Volt Goat Jelly is unhealthy for combat.

[Cheggf]

All the characters got free OP reworks with no cost or downside and now they're getting a second round of free OP reworks with no cost or downside and this one expensive dish that requires you to farm several rare ingredients for and swap characters many times to benefit from its effects is the thing that's unhealthy.

If anything this is an issue with the Celestial Portal, and not Warly. It would be far from overpowered if someone was dedicating themselves to Warly to provide this buff to someone else who's dedicating themselves as Wolfgang, and the boss would be easy with multiple players anyways & even without any Warly buffs just two people could already reach 4x damage by just picking Wolfgang, ⅔ of this hypothetical best against an opponent in the rain and slightly more than the 3.6x that spiced VGCF gives Wolfgang when it isn't raining. 

[Wonz]

Warly is 80% support this way and 20% character, he needs to be 80% character and 20% support.  When support benefits get absolutely massive it gets out of control super fast with extra players.  Anyone who played Paladins and maybe Overwatch for long time and had eye on many balance patchnotes can tell that supports are fun if they can keep up their own in a fight and that benefits they share shouldn't be big.  

[Mysterious box]

34 minutes ago, Wonz said:

Warly is 80% support this way and 20% character, he needs to be 80% character and 20% support.  When support benefits get absolutely massive it gets out of control super fast with extra players.  Anyone who played Paladins and maybe Overwatch for long time and had eye on many balance patchnotes can tell that supports are fun if they can keep up their own in a fight and that benefits they share shouldn't be big.  

I disagree here as someone who used to play a cleric in some older mmos the sheer act of helping your team can be a very fun experience even if your role isn't very direct. Regardless of how we all feel about how the portal should be handled it is true that characters like Warly have their value undercut when people can get access to their abilities without committing to the character because it begs the question is your character's unique gift really helping? While often leading to the character feeling less special.

[cybers2001]

So why are we talking about volt goat jelly now?

You guys don't like power creep, you've made that abundantly clear. But power creep is a thing that exists in all actively-evolving games, and that's a good thing. There's constantly more content being added to the game, why shouldn't the old content become gradually easier? By allowing for power creep, this enables players to more quickly reach the newer content that the game has to offer. Klei already hinted at plans to add increasingly challenging late-game content that revolves around the planar system, so naturally it will take the place of the old challenges over time.

Let them cook, fellas. Quit bombarding the forums with a million different complaints (especially if they're unrelated to the beta itself).

[Bearger Enjoyer]

On 7/21/2023 at 12:19 AM, chirsg said:

It kills the game. Volt goat jelly kills the game.

Eh. It's in limited quantities and finnicky rng, so I think jelly as an item is alright. I only view it as a solo damage tool like everything else, it really does make fights less boring if you're impatient. Like spamming followers or catapults or fire, but more hands-on and less cheesy. Gotta use it smart until like day 200+.

 

As for the Warly swap thingy, a skill tree will probably fix him. Consider Maxwell; very formidable and versatile on his own, can casually invalidate Wicker, Walter, Wolfgang and Wurt simultaneously, goes under the radar just like wanda because "high skil" and yet you can use him as a swap character to put ender chests everywhere. His update adds something to the game besides the character but the character is not invalid. I think this is good.

[chirsg]

1 hour ago, Bearger Enjoyer said:

Eh. It's in limited quantities and finnicky rng, so I think jelly as an item is alright. I only view it as a solo damage tool like everything else, it really does make fights less boring if you're impatient. Like spamming followers or catapults or fire, but more hands-on and less cheesy. Gotta use it smart until like day 200+.

 

As for the Warly swap thingy, a skill tree will probably fix him. Consider Maxwell; very formidable and versatile on his own, can casually invalidate Wicker, Walter, Wolfgang and Wurt simultaneously, goes under the radar just like wanda because "high skil" and yet you can use him as a swap character to put ender chests everywhere. His update adds something to the game besides the character but the character is not invalid. I think this is good.

Don't worry, Maxwell was the object of my ire when Woodie's slam was nerfed. I know exactly how powerful Maxwell is lol.

My ire towards Maxwell was only because of how much he gets in his niches compared to Woodie, but now we're good.

I don't think Maxwell's power brings into question what's deemed unhealthy for the game if that makes sense.

It's the raw stats that VGCF provides to characters with good raw stats to begin with.

For me, VGCF is ok too, and in my off the record non political opinion, it's fine where it is. It's not a problem if you're dedicated to being bored while cooking batches of it.

Where I find it starts to become a problem is when high power characters are criticized because of the amp they get from the jelly. 

If I had to choose between the character getting nerfed vs VGCF, I would choose the latter.
It's all hypothetical, it's just that I think in tandem with VGCF, wrong trees get barked up.