How to Rebalance Don't Starve for Multiplayer? Console Commands Yes/No? page 16

[XLuckySeven69X]

If they implement something like that, then sure, that'll work. I'm of the mind to not create everything for convenience, though. There are so many ideas out there, good ones I guess, but they're all about making everything easy and worry-free. I don't like that.

 

Yeah I can agree with what you saying. I hope that multiplayer is balanced to be twice as hard as singleplayer, so that after people have beaten singleplayer they have a new challenge that encourages team work.

[polygone]

What if we had both the host must be there and the penalty for players who logged off for to long.

Don't like that. If someone logs off who happens to be low health then they'll just die the next day, and people have lives/time constraints. Not everyone can log in everyday either, so people who just like to play weekends would be screwed for playing on the same server since they'd take a huge health penalty every time they log in. Klei should just leave it so people log in with the same stats as when they logged out. Also for servers, the host has to be there to start the server no matter what. Doesn't mean they have to stick around for any amount of time, they could just throw up the server and leave it for other people to play and it'll just run on it's own accord with whatever settings they had it on.

[XLuckySeven69X]

Don't like that. If someone logs off who happens to be low health then they'll just die the next day, and people have lives/time constraints. Not everyone can log in everyday either, so people who just like to play weekends would be screwed for playing on the same server since they'd take a huge health penalty every time they log in. Klei should just leave it so people log in with the same stats as when they logged out. Also for servers, the host has to be there to start the server no matter what. Doesn't mean they have to stick around for any amount of time, they could just throw up the server and leave it for other people to play and it'll just run on it's own accord with whatever settings they had it on.

 

well I didnt mean the penalty could kill them. Penalties would only be able to reduce stats to a set limit. I guess the thing I said about the host having to be logged in was just a personal prefrence and when I look at it objectivly I can see why other people wouldnt like it.

 

Another thing the reason for the penalties is that people can just logout in order to live when there isnt enough food to go around and then log back in when there is without some sort of negetive. I just dont like exploits that could make things less chalenging.

[polygone]

Anything with multiplayer will have exploits in some way or another, kinda impossible for it to not be exploitable and still fun to play normally. Especially if mods are allowed in Don't Starve Together. There's also leaving to escape Summer/Winter, plus you could leave during spring and rejoin during Winter and you'd be in deep doodoo at that point. Is problematic.

[Spazmatic]

I wonder what impact the Old Bell and sleep inducing items will have on PvP (PvP is in the DST prototype for now, source: https://twitter.com/klei/status/464118734798344192 . This only counts when MP has RoG content). There can only be one player that can learn the Old Bell recipe (one Glommer statue means only one blueprint), giving them a huge and potentially very lethal advantage over the other island survivors. Even more so with sleep darts, panflutes and mandrakes. Should all of these work on other players, aka can another player put another player to sleep? If so, how long should the sleep last? I can imagine someone "sleeplocking" another player, and summoning Bigfoot to crush their presence... And there's nothing they can do about it. Even without Bigfoot there can be plenty of ways to kill your sleepyhead of a fellow player.

[polygone]

I wonder what impact the Old Bell and sleep inducing items will have on PvP (PvP is in the DST prototype for now, source: https://twitter.com/klei/status/464118734798344192 . This only counts when MP has RoG content). There can only be one player that can learn the Old Bell recipe (one Glommer statue means only one blueprint), giving them a huge and potentially very lethal advantage over the other island survivors. Even more so with sleep darts, panflutes and mandrakes. Should all of these work on other players, aka can another player put another player to sleep? If so, how long should the sleep last? I can imagine someone "sleeplocking" another player, and summoning Bigfoot to crush their presence... And there's nothing they can do about it. Even without Bigfoot there can be plenty of ways to kill your sleepyhead of a fellow player.

I don't think sleep effects should work on players. It'd just be kinda silly, especially with panflutes. The music from that doesn't put the person who plays it to sleep, so humans (soulless automotons, weird spider creatures, beavers, mimes....) shouldn't be affected. Freezing, sure. But it shouldn't last very long at all. Also something with bigfoot is people using tents/such could easily get stepped on without time to unsleep, which is a problem.

[XLuckySeven69X]

Anything with multiplayer will have exploits in some way or another, kinda impossible for it to not be exploitable and still fun to play normally. Especially if mods are allowed in Don't Starve Together. There's also leaving to escape Summer/Winter, plus you could leave during spring and rejoin during Winter and you'd be in deep doodoo at that point. Is problematic.

 

yeah I geuss I can agree. I just dont like the idea of the game being easier in multiplayer.

 

thx for replying

[polygone]

It's bound to be harder no matter what because you'll need more food, and more wood if people split up and don't use the same campfire. +Stuff for armour/weapons.

[J20hawkz]

Agreed. There has been talk about worry over increased difficulty. There definitely needs to be increased difficulty based on number of players. It wouldn't make sense to have Don't Starve as it is based on single player gaming to work with 2-4 players.

[XxTheGentleManScientistxX]

You have already seen my post) Will there be a site for DST?  I think this would be a great idea.  What are you guys considering?  Also here is my take on multiplayer.  Players have different stats for heath, sanity, and hunger.  If a player dies they can rejoin through the shadow creature way. PVP can be toggled.  Insane players try to kill the sane.  Maxwell is still a butthole, even if he helps.  I also think that all players have to sleep in different beds. (I don't trust Maxwell and Wilson alone.)  If you are wickerbottom you get an alert saying if you want all players to sleep.  Friends can be invited. Private and Public servers.  Another question now :I, Would private servers work with a code.  Like a looong number and word code, or passwords.  For example, a search engine for worlds.  Like a world named butts. When you click on the world you would need a password.  A search engine , instead of a box with password box, would prevent 10 worlds with the password as p455w0rd.  I kinda agree with a randomly generated password, but at the same time it would be hard to remember.  

[polygone]

Not sure if I mentioned this, probably did. Here's a summary of everything that I believe DST should be: Add as many options to customize gameplay as feasably possible. Settings for world gen, pvp, anything they see fit/debatable. If the devs can't decide on two sides of something, see if there's a way to do both and have a switch somewhere. Whether it be serverside or clientside, more options=more fun for the players. People love playing their way, and allowing users to create mods for DST would be amazing, since that'd fix any problems with customization that the dev team couldn't/didn't feel like adding in. Some people like playing with god mode, some people like having a hardcore death show. So let them do either or, and everyone wins. Depending how it's set up/plays (since I do have a couple friends to play it with already), I'll probably be annoying the crap out of my friends to get the game to play with me so I can watch them die repeatedly. And probably so will quite a few people. It's one thing to tell your friends about a great single player game, but it's another to do so with a multiplayer game. Much easier to convince a friend to play something if they get to play with you as well. ;P

[J20hawkz]

You have already seen my post) Will there be a site for DST?  I think this would be a great idea.  What are you guys considering?  Also here is my take on multiplayer.  Players have different stats for heath, sanity, and hunger.  If a player dies they can rejoin through the shadow creature way. PVP can be toggled.  Insane players try to kill the sane.  Maxwell is still a butthole, even if he helps.  I also think that all players have to sleep in different beds. (I don't trust Maxwell and Wilson alone.)  If you are wickerbottom you get an alert saying if you want all players to sleep.  Friends can be invited. Private and Public servers.  Another question now :I, Would private servers work with a code.  Like a looong number and word code, or passwords.  For example, a search engine for worlds.  Like a world named butts. When you click on the world you would need a password.  A search engine , instead of a box with password box, would prevent 10 worlds with the password as p455w0rd.  I kinda agree with a randomly generated password, but at the same time it would be hard to remember.

Agreed, private servers should allow for the host to input a server name and their own password. For example.

I would create a server called J20Hawkz and have the password set to 1234, obviously you won't guess 1234 ("obviously") so no one will be able to access my world with anyone who does know the password. That's pretty much the norm with most private matchmaking servers.

[J20hawkz]

In addition to this thread http://forums.kleientertainment.com/topic/36831-planks-over-sinkholes/

Anyone else think this should be a must for DS+RoG and even more so DST? I would hate for someone to open a cave and bring up Rocklobsters to the surface without me knowing. Your world is literally ruined at that point.

[polygone]

I wasn't aware rock lobsters could get to the surface. To be fair, you could always disable sinkholes as the server owner if you don't want people going in there. And if you change your mind as an admin you could use the DebugSpawn to create a sinkhole cover. But yeah, caves have always been kinda glitchy and it'd be nice to block the baddies back down in their hole.

 

Also like one of the people on the thread suggested, it should be a trap door and not a full block. The trap door would basically keep all cave mobs inside the caves. No monkeys, rock lobsters, cave spiders, bats, none of that could get out. Of course, you could still build bunny huts on the surface to spawn bunnies, and you could carry loot back and forth. The only problem with this is whether or not Chester would be able to get in/out, along with pigmen going in would have to be barred. Anything following you should just stop following you when you enter a cave, and wait outside until you come out. If the food timer runs out for a pig while you're in there it'll run off.

 

Another way you could fix it is just have rock lobsters retreat to their caves when the sun is out, and instantly stop following you if exposed to the full sunlight. They are cave dwellers after all, they wouldn't be able to see well during the day. (same how the mole goggles disallow sight during the day)

[J20hawkz]

Or just make it so Rocklobsters don't keep spawning randomly on the surface. I think it's only triggered when you physically bring them to the surface as followers. Fair enough if you did that they can reproduce however they are intended to reproduce. But once you get rid of them on the surface more shouldn't follow.

It just ruins the game, no matter how often you try to stop their numbers. Am I right or is there really no big deal about how Rocklobsters spawn randomly on the surface and reproduce?

[Scrimbles]

I think all kinds of stun locking should be removed, because if the Deerclops gets hit by any ranged attack, it will automatically stop its attack.

 

The problem with this is that one person could just wail on the boss, while another throws a boomerang every time it starts to attack, and boom, easy boss fight

[Yanderu]

I have some suggestions.

 

I think the shadow revival thing is a good idea. Perhaps a ritual to revive players that involves going to a new biome such as the nightmare realm would be a good start. It's already hinted at in the ruins underground(the light coming from the ruins can be a way in if you look hard for it) and I think adding new biomes can be interesting and add more depth to the games story. Finding out what happened with the ancients there or perhaps gaining new items and magic powers from directly confronting the dark ones does sound interesting to me, but you also run the risk taking away some the mystery of the dark ones. I suggest being careful with that if its ever implemented. Finding Charlie there and adding her as an unlock able character sounds good for future development too; the mechanic of dying at night can still work it just wouldn't be Charlie anymore; perhaps if you save her your character gets taken as a replacement similar to when saving Maxwell. 

 

Two different ways of dying sounds interesting too. http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=261980676 This mod explores the idea of having a heavenly or a "Light/sky" biome while retaining the interesting style and personality that the game has. Definitely not suggesting to copy or do something similar. For instance, It could easily  be part of Maxwell s idea of good or light; but there should actually be an opposing force to the nightmare creatures that either Maxwell or you influences. I think its worth exploring as a way to interact with the world, progress the story and add new items, enemies and yet another biome to the game. Naughtiness is in the game already as a way to spawn Krampus and I think it can be expanded upon to influence how players die and what they become afterwards. Perhaps the ritual for revival a player has to complete(with optional help from other players) can be influenced by whether or not they were good. If they didn't have high naughtiness points they can perform a ritual in the light biome as part of a quest to get revived. If they were naughty they get re spawned as a shadow player and have to be reclaimed from the shadow biome. If a player dies while good I think simply becoming a ghost similar to Abigail is alright, they don't have to have a halo or anything. 

 

All in all I think exploring the darkness that surrounds the game and adding something opposing to it presents an opportunity to influence the world and make Don't Starve even more unique than the other sandbox games out there. Adding a few more structures and ways to get creative would help the multiplayer experience as well; probably stuff from the new biomes. I think it would help player creativity if there were more ways to customize forts and make them appear as homes. Perhaps you can allow them to use clouds and nightmare stuff. 

 

Oh and one more thing... rather than three strikes and you're out I think it should only be one death; or perhaps there should be something that determines how far gone your spirit is before its completely consumed by either side. This still makes the game challenging and death is still a big deal. For shadow beings perhaps insanity will determine this; and for ghosts(the light side of things) perhaps your health bar(maybe it can look different, white). Abigail takes damage before she is de-summoned. I think taking damage as a shadow being should make you lose sanity; therefore the threat of your character getting taken for good by the dark ones increases. Oppositely you taking damage increases your chances of ascending into the light, the only true escape. If a character fails to revive themselves after they die then i think the only way they can play again is if a player divides themselves similar to Maxwell s codex umbra, or summons them similar to Wendy s Abigail. During that time the player has a limited opportunity(and decreased stats) to revive them and puts themselves at risk. Just an Idea I'm throwing out there. Unless something about the gameplay changes I think death(and starving) should always remain a challenging and difficult part of the game(and it should be interesting too).  Additionally the new biomes should be accessible apart from death. 

 

I think that's all I have to say about it, hopefully my suggestions haven't already been discussed before. If anything I think increasing what you can do with the world and Maxwell's and Charlies positions; as well as the nightmare realm and the opposite realm would be a huge boon to the game. It adds game play and could make up for the game not being as sandboxy as its competition.  

[J20hawkz]

In terms of balancing Don't Starve Together to be "slightly" more "forgiving" than Don't Starve in regards to death, would it be fair to say Don't Starve Together needs more ways of reviving, or is what we have now more than enough? Would you like to see players able to craft their own touch stones? Blueprints can only be obtained from touchstones already used, you can only have one player made touch stone on the map at any given time, that sort of thing.

@Yanderu you've raised some awesome ideas, I like the idea of dying but respawning in a new eerie biome. I can only assume such biome will be separate to the surface world in Don't Starve yet coexist so one can find their way back from the dead.

[Yanderu]

In terms of balancing Don't Starve Together to be "slightly" more "forgiving" than Don't Starve in regards to death, would it be fair to say Don't Starve Together needs more ways of reviving, or is what we have now more than enough? Would you like to see players able to craft their own touch stones? Blueprints can only be obtained from touchstones already used, you can only have one player made touch stone on the map at any given time, that sort of thing.

@Yanderu you've raised some awesome ideas, I like the idea of dying but respawning in a new eerie biome. I can only assume such biome will be separate to the surface world in Don't Starve yet coexist so one can find their way back from the dead.

 

Yup, though I didn't quite know how my suggestions for the new biomes would work; that sounds exactly how it can be carried out. Escaping the biome can be a way to revive; then you have to find your body(or you can just come out revived). Or perhaps one can choose to free charlie and surrender your spirit to become like Charlie and free her. You could come back in a way but you'd be a different character, just like when you save Maxwell. Perhaps the sky/heaven biome would be a way to escape the game and achieve victory( but at the cost of trapping an angel or something, another character idea maybe?) I like the idea of making a blue print for touch stones too, perhaps an example recipe would be: Marble, Pigskin, Logs, Nightmare Fuel. I'd hope Klei considers adding these things to the game in the future. Additionally you could also add an option to increase gem drops(and what they drop from). Therefore allowing people to craft more life giving amulets.

 

Although death should remain a challenging part of the game I think the methods to acquire these things should remain difficult and challenging with the same amount of risk. Multi player does seem to come with the idea that more players= decreasing how unforgiving the game is, but I think Don't Starve should just make the experience so interesting and comprehensive that it still reaches a large audience anyway. Besides if one were to choose more gems in their world for instance you could easily drop a life giving amulet for a friend without feeling like it'd be too hard to get another one. I don't think adding a way to revive additionally would hurt the game; I feel like it could have more interesting ways to prevent death. As Wendy always says when you fail adventure mode: "Not all death's are the same,"

[polygone]

Instead of having a surface world biome you could just have it be a separate world like the caves. If you were naughty you go to a bad world full of things like swamps, spiders, and fire hounds. If you were good you end up in a nice happy land with slightly less than normal enemies and a bit more resources. Both worlds would be relatively small, and have a portal like the adventure portal to get back to the real world. You get as many tries as you want to get back, but you can only carry like 4 stacks back or something like using the teleportato.

[AnonTheMouse]

A 4th type of Chester would be hard to think of.

 

Magical Chester, made by filling with Living Logs. Originally, I suggested this as an option for a suggestion to give Chester magical upgrades, requiring him be upgraded to "Magical Form" to use them. Alternately, it could make a good use for multiplayer. Normal Chesters have one inventory that anyone can access. Magic Chester has a separate personal inventory for each player, which only they can access.

[Pyromailmann]

Magical Chester, made by filling with Living Logs. Originally, I suggested this as an option for a suggestion to give Chester magical upgrades, requiring him be upgraded to "Magical Form" to use them. Alternately, it could make a good use for multiplayer. Normal Chesters have one inventory that anyone can access. Magic Chester has a separate personal inventory for each player, which only they can access.

It should be called the living wood Chester if they chose that. Magical Chester would consist of purple gems. It is a good idea as well.  But I doubt Klei taking suggestions anymore. Even still I think I've got some ideas Klei can go with (all using gems).

Red Gem Chester: Can heal players (this is because you can make a life giving amulet with red gems and red represents life)

Purple Gem Chester: Basically what you just said (If someone doesn't understand think of the vanilla Ender chest in Minecraft)

Orange Gem Chester: Picks up items in a certain radius.

Yellow Gem Chester: Emits light.

Green Gem Chester: Can give crafting materials if needed.

[J20hawkz]

The other problem with Webber and his spiders is that the spider followers can attack player made walls. Is this a bug or intentional? Someone raised this in the Steam forum. If it is intentional surely in Don't Starve Together this must be changed as it would be very difficult to play co-op with Webber.

[Spazmatic]

The entire rock lobster reproducing system should be heavily altered or given the boot. It has been brought up repeatedly in the past how much of a problem rock lobsters on the surface can be... Maybe rock lobsters should be given their slurtle mound equivalent that spawns more of them, and only in the caves. Let these spawners have a max amount of active rock lobsters (also counting the ones on the surface/ruins due to the players bringing them there). No more rock lobster surface invasion

[J20hawkz]

The entire rock lobster reproducing system should be heavily altered or given the boot. It has been brought up repeatedly in the past how much of a problem rock lobsters on the surface can be... Maybe rock lobsters should be given their slurtle mound equivalent that spawns more of them, and only in the caves. Let these spawners have a max amount of active rock lobsters (also counting the ones on the surface/ruins due to the players bringing them there). No more rock lobster surface invasion

I've been reading about issues with Rocklobsters for a long time now, have the Developers never responded? I'm sure a developer mentioned something about Rocklobsters somewhere. I just can't find it.

I know there are a few clever ways to stop Rocklobsters from taking over the surface but honestly it's a hassle and not needed. I'm reluctant to ever befriend a Rocklobster incase it decides to wander to the surface. I'm even more fearful that a friend brings one up by mistake and that's it, world over.

I'm scarred for life.