.wolfgang has no kryptonite because his weakness is killed by his upside(his weakness is that fact he has faster hunger drain)lets say none of the wolfgangs did anything and stood at base well then wicker can still feed them all completely even with there faster hunger drain so what im trying to say is that she used to generate a lot of food and that was pretty op in a team setting

 

19 minutes ago, Maxil20 said:

It’s better then doing damage as a default character, sure, but I barely find it worthwhile compared to the effort and the high risk associated with it.

same but they are still pretty strong in most use cases 

 

20 minutes ago, Maxil20 said:

I never liked this argument,

well maybe i used the wrong argument let me try again.what i was trying to say is that wicker used to generate loads of food with her applied horticulture book which can be given to everyone even the people just doing nothing but sitting at base for the low cost of 2 seeds and two manure and 2 papyrus and thats pretty op if you ask me 

anyways thats both you guys opinions and im okay with that because your opinions make you unique

hope you guys(and gals)have a nice day or night wherever you are in the world

[Lord Cafe]

14 hours ago, stranger again said:

well yeah it is. wicker doesn't kill bosses in the normal way she can just use on tentacles and kill tons of bosses with little to no effort.at least wolfgang has to fight the bosses .

 

most play solo and most play characters other than wolfgang(example.me im a wendy main still kill all the bosses)and characters like wendy have an advantage against bosses like beequeen or woodie being good against toadstool.but the thing about them is that they still need to actually fight the boss which wicker doesn't have to do so to answer your question.no wolfgang doesn't have to kill every boss bur wicker shouldn't either

anyways would like to say you mentioned wolfgang a lot in your reply.to the point some might consider it off topic so do what you will with that info 

also i don't know if you know this but wicker was really op because if you had one wicker in your team and 5 wolfgangs she could supply them all with food in mere minutes 

too da loo

I'm not gonna bother myself reading any other reply made by you just this one since last time you tried to shame me because i did some gramar error and cus you  din't have good argument  against my other post and then you started to attacking me but who the hell use tentacle to kill bosses beside queen bee? this is only usefull to her and klei changed her to not focus the tentacles so she lost the interest on them after a while and you  need to keep attacking and bringing her to the traps so it's very risk and how this is easy? and you need almost 5 books and thousands of resource to do a single trap for a single boss and most people just use bunny man since every character can craft this and is far easy and effective, so this is your point because she's OP?.

Are you again  using the farm as a argument to justify your point? she's a farm character she NEED to be good to bring resources and food in the base and tell me how 5 wolfgang in the same server would not result in thousands of suplies? they can beat anything with no  problem, nobody in don't starv dies to starvation this is a fact meatballs are so easy to make and give a huge amount of hungry, you can literraly go every single day to the spider biome and get thousands of monster meat and feed to a bird and use eggs to make meatballs(not the best idea) so, if you're  lazy  to grab any other resource you can literraly stay by  just pressing F every single day  without using any external source of food.

With this new farm system that klei released is literraly so easy to make food, since they made crops more easy to grow in day 10 on a public server i had more than 50 tomatos and potatos and din't used the wicker book a single time since  growing crops manually is better than forcing with her power and 5 berries per use it's laughable in comparasion with 4 plots of 9 tomato / potato and another 16x16 with random seeds growing every day and this server had 6 people and almost 2  warlys literraly eating everthing we had the whole day so this sentence "Wicker is op because she can sustain people" was invalid before the update and now is way more invalid. 

Cheers.

13 hours ago, Maxil20 said:

While Wicker is my favorite in terms of a utility character, I really don’t find on tentacles good. It’s:

A. Exceptionally risky, since while Wolfgang won’t take recoil damage from having 2X damage, Wicker can’t say the same with on tentacles. There is an extremely high chance you will get stunlocked and die in a tentacle setup both when you are trying to lure the boss to it and pick up the loot from the boss.

B. Farming up the initial set of books is tedious. Tentacles only drop spots 20% of the time, and the only consistent method is big tentacles, which is 50%X2 (since both ends die and drop loot) of the time.

C. Tentacles don’t heal, so after awhile you get to a point where a setup that relies on them slowly needs to be restocked, and potentially won’t even kill a boss if they are weak enough unless you manually clear them out yourself.

D. Winona’s catapults exist, and basically outperform tentacles in every way. Easier to setup, they actually can heal, and AoE damage is really strong in some boss fights (Fuelweaver + bee queen come to mind).

It’s better then doing damage as a default character, sure, but I barely find it worthwhile compared to the effort and the high risk associated with it.

I never liked this argument, since said Wolfgangs could also just destroy whatever stands in their way and also get enough food for all of them without much effort either. It’s not hard to fight and get the food you need to sustain that many Wolfgangs when you can kill any non boss mob in seconds, even if all of them were Normal. Alternatively, you could stay normal and kill butterflies for 3/4ths of the seasons, since butterflies are directly proportional to the amount of players on a server.

What great reply! this is a person  with great arguments and not just hate like Strange Again which always use the same arguments and then when people reply him with better arguments he start to shame other because of their grammar and this dude hate wickers so much and i don't know why, if wicker was OP i would come to up this forum and ask for a nerf since i want a balanced and fun character and she's is the example of how a balanced character should be but this man hates Wickers i don't know why and i would recommend to not waste time replying him he never  listen and does what i said earlier so just ignore him.

I don't hate wolfgang i just always use him as example because he's not balanced it's just that,  we don't need  to make wolfgang bad at battle, nop! he should be a powerfull charcter but with REAL Downsides his dowsindes are just lies, nobody gets insane as wolf, nobody walks all the time in MIGHT FORM to say that he has hunger drain and  ins't a big deal  keeping him in might formy during battle since when you  eat to recovery  life you will receve hunger either so is a win / win in every aspect while other characters are extremely good at some things and bad at other or some of them are just good and others don't even have any perk or downsides he's almost the unique Win / Win character in the whole game and people complain about wicker who is the most balanced and not the most hardest character to play but probrably the character you need the most knowledge of the game to make her usefull for their team instead of a just farm spam guy. 

[viberr]

26 minutes ago, Lord Cafe said:

attacking me 

you confusing me with another guy?i never said that (did make a "i hate you joke" but that was just a joke)

i remain fully kind and calm on the forums and i don't attack anyone 

so can you show me proof if you have any?

also im sorry if i've hurt you in any way

26 minutes ago, Lord Cafe said:

Are you again  using the farm as a argument to justify your point?

yup.if shes really good at something (even the thing shes meant to be good at)then shes OP.from your logic wolfgang isn't OP because hes meant to be good at fighting

your opinions are interesting but i don't really have any time to ask any questions so

too da loooo

26 minutes ago, Lord Cafe said:

not just hate like Strange Again

MY EGO!!!!!!!!!! ITS DYING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(thats a joke i don't have any ego)

26 minutes ago, Lord Cafe said:

i don't know why and i would recommend to not waste time replying him he never  listen and does what i said earlier so just ignore him.

ok now thats just too far can you please stop?

telling people to completely ignore me is really rude and really unwarranted considering your lack of evidence of me doing any of those things so if you keep being rude i might have to use the report button 

[JoeW]

Please keep posts polite, constructive and without personal attacks. If you feel somebody is breaking the forum guidelines, report it. Don't find yourself in violation of the rules by attacking back. Thanks.