10 ilogical things in ONI

[psusi]

2 hours ago, TheMule said:

Yup. It's no different from geysers. You see neutronium, you have to discover which type of geyser it is. It might be super useful or super useless, or something in between. I don't assume every single geyser is useful. Likewise, I don't assume every single planet is useful. Again, random.

I'm not saying every single one has to be useful; I'm saying it's a bit silly that 80% aren't.  You may get a CO2 or chlorine geyser but you don't get those 80% of the time.

[tzionut]

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Why wild

 I have 2 reasons. I play ONI whit a 7 years old laptop and no intention of change it in 2 years at least, for now I have other priorities than buying a new laptop or PC,  and i let them wild because I don't play whit many dupe and i don't want to waste dupe time for groom them. I prefer to build, or excavate, or do something else whit my dupe time.

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And I still don't get why you assume you should be able to crush everything in the first place.

Why not? Except neutronium you can do that. Is a goal like vacuuming all the asteroid, or use all the magma, or melt all the ice and polluted ice in the asteroid, or melting the tables and fixed lamps, or play only whit 6 dupe, and finish the game by sending all of them in the first mission to the temporal tear so they will not return. You see the point? If you limit the inputs of new resources like regolith, or gases, or water, you can use all resources by converting to something else. 

Phosphorite can be melted to phosphorus and vented, sulphur same if you convert crude oil to sour gas and back to methane then to natural gas. Water to crude oil, polluted dirt to dirt, almost anything to coal. It can be done and in this way the game is balanced. If you don't have some resources you can import it, or convert it. Now the game is still unbalanced.

Why have abyssalite in the space planets when is no possibility to find wolframite except to your asteroid, or using the alchemist exploit? And why storing insane numbers of reports and slowing your game instead of giving the players the possibility to let the game generate no report and make the save game smaller

[nakomaru]

1 hour ago, tzionut said:

giving the players the possibility to let the game generate no report and make the save game smaller

Klei did add this possibility by adding mod support. Fast Save Enhanced

There's also a mod that gives abyssalite two new recipes, as well as many others. I don't know if the balance is what you are hoping for though (the results are better than sand). Mineral Processing

[tzionut]

 @nakomaru i played all my games vanilla (no mods) From what i read there are some risks whit the save mod. Is good to know there are options available. Thanks again

[TheMule]

17 hours ago, tzionut said:

I don't play whit many dupe

BTW, it's not straightforward that lower dup count mean less CPU load. Actually some pleople reported the opposite. The reason being (supposedly) that constantly updating errand queues (which has to be sorted not only on prio but by proximity too, which require pathing calculations) is very CPU expensive, depending - not linearly - on queue lengh. So if you have more dups, you have less standing tasks, and shorter queues. You can also specialize more, completely denying some tasks (for example you can deny supplying to most dups - many supply errands have another category attached, like farming or operating), keeping each individual queue shorter (again, it's not linear: 50 queues of 10 errands each are easier to keep updated than 10 queues of 50 errands each). I used to play with about 12 dups tops for the same reason... lately I've changed my mind, 24-30 are fine as long as you keep queues in check.

That said, I've found pipes can be very CPU intensive too. So having tons of plants in hydroponic tiles isn't necessarily better than having dups grooming dreckos. It seems to me you've pitched yourself in a corner w/o any real advantage perfomance wise.

18 hours ago, tzionut said:

when is no possibility to find wolframite

The wiki seems to disagree.

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Wolframite can also be recovered from Space Missions on Glimmering Planets.

Also: https://oni-db.com/details/shinyplanet or https://oni-assistant.com/database/planets/shinyplanet

18 hours ago, tzionut said:

It can be done and in this way the game is balanced

We have a very different definition of balanced. To me balanced (in this context) means: the effort you put in acquiring a resource is proportional to its usefulness. It's has nothing to do with being able to do everything in every map. Also, in a game based on random, "balanced" is a very loose term. Again, poker. Some hands you're bound to loose, they only thing you can do is limit damages. That single hand is totally unbalanced, but the existence of such unbalanced hands is part of the game itself. It's not chess (which is very slightly unbalanced too, based on who takes the first turn), in which random plays no role.

I think the same applies to ONI. Yes wolframite is not guaranteed to be renewable. It may happen, it may not. Clearly you can't do the same things on two different maps.

My point being, there are many many things that depends on RNG. You can have a map with 3 oil wells or a map with 27. There's basicly a infinite set of goals you can come up with... but not every single map has to make all of them possible. On some seeds you might be able to completely empty the asteroid by dumping everything into space. It's a very specific goal, I don't see anything unbalanced if you can't do that on all seeds or even on most seeds. You can't have a 90kg/s petroleum boiler running for 2000 cycles in a map with only 3 wells, while if you want, you can on a map with 27 wells.

You can name 1000 other goals that are possible only on some seeds. Some of them may be possible only on very few seeds. I don't call that unbalanced, it's just random.

[tzionut]

@TheMule you are right to some point, but not you, or someone else don't have a seed in witch a player can use all the abyssalite in the asteroid whitout using a mod or delete it using buildmode...You can find whitout sandstone, regolith, but abyssalite you will always find.

[TheMule]

6 hours ago, tzionut said:

@TheMule you are right to some point, but not you, or someone else don't have a seed in witch a player can use all the abyssalite in the asteroid whitout using a mod or delete it using buildmode...You can find whitout sandstone, regolith, but abyssalite you will always find.

No I don't have, or know of, such a seed. Not because it doesn't exists, but because nobody is looking into it. You're possibly the only one who cares about the possibility of venting all the resources of the map into space or destroying them in some other ways. So it's very possible someone out there has such a seed but they don't even know.

The fact this is your thing is the problem I have with the title of this thread. I'd be fine with me if the title was 10 things I don't like about the game. Not only you're entitled to an opinion but you also have the right to voice it.

But logic is the opposite of opinions. It's the tool we have to discuss about facts in an indisputable way. So (pretty much excluding the 4kW / 2kW mistery) it's all about things you don't like about the game. It has nothing to do with logic. The idea you should be able to destroy any resource you don't have an use for is not logical, it's something you'd like.

 

[psusi]

28 minutes ago, TheMule said:

No I don't have, or know of, such a seed. Not because it doesn't exists, but because nobody is looking into it. You're possibly the only one who cares about the possibility of venting all the resources of the map into space or destroying them in some other ways. So it's very possible someone out there has such a seed but they don't even know.

It doesn't exist since abysalite isn't random; it always forms the borders between biomes.