Saying "nerf" is becoming a tabú

[Antynomity]

2 hours ago, Primalflower said:

like, we're literally... just now... getting 3 moon bosses, too!!! moon lord was not added until hard mode existed for 4 years my guys work with me

The ocean took 4 years to turn from a pile of empty crap to a slightly bigger and spread out pile of crap

[Sacco]

39 minutes ago, Scrimbles said:

"Please god no" to what? The option to get the old character types back?

i'd say, keep the characters as we have now, but nerf them a bit.

Old woodie was just redundant, and skills made him good, not OP imo, maxwell is just better at fighting and chopping than the new werebeaver/moose, wolfgang still deals more damage than the weremoose and chops trees so fast with his skills.

the new weremoose is a bit overrated imo, he deals like +15% dps than a wilson with a dark sword if he doesn't miss a single combo attack and cant' interact with anything from the environment and inventory.

Wortox was just and i think he is still a boring charcater.

He only relies on souls for everything, you play the game like wilson but when an enemy dies drops souls, a bit too boring no?

Old maxwell was just a gatherer, and a magician shouldn't summon copy of himself to gather resources, now he is a proper wizard with spells too!

Now his duelists are way way cooler than before, i have a lot of fun fighting as maxwell.

I think max is the only character that needs to be better than the others, he was the king of the constant afterall...

 

[Jakepeng99]

3 hours ago, SapoLover said:

. I remember that time when someone suggested to nerf Wicker's lunar book, and Klei actually did it

What was the nerf?

[Sacco]

14 minutes ago, Jakepeng99 said:

What was the nerf?

to the crafting recipe.

it used to cost 2 moon rocks and 2 papyrus.

[Jakepeng99]

1 minute ago, Sacco said:

to the crafting recipe.

it used to cost 2 moon rocks and 2 papyrus.

New crafting recipe is pretty dumb and flawed so i disagree with that change. I have so much people steal from the archives and never replace the gem. 

[Sacco]

1 hour ago, Jakepeng99 said:

New crafting recipe is pretty dumb and flawed so i disagree with that change. I have so much people steal from the archives and never replace the gem. 

that book is pretty dang broken.

in my opinion that thing could just cost a single enlightned shard for how powerful that thing is.

[Gashzer]

2 hours ago, Sacco said:

Wortox was just and i think he is still a boring charcater.

Wortox gets a really bad rep. On console hes rubbish 100%. On pc however soul hopping to kite attacks, being able to jump in and around klaus' magic spells or fuelweaver or close the distance to phase 3 CC/beequeen and hop rings around nightmare werepig/ancient guardian. His soul hop gives a whole new dynamic to combat that no other character has making Wortox one of the most fun and unique characters in a gameplay sense. Wandas stepback watch is nowhere near as enjoyable, precise or flexible in combat.

Hes S-tier no question. Cheap healing, cheap long distance transport, starts off at full strength on day1, half sanity loss to bosses means he has effectively 300 sanity for boss fights the most of any character in the game except a skilled Walter or a crazy Wx.

[Sacco]

12 minutes ago, Gashzer said:

Wortox gets a really bad rep. On console hes rubbish 100%. On pc however soul hopping to kite attacks, being able to jump in and around klaus' magic spells or fuelweaver or close the distance to phase 3 CC/beequeen and hop rings around nightmare werepig/ancient guardian. His soul hop gives a whole new dynamic to combat that no other character has making Wortox one of the most fun and unique characters in a gameplay sense. Wandas stepback watch is nowhere near as enjoyable, precise or flexible in combat.

Hes S-tier no question. Cheap healing, cheap long distance transport, starts off at full strength on day1, half sanity loss to bosses means he has effectively 300 sanity for boss fights the most of any character in the game except a skilled Walter or a crazy Wx.

yes i totally agree with that, but this thing doesn't make a character interesting to play imo.

It's just about souls, nothing else, that's why i don't find his gameplay interesting

EDIT: how does wortox work on console?

[Gashzer]

59 minutes ago, Sacco said:

yes i totally agree with that, but this thing doesn't make a character interesting to play imo.

It's just about souls, nothing else, that's why i don't find his gameplay interesting

EDIT: how does wortox work on console?

Well his gameplay requires no grinding of character unique craftables which is a breath of fresh air. Meaning you can focus on world content from day 1. I like this alot. And precise soul hopping around is so damn fun and useful.

Ah wortox on console is a shadow of his true self. You have a fixed teleport range of like 2-3 tiles infront of you. Which means no cool soul hop kiting, no precise teleporting at all. The dumb thing is Klei gave maxwell the ability to aim his spells with the right stick but wortox still cant aim his teleport. 

 

[grm9]

2 hours ago, Gashzer said:

On pc however soul hopping to kite attacks, being able to jump in and around klaus' magic spells or fuelweaver or close the distance to phase 3 CC/beequeen and hop rings around nightmare werepig/ancient guardian.

Which is entirely outclassed by just walking. The extra hit (if it's even there in most scenarios) that you dealt by i-framing with a soul hop still doesn't compensate the amount of time you spent preparing souls. Teleporting before klaus casts a spell is less effective than just healing the damage you got from freezing/overheating for a few seconds when normally walking out of the spells, or you could just get out of the spells' range so they don't spawn when the casting animation finishes and you don't take damage nor spend souls. It's only useful against FW, maybe BQ too, haven't tried.

2 hours ago, Gashzer said:

Hes S-tier no question. Cheap healing, cheap long distance transport, starts off at full strength on day1, half sanity loss to bosses means he has effectively 300 sanity for boss fights the most of any character in the game except a skilled Walter or a crazy Wx.

He also wastes a lot of time because if you're eating souls, you'll be fighting nightmares constantly, sometimes even if wearing shanter, usually getting more nightmare fuel than you'll ever end up using and you can't store more than 20 souls, meaning you can't just get a full bundling wrap of whatever healing food other characters would want to use, but instead need to constantly go and replenish the souls when you run out.

[Guille6785]

5 hours ago, Gashzer said:

half sanity loss to bosses means he has effectively 300 sanity for boss fights the most of any character in the game except a skilled Walter or a crazy Wx.

^the half sanity loss perk exists to make up for the fact that he gets half as much sanity from food, otherwise he would need to bring twice as much sanity food to fights which would make him complete dogpoop

[Jakepeng99]

6 minutes ago, Guille6785 said:

^the half sanity loss perk exists to make up for the fact that he gets half as much sanity from food, otherwise he would need to bring twice as much sanity food to fights which would make him complete dogpoop

Yeah, i see many forget about this very important upside.

[chirsg]

9 hours ago, Scrimbles said:

"Please god no" to what? The option to get the old character types back?

You know, if there were a way to have this option, I swear, I would be on board 100%. 

[lowercase skye]

14 hours ago, Antynomity said:

The ocean in DST after 4 years of development compared to Shipwrecked a few years after development (idk how many):

Shipwrecked is famously full of cut corners and reskinned content, due to an entirely different dev team with much lower quality standards than Klei (to the point that the universal community opinion before RoT was majorly negative towards SW!). If you look at them in just the number of things they add, one will look more full than the other, but SW's numbers are padded out by reskins of existing RoG mobs/content, while RoT is entirely 100% original aside from like, Wobsters I guess? And is overall way higher quality than SW's mobs such as "Pigman, but has 1 new attack", "Rabbits, but underwater", "Rabbits, but they hide in the sand", or "Splumonkeys, but above ground."

Also it took 2 extra years after release for a moderately-sized content update (Home Sea Home) to actually round SW's ocean out with most content we take for granted now, so, that should be considered too.

[Primalflower]

14 hours ago, Antynomity said:

The ocean in DST after 4 years of development compared to Shipwrecked a few years after development (idk how many):

The ocean took 4 years to turn from a pile of empty crap to a slightly bigger and spread out pile of crap

Even disregarding the idea that you might be wrong about dst's ocean being bad, this thought does nothing at all to dissuade the comparison being made. It's just, an entirely different point that you're trying to make completely away from what we were talking about. Hardmode and DST have incredibly similar mechanics behind them in how they start, and are only getting more similar in their structure (literally, like, actively, I can only make this argument because of the most recent update) by the day. You not enjoying one or the other does not make or break this.

the ocean in shipwrecked and the ocean in dst are two very different bouts of content that I have spent 4-5 years repeatedly describing how different they are from one another. If you want my two cents on how much I enjoy the DST ocean and how genuinely amazing of a gameplay experience it turned out to be, refer to this.

 

[Mike23Ua]

13 hours ago, Gashzer said:

Wortox gets a really bad rep. On console hes rubbish 100%. On pc however soul hopping to kite attacks, being able to jump in and around klaus' magic spells or fuelweaver or close the distance to phase 3 CC/beequeen and hop rings around nightmare werepig/ancient guardian. His soul hop gives a whole new dynamic to combat that no other character has making Wortox one of the most fun and unique characters in a gameplay sense. Wandas stepback watch is nowhere near as enjoyable, precise or flexible in combat.

Hes S-tier no question. Cheap healing, cheap long distance transport, starts off at full strength on day1, half sanity loss to bosses means he has effectively 300 sanity for boss fights the most of any character in the game except a skilled Walter or a crazy Wx.

And this post right here is EXACTLY why Klei could never realistically add cross-platform play to DST. The difference in gameplay is like playing two different games…

[Frosty_Mentos]

Most nerfs I want is dynamic food farming and the plantables not overtake scavenging or crop farming as a whole. Pig houses are a part of that issue despite pigskin being sought after by everyone and the meat sustaining you for many days. Game really needs some sort of food rebalancing, for another thing I still am gonna ask for food that is meant to last long would actually last much longer like jerky or jam.

The new weapons and gear are OP at the moment cause there's little to balance around. They're still developing the new creatures and mechanics and hope there would be some nerfs as well as buffs.

[Jakepeng99]

10 hours ago, finn from human said:

but SW's numbers are padded out by reskins of existing RoG mobs/content,

I thought that was one of the best things about shipwrecked. Seeing a mob you know, but adapted to shipwrecked.

[Spino43]

Just now, Jakepeng99 said:

I thought that was one of the best things about shipwrecked. Seeing a mob you know, but adapted to shipwrecked.

Yeah, and they are different enough, for me. With wild boars having unique aggro conditions and fighting style. Or monkies can greatly benefit wilbur mains and not turn into a train of despair. And I believe the amount of sw exclusive mobs are wayyy more than reskinned ones.

[Antynomity]

11 hours ago, finn from human said:

Shipwrecked is famously full of cut corners and reskinned content, due to an entirely different dev team with much lower quality standards than Klei (to the point that the universal community opinion before RoT was majorly negative towards SW!). If you look at them in just the number of things they add, one will look more full than the other, but SW's numbers are padded out by reskins of existing RoG mobs/content, while RoT is entirely 100% original aside from like, Wobsters I guess? And is overall way higher quality than SW's mobs such as "Pigman, but has 1 new attack", "Rabbits, but underwater", "Rabbits, but they hide in the sand", or "Splumonkeys, but above ground."

Also it took 2 extra years after release for a moderately-sized content update (Home Sea Home) to actually round SW's ocean out with most content we take for granted now, so, that should be considered too.

you act as if content needs to be unique to be good, look at moon quay aside from the unique loot it's a horrible experience, the curse punishes you for defending yourself, the pirate raids are an awful experience, you just hold F, and there are so many 'cut corners' in that update that it's crazy to me, only 10 items in the stash before everything else starts getting deleted? well **** your items I guess! the way their boats despawn is also awful, I remember having to roll back on a world I don't usually roll back on because I was about to die, so I abandoned ship right next to the pirate ship, and the way it despawns it also despawned MY ENTIRE BOAT AND EVERYTHING ON IT.

Okay, Moon Quay sucks most people know that here, time to become the devil himself and say that Waterlogged was also not a good update, so, what did it add? a cool new small setpiece "biome" which takes up less than 1% of the map, it added figs, sweetish fish, grass gators and giant trees, half of those features are redundant due to bad balancing (figs are bad despite them growing year round) and sweetish fish, well its ocean fishing so its a waste of time either way, its cool for ambiance but that's about it, at least the update made fireflies more renewable, probably the best addition in it ngl.

Now obviously you're right, there's a lot of cut corners in SW but even then, it just feels good to play? It doesn't feel so sluggish like DST sailing does, the islands are well, actual islands instead of mostly tiny land masses which the 2/3 unique islands in DST are, just a small secluded area of nothingness and one point of interest (lunar island is too but there's a lot more on the table than Pearl or the Unnatural Portal) even though most shipwrecked islands are the same thing, it just feels so good from the sailing not being super slow, to the worldgen not forcing you to circle an entire huge landmass to get from one side of the world to another (and even then you dont have to because the fog exists) to the atmosphere just being a lot more great feeling? It was a huge contrast in atmosphere specifically compared to DS/RoG.

[Antynomity]

11 hours ago, Primalflower said:

snip

I'm happy you enjoy the ocean as it is, I myself don't even though I wish I could.

[Valase]

23 hours ago, finn from human said:

Shipwrecked is famously full of cut corners and reskinned content, due to an entirely different dev team with much lower quality standards than Klei (to the point that the universal community opinion before RoT was majorly negative towards SW!). If you look at them in just the number of things they add, one will look more full than the other, but SW's numbers are padded out by reskins of existing RoG mobs/content, while RoT is entirely 100% original aside from like, Wobsters I guess? And is overall way higher quality than SW's mobs such as "Pigman, but has 1 new attack", "Rabbits, but underwater", "Rabbits, but they hide in the sand", or "Splumonkeys, but above ground."

Also it took 2 extra years after release for a moderately-sized content update (Home Sea Home) to actually round SW's ocean out with most content we take for granted now, so, that should be considered too.

I always thought that SW was the loved child of the DLC's

12 hours ago, Antynomity said:

only 10 items in the stash before everything else starts getting deleted? well **** your items I guess! the way their boats despawn is also awful, I remember having to roll back on a world I don't usually roll back on because I was about to die, so I abandoned ship right next to the pirate ship, and the way it despawns it also despawned MY ENTIRE BOAT AND EVERYTHING ON IT.

Acthchually, this limit was added after the update went live, so something happened between they releasing monke into DST and them cursing us with not being able to use them for quick item transport (I used to clear the Island and let the mokeys take everything, so I'd just dig the treasure to get every item back).

[Spino43]

4 hours ago, Valase said:

Acthchually, this limit was added after the update went live, so something happened between they releasing monke into DST and them cursing us with not being able to use them for quick item transport (I used to clear the Island and let the mokeys take everything, so I'd just dig the treasure to get every item back).

Klei claimed that with the stash storing infinite items it caused the game to lag like hell, so they chose to fix it this way.

A horrible way to fix it though.

[Valase]

12 minutes ago, Spino43 said:

Klei claimed that with the stash storing infinite items it caused the game to lag like hell, so they chose to fix it this way.

A horrible way to fix it though.

Two thing that I wish that happened for the monkeys : The first pirate stash always generating on the monkey Island, and every time a stash is full, a new one generates.

[Antynomity]

On 10/30/2023 at 9:14 PM, Valase said:

Acthchually, this limit was added after the update went live, so something happened between they releasing monke into DST and them cursing us with not being able to use them for quick item transport (I used to clear the Island and let the mokeys take everything, so I'd just dig the treasure to get every item back).

Pretty sure this is a joke, however I don't see how a bad change made to an update after it's release somehow justfies the update not being great in the first place.