Klei do not change the celestial portal until you fix pathfinding bugs, thanks!

[Guille6785]

On 7/21/2023 at 10:03 AM, Gashzer said:

However my issue is, the same people who complain about the celestial portal breaking the game, probably use the straight line wall cheese for dfly or statues/fossils for blocking mobs for farming or to cheese the moon stone event. They might even think voidwalking is ok too. Lureplant to block bosses etc...

in my experience the only people who want the celestial portal nerfed are the same people who refuse to ever tame a beefalo and never cheese bosses because it's OP

[Mysterious box]

16 hours ago, Capybara007 said:

The person i replied to with this said that removing pathfind would shake things up which is a thought made purely because they dont like pathfinding exploits and not because they want the game to have new strategies

Removing pathfinding will make the game worse because there will be less strategies, accept it or not

Its like when klei removed the wendy boat bee queen cheese it added nothing, it just removed a strategy

Tbf this strategy didn't really add anything to the game either it didn't make the fight better it just removed thinking so you could hold F. It made the fight easier sure I won't deny that but that's about it. To be more clear if your saying the bee queen fight needs another look or a bit of a rework I agree but if your saying the bee queen cheese was creative then I heavily disagree.

16 hours ago, Capybara007 said:

You are comparing all of pathfinding tech into one of the worst bosses klei has put in dst, im all for a dfly rework if it means larvae will destroy walls or jump them or whatever

There's nothing wrong with how dragonfly works it's just that building the walls is the stale meta much like how there's nothing wrong with how bearger's boss fight works but people only ever use him to chop down trees and it does highlight my issue with exploits as well. I've often talked to people about dragonfly and why they use walls and it always comes down to either them doing it because that's what everyone else does (meta) or because they didn't know it was possible without walls since everyone does it that way most people don't even know you can freeze the larva or that methods like Bernie drawing them all in or Wigfrid pulling their aggro exists. My issue with a.i. exploits is that it usually serves to limit creativity or creative use of abilities in team settings rather than encourage them with the end goal not being creative but to cheapen the experience for maximum rewards.

[Capybara007]

Using specific items or characters is not a good boss design though, you are right that most newbies streamers i see use the wall method, interestingly enough the ones that dont use it get frustrated at dying to larvae and getting all of their inventory burned because using ice staff is really unintuitive

Reworked dfly > walls dfly

But until that happens the wall method stays because its the most efficient, and efficiency is fun, a lot of people have trouble accepting that

[chirsg]

5 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

but people only ever use him to chop down trees and it does highlight my issue with exploits as well

No. I disagree. I strongly disagree. It's not an exploit. He's my pet. He chops down trees and I feed him crockpot food. It's not exploitative. It's quid pro quo.

I swear, wall path finding criticizing, bearger criticizing, even genuine ideas considered by developers getting attacked, the forums, man!

 

I'll  say this. I like the game.

I do like the game.

I might be the person on the forums that will get banned before any of my detractors, but I'd be a liar if I said I didn't like the game.

 

It's a passion for me, but man oh man, I truly do believe a lot of funny suggestions made by people are from those who HATE the game.

 

 

[Mysterious box]

9 minutes ago, chirsg said:

No. I disagree. I strongly disagree. It's not an exploit. He's my pet. He chops down trees and I feed him crockpot food. It's not exploitative. It's quid pro quo.

I swear, wall path finding criticizing, bearger criticizing, even genuine ideas considered by developers getting attacked, the forums, man!

 

I'll  say this. I like the game.

I do like the game.

I might be the person on the forums that will get banned before any of my detractors, but I'd be a liar if I said I didn't like the game.

 

It's a passion for me, but man oh man, I truly do believe a lot of funny suggestions made by people are from those who HATE the game.

 

 

I wasn't trying to say that specifically was a exploit I was comparing it to the dfly wall cheese where that's become the way people do it because that's what they're used to.

[Gashzer]

[Mysterious box]

5 hours ago, Capybara007 said:

Using specific items or characters is not a good boss design though, you are right that most newbies streamers i see use the wall method, interestingly enough the ones that dont use it get frustrated at dying to larvae and getting all of their inventory burned because using ice staff is really unintuitive

Reworked dfly > walls dfly

But until that happens the wall method stays because its the most efficient, and efficiency is fun, a lot of people have trouble accepting that

Ice staffs aren't character specific and newbies struggle against all bosses shall we nerf them all including deerclopes who seems to be the most common newbie complaint? If not what makes dragonfly so special? Your loot burning? What about bearger raiding those newbies' homes for their food?

 

5 hours ago, Capybara007 said:

interestingly enough the ones that dont use it get frustrated at dying to larvae and getting all of their inventory burned because using ice staff is really unintuitive

Gonna assume they were playing solo as well?

5 hours ago, Capybara007 said:

But until that happens the wall method stays because its the most efficient, and efficiency is fun, a lot of people have trouble accepting that

Because it's not a universal truth in fact not too many people like playing games as efficiently as possible I've learned that the hard way many times in the past but it's also true that people equally have a hard time breaking from tradition because noone wants to be "wrong" or do things the "wrong way".

[Capybara007]

Nobody has some chip on their brain tells them that any way that isnt dfly with walls is wrong, people just like to do it because its cheap and they dont have to bother with ice staves, which are boring

And by struggle with bosses i meant having 0 idea on how to beat them without watching a gazillion guides on youtube, bosses like beequeen, dfly, toadstool or crab king are the types of bosses that newbies dont understand what they have to do and get frustrated, unlike good bosses like deerclops, ancient guardian and celestial champion where what you must do is very clear

[Well-met]

23 minutes ago, Capybara007 said:

Nobody has some chip on their brain tells them that any way that isnt dfly with walls is wrong, people just like to do it because its cheap and they dont have to bother with ice staves, which are boring

And by struggle with bosses i meant having 0 idea on how to beat them without watching a gazillion guides on youtube, bosses like beequeen, dfly, toadstool or crab king are the types of bosses that newbies dont understand what they have to do and get frustrated, unlike good bosses like deerclops, ancient guardian and celestial champion where what you must do is very clear

use hp scaling mods or cope with the fact that half the bosses are designed for multiplayer

[Capybara007]

1 minute ago, Well-met said:

use hp scaling mods or cope with the fact that half the bosses are designed for multiplayer

How about you cope with the fact that pathfinding exploits are here to stay 

[Mysterious box]

2 hours ago, Capybara007 said:

And by struggle with bosses i meant having 0 idea on how to beat them without watching a gazillion guides on youtube, bosses like beequeen, dfly, toadstool or crab king are the types of bosses that newbies dont understand what they have to do and get frustrated, unlike good bosses like deerclops, ancient guardian and celestial champion where what you must do is very clear

But that's the thing newbies struggle with how to fight tree guards and deerclopes without guides as well it's not exclusive to the bosses you listed heck newbies don't even know toadstool or crab king exist. Your speaking from the perspective of a experienced player there's no noob whose facing ancient guardian or the celestial champion.

2 hours ago, Capybara007 said:

Nobody has some chip on their brain tells them that any way that isnt dfly with walls is wrong, people just like to do it because its cheap and they dont have to bother with ice staves, which are boring

Then maybe you haven't played with enough less experienced players because when it comes to groups attempting it people tend to shut down the very idea of not using walls not because it's boring but because it's easier despite often saying they don't feel like setting up the walls. What's often said is they'll help but they don't want to gather the materials or setup the walls themselves the method isn't fun it's just the most commonly known method. Fun isn't even a factor in the dfly cheese people just want the rewards for the least amount of effort I mean are you really going to tell me holding down F in between panflute uses is more engaging  and fun than finding ways to deal with the larvae wave before dfly comes back? I feel like that's like saying fighting the training dummy is peak gameplay.