Is DST a little bloated? - A post by a Don't Starve Boomer

[lowercase skye]

12 hours ago, Pumking7 said:

Wolfgang could kill a beefalo in 4 hits but you won't often do this unless you had a lot of food to spare, now he can keep a 2x damage multiplier up all the time.

Being mighty gave a speed boost, so everyone I ever saw playing Wolfgang would upkeep his hunger constantly and thus have that 2x damage multiplayer constantly active. It was constant enough that I would frequently see the advice to remember to eat 1 honey or berry every few moments during combat to make sure you kept the multiplier at its peak.

12 hours ago, Pumking7 said:

Surviving a 1,000 damage is impressive but her improved weapons and kit allow her to kill most things before she could even receive 1,000 damage.

It makes her a lot more convenient and helps in particular with horde mobs, but that's really it, convenience. Wigfrid was considered by many to be so easy of a character that it became a stereotype plaguing anyone who liked her, because she really could tank most any mob in the game without losing almost any health at all.

12 hours ago, Pumking7 said:

WX-78 "could" be the best character in the game, but without Wicker he was basically a Wilson with a bottomless pit for gears now he is completely self-reliant on his own circuits

They.

WX-78's need for a Wickerbottom was a nerf introduced in DST's life, what I'm talking about is the base states of the characters in DS. WX-78's DS state is one of a character who can obtain hands-free light for upwards of thousands of days at a time, had insanely high stats, and could heal away all 3 stats with gears in most late-game scenarios.

12 hours ago, Pumking7 said:

Its incorrect to say that DSA characters were at the same power level as their reworked/skilltree counterparts as its clear the power level increased.

Well that's not what I'm saying. Yes characters have increased in power, but it's not at the expense of some fabled "meaningful downsides" that everyone talks about, and none of them have genuinely breached the already high power levels of DS Wolfgang, WX-78 or Wigfrid.

[Ridley]

12 hours ago, Pumking7 said:

What does Wagstaff want with the moon? Power. That's literally the only point he wants to collect the lunar energy. Its not some greater story about how the moon's power corrupted him or it somehow showed him a prosperous world without shadows. Its literally only power despite in DSA Wagstaff is very keen to just start using nightmare fuel to try and bring it back to the regular world. It also feels odd that Wagstaff wants the moons power despite it barely being present in game. I mean we have about 2 items and like Crab king to show us the moon's power (pre-rift), when there are like a million pieces of shadow gear. There are absolutely no traces of the moons magic or influence on most things in the constant, so why should I or Wagstaff be so interested in trying to conceal its power. Also the questline feel so dragged out like it took us 3 years for Wagstaff to get the moon power, then the questline 3 years after consumes which barely feels imposing since Wagstaff was messing around too much. I mean this can't beat the feeling of beating fuelweaver who is strapped to the ground and cries out that we can't stop what's coming.

Wagstaff's story is quite a bit different than Charlie's, and while I like the shadow side more, the Wagstaff has some cool stuff going on that I think you are missing.

Starting with Wagstaff, he has always been fascinated at the idea of bring magic/power from the Constant to Earth. He seems to appreciate the military applications the most about these discoveries and I would argue the inventor/business man plans to sell his unrivaled weaponry. He is actively blowing through the warning signs of everything the Constant's magic in all of his schemes, potentially dooming Earth to the same fate as the Ancients. For whatever reason, he seems to believe lunar energy is better for creating a link between worlds given that he focuses his experiments on it. The Florid Postern does get upgraded into the Celestial Portal, so it isn't a baseless theory.

There is a pretty huge influence of Alter's influence in the constant, namely the reanimation of dead things. Ghosts rise from their graves, piked heads awaken, and however you want to describe what happens to pengull's and hounds. There also seems to be some sort of rebirth happening for characters who give a Moon Idol to the Celestial Portal. Now, it certainly seems that the shadows have had more of a presence on the Constant before the Lunar Islands were created. I'd say this do to the Ancient's causing a "flood" of nightmare fuel to "sweep across the land". Since the Lunar Islands and rifts formed we have gained a much better understanding of the Gestalts' power. Gestalts aren't just little friendly whispering ghosts, they are searching for a corporeal host be it creature, plant, machine, or human. Does the moon care about plants? Or are plants just unable to exert a will that expels the possession? (Or maybe Wormwood's friends are willing hosts to the gestalts afterall)

Anyway, the point is that evil Tony Stark, who never accepts his arms dealing is wrong, is risking plunging Earth into an alien invasion from the "moon". The survivors are too focused on getting home to ask whatever happens after Wagstaff perfects portal travel. I like Charlie's story, but the events seem like they will be contained to Constant and her personal drama. Wagstaff's story is tackling "can we and should we go home" dilemma the survivors face.

 

[Szczuku]

Obviously the game is bloated.

There's tons of optional content that doesn't feed into the main gameplay loop, instead it kinda just feeds into itself.

There's too much convenience to talk about "uncompromising survival game" once you get over the learning curve. And the characters have to much going on with their skill trees. Total power creep.

The vibe of the original game is gone too. Sure, there's no way that the lonely feeling of don't starve would survive the shift to the multiplayer; but there's plenty of games where you have a group of people and yet the atmosphere still feels bleak, alien and unnerving, something that dst lost. Nevermind how the singleplayer had the atmosphere of you defending yourself from the world, whereas multiplayer feels like you challenging the world. Feels like the loss of the original vision, imo, in exchange for chasing the Terraria format. All the skill tree items like swamp-making hammers or rose-tinted glasses definitelly aren't helping with beating the "this is a game where you and your friends set up a famtasy basen and beat up bad guys with magic, yeeeey" alegations

The lore is not interesting. The more gets revealed, the less it intrigues. Plus it doesn't even feel that thought-out. The current plot literally has Wagstaff study the three moontations from host of horrors only to end up making a machine. ?? How does that flow? "Oh he's studying 'the moon's power' so that he can use 'the moon's power' practically for his experiments". Yeah, sure I also study 'the arts' by drawing so that I can practice 'the arts' by playing a guitar. Nevermind just how sluggish and nothingburger-like it feels. We're over two and a half years since Maxwell's and Wilson's reworks and basically nothing of substance has happened with neither Maxwell's double agent role nor Wagstaff's gateway

[lowercase skye]

33 minutes ago, Szczuku said:

The current plot literally has Wagstaff study the three moontations from host of horrors only to end up making a machine. ?? How does that flow?

He studies what happens whenever a powerful Gestalt inhabits a mob as a physical vessel. After this, he makes his own artificial robotic vessel, and has you capture powerful Gestalts to inhabit it. What's confusing about that?

[hyoton123]

I’m glad I’m not the only cawnival hater. Get out of here Corvus.

[pandemy]

I’m a completely new player who has only started playing a few weeks ago, having only seen tidbits of Don’t Starve over the years.

I can’t contribute much to the conversation about greater character lore and if the game used to be more balanced at some point, but I definitely immediately felt there was a dissonance upon creating a new world in DST vs DS the first game.

I feel like it’s unavoidable that eventually games like DST and Minecraft become so loaded with content that when you open up the game you are greeted by dozens of things in sight and you don’t know where to begin… It might be hard to create an open world game with randomized world generation that also feels like it “progresses with the player”.

But definitely, being immediately greeted by the Crow and the friendly Trader feels a bit weird. It feels like opening a mobile game and being greeted by limited-time NPCs, so I expected them to be those things, but they’re permanent.

The same goes for the Jimbo poker minigame. I do like playing it, but it looks completely out of place in every biome, as if there was just a vending machine in the middle of a flower field.

When I first encountered the Theater set piece I also felt it looked out of place, but I’m beginning to feel that it’s the point. The Constant is supposed to feel kind of abstract and like a dream, right? You walk through biomes with odd hybrid animals, sometimes there’s architecture resembling chess, continents seem to abruptly end, and then there’s a theater and a stage with roses.

I can see the vision somewhat. I really love DST’s art direction over all. And the barrenness (compared to DST) of the first game adds to the creepiness (I could make another Minecraft comparison sorry).

The combat and bosses are my least favorite part about DST. I’m not good at it and I’m not interested in spreadsheet minmaxxing gameplay. I tried to discover as much of the game without a guide or wiki but it’s punishing to do so, because everything becomes increasingly tougher the more days pass, so the game kind of encourages you to speedrun to every next milestone. (Ah right I forgot to mention that I’m playing solo Lol)

I think the vast majority of the game is really fun and enjoyable, there is in fact a lot of replayability potential, because of all the content and all the characters’ play styles.

Also also I think the reason why DS and DST feel fundamentally different is because of the core idea. In Don’t Starve you are stranded all alone in a strange world so it feels alien and solemn. You find skeletons from previous survivors and it’s mysterious. In DST the idea is that you’re surviving with other people, so it’s inherently a less lonely experience. The Constant feels more like a type of Hunger Games than being stuck on an alien planet. Maybe this makes sense? 

[Pumking7]

10 hours ago, lowercase skye said:

They.

Sorry that's totally on me I was a bit tired when writing this. I appreciate you for letting me know and I fixed it in the original post.

10 hours ago, lowercase skye said:

WX-78's need for a Wickerbottom was a nerf introduced in DST's life, what I'm talking about is the base states of the characters in DS

I'm not talking about DSA gameplay though, I am talking about the changes made in DST from their DSA counterpart that was imported in. WX-78 in DSA is clearly the most powerful survivor with a thunderbird and gear buffet right at their fingertips. In DST that's a lot different as the materials available become different and thus they benefit the most off of Wickerbottom to become the best. I see you are relating the power level directly to how things were in DSA, but I am talking about how things were in DST to convey how they had changed.

10 hours ago, lowercase skye said:

Well that's not what I'm saying. Yes characters have increased in power, but it's not at the expense of some fabled "meaningful downsides" that everyone talks about, and none of them have genuinely breached the already high power levels of DS Wolfgang, WX-78 or Wigfrid.

I agree sorry, I am usually used to people talking about "power creep" here and I thought that was more in consideration of general abilities and not downsides. I do think some characters with more impactful downsides ie Wendy, Maxwell have definitely been ignored due to the sheer power they gained. However as I mentioned this isn't really bad as it gives the players a goal to play around the characters downside, which Wendy does the best in her skill tree. I do think the characters in DST have definitely surpassed DSA's in power, as Maxil20 makes a simple but great point in that all the characters were boring and most didn't have much going for them then, so its not surprising that DST characters feel more powerful.

9 hours ago, Ridley said:

For whatever reason, he seems to believe lunar energy is better for creating a link between worlds given that he focuses his experiments on it.

I think this is my biggest issue with the whole arc including Wagstaff. I mean shadow energy is pouring right out from fissures but he redirected to the moon which no one has tried experimenting with before. It also doesn't feel like Wagstaff to not immediately go for shadow magic as its shown he has little concern for others lives in the face of either profit/discovery.

I think this comes down to my issue with DST's interactable NPCs with dialogue being very flat. With all of the importance that Wagstaff has in the story the only thing he asks us to do is finish his quest for him. I mean Wagstaff is arguably the second most important NPC in the game but we don't know anything about his time in DST otherwise from the fact that he wants to do "lunar stuff". I think I am a bit focused on this because of the scrapped concept art of "Moonblind Wagstaff" which I thought perfectly would have demonstrated his fascination for the moon. This also includes areas like the junkyard being added, a setpiece specifically made to make Wagstaff feel more in place in DST, which haven't given us more than we already know too. 

(Side note: But I love how we have Pearl as a NPC which is supposed to be a person who grows alongside you barely have any inquisition about the world around her or the player. She has 99% of her dialogue being complaints and 1% being surface level talk about the world around her. I get she's a funny old lady but it feels frustrating that we spend so much time helping her for her not to elaborate any more on herself and her life within the constant.)

9 hours ago, Ridley said:

There is a pretty huge influence of Alter's influence in the constant, namely the reanimation of dead things. Ghosts rise from their graves, piked heads awaken, and however you want to describe what happens to pengull's and hounds. There also seems to be some sort of rebirth happening for characters who give a Moon Idol to the Celestial Portal. Now, it certainly seems that the shadows have had more of a presence on the Constant before the Lunar Islands were created. I'd say this do to the Ancient's causing a "flood" of nightmare fuel to "sweep across the land". Since the Lunar Islands and rifts formed we have gained a much better understanding of the Gestalts' power. Gestalts aren't just little friendly whispering ghosts, they are searching for a corporeal host be it creature, plant, machine, or human. Does the moon care about plants? Or are plants just unable to exert a will that expels the possession?

This is a pretty good point and I sorta neglected it because I didn't know how much was retcon (The piked heads drop nightmare fuel). I also forgot that Werepigs could be considered a form of the moon madness as they act erratic and extremely hostile like the hounds, pengulls and birds. I just think that the focus shifting from gestalts are omnipotent observers who tempt you with knowledge and those who take this power become erratic (hounds, pengulls etc), to the corpse hosting feels a bit weak. The gestalts directly possessing mobs just feels like a large shift from what we had previously, that it feel strange when the shadow side pretty consistent. I just wish we had a bit more in-depth knowledge when we had so much time spent with the shadow side from all the way back in early DSA. Even places like the archives only tell us that the moon was not interesting enough to the ancients so they just went back to the shadows for power.

9 hours ago, lowercase skye said:

He studies what happens whenever a powerful Gestalt inhabits a mob as a physical vessel. After this, he makes his own artificial robotic vessel, and has you capture powerful Gestalts to inhabit it. What's confusing about that?

I actually forgot about this and thought it was pretty clever on his part. I thought him making it a giant murder weapon demonstrates Wagstaff's apathy to the survivors who may have to fight it head on. 

The only thing I felt was forced was Alter coming down as Enlightened CC to smash Wagstaff again and give him the essence for WARBOT. I wish there was a bit more of a lead up to Celestial Champion coming back since it showing up in a new form just randomly feels so weird, as it remains the same CC for each refight. 

(I know you help Wagstaff steal the gestalts but Charlie steals the gestalts in the animated short but Alter doesn't care at that point for some reason)

Edited August 15, 2025 by Pumking7

[Frashaw27]

1 hour ago, Pumking7 said:

e redirected to the moon which no one has tried experimenting with before. It also doesn't feel like Wagstaff to not immediately go for shadow magic as its shown he has little concern for others lives in the face of either profit/discovery

I feel like you answered your own question, he pursued the lunar machinations because it hadn't been tampered with before. As seen by all of the Ruins, the height of shadow magic was pretty well sought and it caused a great calamity. You can even take a step further and say that Wagstaff as a playable character in DSA allowed him to see the shadow side for the most part. Explaining how the Nightmare Fuel would be revolutionary. This would also allow him to see the aporkalypse, the ruins, maybe even the nightmare throne at one point. The point is that it's very well possible he just knows a majority of the shadows side and hence is more interested in the moon. One of his quotes while running to the junkyard is that "progress waits for no one". He is clearly invested more into seeing what this power can do then simply taking "the easy way out".

1 hour ago, Pumking7 said:

Even places like the archives only tell us that the moon was not interesting enough to the ancients so they just went back to the shadows for power.

This might be a bit of a different interpretation, but I see it as that the ancients used to worship the moon but it wasn't going to well in terms of farming and what not. That's when they discovered nightmare fuel and perhaps in a faustian bargin, they started using it to satisfy themselves before it bit them in the ass. Again, interpretive, but it's still an alternative perspective then they just got bored of it randomly, and still decided to make an entire region to inscribe the history.

1 hour ago, Pumking7 said:

Charlie steals the gestalts in the animated short but Alter doesn't care at that point for some reason

To be fair, he was also asleep. The Axiom Visus short is seen to take place before alter was reawakened, meaning that they couldn't do much if they wanted to. It could also be said that Alter could've been extra pissed at Wagstaff as besides staring a war at the edge of the lunar grotto, they haven't really had interactions that we've aeen. Meanwhile, Wagstaff hass repeatedly been shown messing eith Alter's stuff, leading him to gain his ire.

[Hungry French]

On 14.08.2025 at 01:11, lowercase skye said:

Вольфганг мог убить буйвола за 4 удара, а Вигфрид могла выдержать удар, нанесший ей 1000 единиц урона, в своем базовом состоянии. WX-78 мог бегать с постоянным ускорением, бесконечным светом и 400 единицами здоровья. Ничего не изменилось, просто теперь способности выглядят более впечатляюще.

Yes, only some of these problems were fixed by DST. 
And then it added new ones thanks to the reworks and skill tree. 
This is reinforced by unbalanced multiplayer and solo play. 
And a lot of the new content is unbalanced or just plain weird.
Starting from the weird stuff, ending with the same bosses. Even the 2 new bosses are some kind of pseudo raid bosses. They have a lot of hp, but they just cost afk as the 1st and 2nd phases of celestial champion or Shadow Rook.

On 14.08.2025 at 01:11, lowercase skye said:

Вольфганг мог убить буйвола за 4 удара, а Вигфрид могла выдержать удар, нанесший ей 1000 единиц урона, в своем базовом состоянии. WX-78 мог бегать с постоянным ускорением, бесконечным светом и 400 единицами здоровья. Ничего не изменилось, просто теперь способности выглядят более впечатляюще.

Wolfgang, yes. He's a very wrong character in DS. Yes, and in DST moments. 
In DS, all characters could withstand a 1,000 damage hit. Only usually the armor evaporated after that.

[Pumking7]

15 hours ago, Frashaw27 said:

As seen by all of the Ruins, the height of shadow magic was pretty well sought and it caused a great calamity... The point is that it's very well possible he just knows a majority of the shadows side and hence is more interested in the moon

I mean sure the over indulgence of nightmare fuel caused a great calamity but also this wouldn't impact Wagstaff much since he really isn't part of the constant. He is the only character that can go back and forth as he pleases. As I mentioned he has very little disregard for the survivors and others as he burnt down his own factory to make a portal to the constant, will constantly unleash terrors for the survivors and just leaving (even mocking them for taking so long killing the third mutated beast), even throwing WX-78 away to the constant because he couldn't stand his feud with them. He is not even above petty crime as shown in the short where he helps people only under the guise to steal their belongings. He doesn't take the "easy way out" but he clearly is fine using what's most available to him, nightmare fuel, and seeing to what extent he could use it.

Its also hard to believe what he had seen was the extent of the power of nightmares judging by the introduction of new rift content. Also with the Forge and Gorge its very clear that the nightmares have a way to get to different dimensions, but I'm not sure how much of Forge/Gorge is retcon. Making a portal was Wagstaff's main interest in killing Celestial Champion in the first place. I'm also not sure how much of the nightmare throne Wagstaff was able to use, since its a bit murky in canon.

15 hours ago, Frashaw27 said:

This might be a bit of a different interpretation, but I see it as that the ancients used to worship the moon but it wasn't going to well in terms of farming and what not. That's when they discovered nightmare fuel and perhaps in a faustian bargin, they started using it to satisfy themselves before it bit them in the ass.

That's a fair interpretation to have. I believe the game is a bit vague in why they switched over for the most part. I also admit that my wording is a bit misleading and I meant to say that the nightmare side was more enticing than what the lunar side could offer, not that it was boring so to speak. Its just strange that a mad scientist would immediately go to the side that appeared less fruitful for the ancient society.

15 hours ago, Frashaw27 said:

To be fair, he was also asleep. The Axiom Visus short is seen to take place before alter was reawakened, meaning that they couldn't do much if they wanted to. It could also be said that Alter could've been extra pissed at Wagstaff as besides staring a war at the edge of the lunar grotto, they haven't really had interactions that we've aeen. Meanwhile, Wagstaff hass repeatedly been shown messing eith Alter's stuff, leading him to gain his ire.

Thank you for mentioning that, I misremembered that the short was before Alter woke up despite it being a teaser for eye of the storm. That would make sense in context and I appreciate you for mentioning that.

I think even with Alter's fury at Wagstaff's prying it shouldn't cause him to act out of character. Alter is opposite to the shadow side in that it wants to stay more secretive and sorta conceal its power a little bit from what we've seen. So literally giving Wagstaff a half-baked Celestial Champion right after it was very clear he could steal the first one with easy seems very out of character. Its almost as if Celestial Champion wants to give Wagstaff the energy, maybe this was its plan to kill and figured it could absorb/consume him by taking this form but that might be a stretch.

Edited August 15, 2025 by Pumking7

[GenomeSquirrel]

Bloating needs to happen just for us to have a new reason to come back, experiencing a new way to skin a cat to break the monotony

 

As for atmosphere, living in the constant as long as they have, and with the benefits of science and magic, the survivors will seek to improve their quality of life, and getting rid of dangerous, creepy things is part of that. This also goes hand in hand with defeating lunar and shadow enemies, the survivors are consistently winning this fight, the creepy sides are both losing and failing to fight back, unable to sustain the world as they'd like it.

[Hi.]

This may be off topic but it's funny how in DS we went from killing deerclops and AG to in DST where you kill literal gods.

[SpookyXy]

21 hours ago, Pumking7 said:

I mean sure the over indulgence of nightmare fuel caused a great calamity but also this wouldn't impact Wagstaff much since he really isn't part of the constant. He is the only character that can go back and forth as he pleases. As I mentioned he has very little disregard for the survivors and others as he burnt down his own factory to make a portal to the constant, will constantly unleash terrors for the survivors and just leaving (even mocking them for taking so long killing the third mutated beast), even throwing WX-78 away to the constant because he couldn't stand his feud with them. He is not even above petty crime as shown in the short where he helps people only under the guise to steal their belongings. He doesn't take the "easy way out" but he clearly is fine using what's most available to him, nightmare fuel, and seeing to what extent he could use it.

Its also hard to believe what he had seen was the extent of the power of nightmares judging by the introduction of new rift content. Also with the Forge and Gorge its very clear that the nightmares have a way to get to different dimensions, but I'm not sure how much of Forge/Gorge is retcon. Making a portal was Wagstaff's main interest in killing Celestial Champion in the first place. I'm also not sure how much of the nightmare throne Wagstaff was able to use, since its a bit murky in canon.

That's a fair interpretation to have. I believe the game is a bit vague in why they switched over for the most part. I also admit that my wording is a bit misleading and I meant to say that the nightmare side was more enticing than what the lunar side could offer, not that it was boring so to speak. Its just strange that a mad scientist would immediately go to the side that appeared less fruitful for the ancient society.

Thank you for mentioning that, I misremembered that the short was before Alter woke up despite it being a teaser for eye of the storm. That would make sense in context and I appreciate you for mentioning that.

I think even with Alter's fury at Wagstaff's prying it shouldn't cause him to act out of character. Alter is opposite to the shadow side in that it wants to stay more secretive and sorta conceal its power a little bit from what we've seen. So literally giving Wagstaff a half-baked Celestial Champion right after it was very clear he could steal the first one with easy seems very out of character. Its almost as if Celestial Champion wants to give Wagstaff the energy, maybe this was its plan to kill and figured it could absorb/consume him by taking this form but that might be a stretch.

I interpreted Wagstaff going for Lunar power as a direct result of how much more prominent the shadow side is. Everyone knows Charlie is the Shadow queen, her creations are everywhere and she'll even try to kill you herself anytime you spend even a second in the dark. We also know the Shadows have ways to travel between dimensions. From Wagstaff's perspective, he wouldn't be able to get anywhere with shadow magic without Charlie butting in and taking control.

The Lunar side by comparison appears more mindless and raw for the taking. We know Altar exists but they haven't done much besides be an eye in the sky and the gestalts largely operate independently and without much direction. Wagstaff chose to tame a wild animal versus bargain with an intelligent individual who could doublecross him, his mistake was underestimating the moon's intelligence.

Thinking about it some more, Wagstaff was probably trying to replicate Charlie's position as a human with mastery over the shadows with himself and the moon, but on his own terms and without having to give up his autonomy.

Edited August 16, 2025 by SpookyXy

[Uedo]

11 hours ago, GenomeSquirrel said:

Bloating needs to happen just for us to have a new reason to come back, experiencing a new way to skin a cat to break the monotony

That wouldn't be bloat, that's functional content, we all want that.

[Bumber64]

On 8/15/2025 at 2:06 PM, Pumking7 said:

I mean sure the over indulgence of nightmare fuel caused a great calamity but also this wouldn't impact Wagstaff much since he really isn't part of the constant. He is the only character that can go back and forth as he pleases.

Given his intent to bring the technology back to Earth for profit, it definitely would impact him.

On 8/15/2025 at 2:06 PM, Pumking7 said:

As I mentioned he has very little disregard for the survivors and others as he burnt down his own factory to make a portal to the constant, will constantly unleash terrors for the survivors and just leaving (even mocking them for taking so long killing the third mutated beast), even throwing WX-78 away to the constant because he couldn't stand his feud with them.

The thing with WX was more than a personal feud. WX was trying to build more robots, and has a frequently-stated goal to conquer fleshlings. I'm going to have to actually side with Wagstaff on exiling WX to the Constant.

[Hungry French]

On 14.08.2025 at 19:41, Uedo said:

Вы говорите не о том, о чём говорят другие, а о конкретных действиях. Люди обсуждают художественную подачу, атмосферу и тон, а не зомби или преступления.

Вы обратили внимание, отличный пост, это затрагивает практически всю мою проблему с сюжетом. Такое ощущение, что следующий сюжет решается на каждом еженедельном собрании команды Klei.

«У кого-нибудь есть идеи для следующего патча, ребята? »

Any Klei conference :

Guys, in the next update, let's add unnecessary, meaningless items that will only be used by madmen eating monster lasagna. 
Or let's add another one with multiple boss phases, because our game is not about survival, but about killing bosses.  And we will make sure that he is unbearable in solo, and in the team he dies exactly in the time his music lasts (45 seconds). 
And let's also add a cool, cool Skill Tree so that the character can do anything-you can come up with anything and it doesn't fit in any way with the existing content.  And definitely! Absolutely! Let's add an item that exactly copies an existing item.
And one more thing. Let's add the Stuffed Night Cap, it will be a very cool alternative item for sleep darts - it will give players an early sleep item because panflute is so difficult to get and it is very weak against single enemies.

About the plot... There are huge questions about what is long forgotten or recanonized in the plot... But it is generally in good condition.
Unlike the gameplay which...Who asks a lot of questions to the developers. And sometimes you really want to see how developers use some things. At least the ones that you added yourself.

So the plot is not bad. Although there are no details in it either. How the survivors kill the giants... We have a VERY silly moment with Wortox and Deerclops, where the latter was killed with a single blow... I can imagine who the survivors killed the Warbot for...
or the latest trailer... The horrors of having to eat monster meat, wings, and... eyes?
At this time, there are 3 ice cubes and 1 meat in the game and you get GORGEOUS meatballs. 
Or the canonical winter event, where the survivors have a huge table of masterpiece food. 
It creates... Desonance... Are they survivors, or are they just relaxing and having fun while simultaneously killing giants with 1 hit.

[Uedo]

3 hours ago, Hungry French said:

Any Klei conference :

Guys, in the next update, let's add unnecessary, meaningless items that will only be used by madmen eating monster lasagna. 
Or let's add another one with multiple boss phases, because our game is not about survival, but about killing bosses.  And we will make sure that he is unbearable in solo, and in the team he dies exactly in the time his music lasts (45 seconds). 
And let's also add a cool, cool Skill Tree so that the character can do anything-you can come up with anything and it doesn't fit in any way with the existing content.  And definitely! Absolutely! Let's add an item that exactly copies an existing item.
And one more thing. Let's add the Stuffed Night Cap, it will be a very cool alternative item for sleep darts - it will give players an early sleep item because panflute is so difficult to get and it is very weak against single enemies.

About the plot... There are huge questions about what is long forgotten or recanonized in the plot... But it is generally in good condition.
Unlike the gameplay which...Who asks a lot of questions to the developers. And sometimes you really want to see how developers use some things. At least the ones that you added yourself.

So the plot is not bad. Although there are no details in it either. How the survivors kill the giants... We have a VERY silly moment with Wortox and Deerclops, where the latter was killed with a single blow... I can imagine who the survivors killed the Warbot for...
or the latest trailer... The horrors of having to eat monster meat, wings, and... eyes?
At this time, there are 3 ice cubes and 1 meat in the game and you get GORGEOUS meatballs. 
Or the canonical winter event, where the survivors have a huge table of masterpiece food. 
It creates... Desonance... Are they survivors, or are they just relaxing and having fun while simultaneously killing giants with 1 hit.

In all fairness - A lot of stuff you mentioned has to be game-ified to some degree, we can't have complete realism all of a sudden. My issues with the plot are not how it's going to go or has gone, it's that it was never as deep as they pretend it was.

As for the game decisions, they're not bad - they're often just lazy or derivative. I've played an insane amount of Klei developed games, apart from some gems which are never touched again (Talking about you Griftlands), it's as if they're templated in Lua or something. I don't know what it is, but there's like a pattern. Mind over Magic really showed it, it was too like ONI - there's something too templateable about everything they've done for years and I can't put my finger on it.

[Jakepeng99]

15 hours ago, Uedo said:

In all fairness - A lot of stuff you mentioned has to be game-ified to some degree, we can't have complete realism all of a sudden. My issues with the plot are not how it's going to go or has gone, it's that it was never as deep as they pretend it was.

As for the game decisions, they're not bad - they're often just lazy or derivative. I've played an insane amount of Klei developed games, apart from some gems which are never touched again (Talking about you Griftlands), it's as if they're templated in Lua or something. I don't know what it is, but there's like a pattern. Mind over Magic really showed it, it was too like ONI - there's something too templateable about everything they've done for years and I can't put my finger on it.

Klei didn’t make mind over magic they just published it. 

[hyoton123]

I think it could use a little more bloat, honestly.

[Uedo]

1 hour ago, Jakepeng99 said:

Klei didn’t make mind over magic they just published it. 

I'm not digging up history, but as this pertains to publishing duties and contracts i'm not going to speculate, what I will highlight though - Klei have assisted in development of published games without being listed as developers.

TLDR: Sparkypants may be listed as the dev, however I'd wager Klei were involved due to the setup of the game infrastructure internally. Looking into the situation with ES:L, i'm even more confident in this.

Edited August 19, 2025 by Uedo

[Tigris Nano]

On 8/13/2025 at 7:44 AM, Hungry French said:

What were Deerclops, Old Ancient Guardian, Old Dragon Fly. Dangerous and dynamic bosses that give very small windows to attack.

Deerclops is same in dst but with more hp and second rift exclusive phase. Old ag is just bigger rook with more hp that gets stuck between pillar and campfire. Old dragonfly is dragonfly which can be facetanked with football helms + pierogies or can get stuck between 2 boulders. Very dangerous lol

[Hungry French]

1 hour ago, Tigris Nano said:

Deerclops is same in dst but with more hp and second rift exclusive phase. Old ag is just bigger rook with more hp that gets stuck between pillar and campfire. Old dragonfly is dragonfly which can be facetanked with football helms + pierogies or can get stuck between 2 boulders. Very dangerous lol

DS Deerclops -

1.It has an attack period of 3, not 4.

2.Its attack range is only 6, not 8, but it has higher sides and also behind its back. 

3.DST also weakened all the auras of sanity. In DS, you got -400 sanity on the player's attack range and a little further. In the DST, the cyclops has -70 on the player's attack range, and only -400 on the back.

DS Ancient Guardian  -

1.Always attacked the player without delay and it was possible to deal 1 hit between attacks, now you can attack up to 15 attacks between his rams.

2.Getting stuck between pillar and campfire is bug exploiting .

3.Well, tanking tactics also became much more profitable after rework.

DS Dragon Fly - 

1.It's impossible to escape her rage.

2.You also can't dodge it without bonus speed.

3.You can't tank her. I've tried with marble armor and with bat bat. And I can't overpower her damage. You're confusing something.

4. She has sanity aura.

5. 2 boulders is bug exploiting. The same as lavae walls.

Edited August 20, 2025 by Hungry French

[Maxil20]

1 hour ago, Hungry French said:

DST also weakened all the auras of sanity. In DS, you got -400 sanity on the player's attack range and a little further. In the DST, the cyclops has -70 on the player's attack range, and only -400 on the back.

This is false. DS also has diminishing sanity auras the further you are away from a mob, and deerclops is no exception. As long as you are not practically hugging deerclops when you are attacking it, you will experience a significantly lower sanity drain than 400 per minute.

1 hour ago, Hungry French said:

3.You can't tank her. I've tried with marble armor and with bat bat. And I can't overpower her damage. You're confusing something.

You can totally tank dragonfly, but it’s a bit lesser known. The main thing that kills people is the fire damage, though just like with deerclops and the sanity aura, you can sidestep the boss a bit to avoid taking damage from the fire aura. Other than that, just bring a few expendable pieces of armor and you should be good.

Here’s me fighting it with the standard log suit + football helm + ham bat. I forgot to heal, so I didn’t even have full health, and still won!

 

Edited August 20, 2025 by Maxil20

[Hungry French]

5 minutes ago, Maxil20 said:

Это неправда. Чем дальше вы находитесь от моба, тем слабее аура здравомыслия в DS, и оленьи копыта не исключение. Если вы не стоите практически вплотную к оленьим копытам во время атаки, то потеря здравомыслия будет значительно меньше 400 единиц в минуту..

It's strange, but I remember that I had much more sanity problems with Deerclops in DS than in DST... I'll check it out later...

13 minutes ago, Maxil20 said:

Вот я сражаюсь в стандартном костюме из брёвен + футбольном шлеме + с ветчиной в качестве биты. Я забыл подлечиться, так что у меня даже не было полного здоровья, но я всё равно победил!

 

Hmm. How powerful must the fire aura be if even Bat Bat couldn't handle it...

Well... I usually only use 1 set of armor against bosses. Because having an entire inventory of armor... I don't like the idea of tanking bosses and even creatures... Which is why I'm considering playing with a mod that reduces defense for no rift armor.

[Maxil20]

9 minutes ago, Hungry French said:

It's strange, but I remember that I had much more sanity problems with Deerclops in DS than in DST... I'll check it out later...

The sidestep to distance yourself is a simple but extremely important thing that drastically reduces the impact of the aura. It's something a lot of people do miss out on when tanking despite the impact it has, so it's a fair mistake.

I just did a test where I was attacking deerclops as close as I could and another where I attacked deerclops as far as I could (Same gear with DFly, just a log suit/football helm/hambat, and remembering to properly mend my stats between the tests)
"Far"



Close



Even with moving just a quarter of a turf tile or so, it saved me over 5 times the sanity I would have used if I hadn't moved, with identical health/armor loss on both. This is why moving an ever so slight amount of distance before tanking a mob is extremely important.