Egg collection technique?

[BadlyBurned]

18 minutes ago, martosss said:

Nice setup, so you're exploiting the dupes' drop effect when locked out. However, I'd say @Capsup's idea is better, since it requires no dupes to walk around, so it's really automated!

Ya, of course those designs are better. After you get sweepers, automation, refined metal, etc etc.

This stable takes maybe 1-2 cycles to make, requires no power, and needs just a few kg of refined metal for the Gates.

Also, the exploit for locking the doors in the only way I know how to make fully automated ranching right now since they got rid of the Fish Release working for hatches.  Its not even really an exploit, more of just "bad manners" in tricking your Dupes.

[Christophlette]

12 minutes ago, BadlyBurned said:

Also, the exploit for locking the doors in the only way I know how to make fully automated ranching right now since they got rid of the Fish Release working for hatches.  Its not even really an exploit, more of just "bad manners" in tricking your Dupes.

Capsup seems to have a way to drown them without dupe interaction. Which requires a sweeper that you don't have for now in your game I admit. You could implement it in your farm ^^

It seems that the only dupe interaction @Capsup needs is when is egg pooper hatches die. A dupe needs to come and put an egg at the top ? Or a full grown hatch ? But a baby hatch can't grow in the water so... I don't know. There is still that question about his setup !

In any case, thank you a lot for all your setups ! That helps me to understand how it works and how I will do it in my game trying not to only copy and paste. I always try to make it different and appealing to the eye.

[martosss]

OK, I have to ask now, if you're using hatches for eggs and omelettes, do you feed the hatches at all? If yes, do you think it's sustainable to live that way? I made some calculations regarding omelettes and... unless you can produce enough stones for food, it is pretty unsustainable to feed hatches with human food:

Ah, also, I just connected the dots! I recently made a clock that can count multiple cycles. I was wondering what it can be used for. This might be one potential use - to measure when a critter has reached maturity/laid an egg. Given you know your critter behavior/egg-laying habits, you can count how much time a critter takes to grow up and lay an egg, after which you can kill it. This way you can optimize food amount required for critters.

Here's the idea for the clock. Feel free to ask about how to measure a certain time, I can do the math for you.

 @BadlyBurned, I don't put a negative connotation in exploiting  as in "using in a bad way". In this case I think of it rather as "using in a smart way". (from google: exploit - make full use of and derive benefit from (a resource))

@Christophlette, If you want to do something new, you might try using my clock(or another clock setup) and those hatch farms to come up with a way to keep the egg laying population in tact.

[Idinyphe]

What I don't get is how do you get all the energy for the systems you have and how do you keep them running?

If you found 2 natural gas very early in the game and both near your base then this is possible. But if you don't how do you do that?

I am playing on regular/regular and there is no way I get stuff like this working so early.

No way that you can run that on dupes, base will overheat very quick.

 

Only solution is you are doing those games on sandbox mode, please tell me that you do

[Christophlette]

@martosss I don't think I'm at that point yet. I can put numbers together, concepts and such. But make a such huge thing in motion. I may try but I'm not sure I can do it ^^

9 minutes ago, Idinyphe said:

Only solution is you are doing those games on sandbox mode, please tell me that you do

I usually rush for a coal generator setup. 4 coal generators with a smart battery. Then a double electrolyser setup with two hydrogen generators. My power system can sustain a full 4000W. At the moment I'm still running from coal at cycle 258 and my base drain around 1200W only. (I'm slow to expand.) 

But you must remember that most machines don't run full time. A sweeper may consume 120W. But only for 5 seconds per grab and store. So if it works only once per cycle, it only consumes 1W/s in reality. It's just a spike at one time but not a real cost.

[martosss]

2 minutes ago, Idinyphe said:

What I don't get is how do you get all the energy for the systems you have and how do you keep them running?
If you found 2 natural gas very early in the game and both near your base then this is possible. But if you don't how do you do that?
I am playing on regular/regular and there is no way I get stuff like this working so early.
No way that you can run that on dupes, base will overheat very quick.
Only solution is you are doing those games on sandbox mode, please tell me that you do

I am currently not using hatches at all. I made a few smooth hatches and sages, then I ran out of dirt and got angry and killed them all. I don't think it's worth to waste other rocks on them - you'll run out of rocks! Now I'm keeping a few sage hatches and eating all their eggs, waiting for them to die. However, I'm not feeding them at all.

However, I am using dreckos, as they basically give you free phosphorite and eggs(they eat balm lily which is free to grow).

Up to now I have no problems with overheating because I'm using cold biomes - I am melting the ice slowly instead of digging it(that gives you 100%, digging gives you 50% material) and using the pools of ice cold polluted/clean water to cool things down and feed plants.

I'm not sure what you mean by "that early" ... I am at ~ cycle 200 with 65 dupes and have plenty of energy, even without natural gas geysers. I am using mainly hydrogen from water. I have 2 cool steam geysers around me(recently discovered the 2nd one so I'm not using it yet). I have around 5 electrolyzers that work ~100%. That gives me 5*1200W of energy(800+ 400 from power plant ).  also have 2 coal generators, but try to use them only in emergencies(e.g. water shortage => electrolyzers don't work). Electrolyzers also supply my Oxygen(~45-50 dupes+ some more oxygen from deodorizers). Here's a bird-view of what you could do in that time - https://ibb.co/csRHw8

I am generally using sandbox only to test how things work - I have a test world where I play around with logic, electricity, heating/isolation and farming/ranching. However, my end goal would be to implement that in survival mode.

Note that I'm also struggling with heat a little, but as long as you keep your power plant away from the base it should be fine. Once you make a cooling setup with aquatuners and cold water things tend to cool pretty well. Currently I'm feeding plants with cold water, but I think that might change - seeing that plants can be cooled with pipes from above and fed hot water, I might try that in the future.

[Jumpp]

"Stables have mesh flooring so over 50% of coal and eggs just drop below."

Wait. What?

[BadlyBurned]

1 hour ago, Christophlette said:

Capsup seems to have a way to drown them without dupe interaction. Which requires a sweeper that you don't have for now in your game I admit. You could implement it in your farm ^^

It seems that the only dupe interaction @Capsup needs is when is egg pooper hatches die. A dupe needs to come and put an egg at the top ? Or a full grown hatch ? But a baby hatch can't grow in the water so... I don't know. There is still that question about his setup !

In any case, thank you a lot for all your setups ! That helps me to understand how it works and how I will do it in my game trying not to only copy and paste. I always try to make it different and appealing to the eye.

Ya, thats why mine is different. It refills the egg poppers automatically, so I never need to look or micromanage anything. Adding in an egg dropper will save Dupe interactions, but in the end, if you want to drown/refill the egg poppers automatically, I can't think of any other build now that they have changed the Fish Release to not except hatches.

Being FULLY automated is important to me, I can't stand having to keep track of stuff.

I mean, you could find a way to flood the room nightly using a timer and automation. That could also work.

 

55 minutes ago, Jumpp said:

"Stables have mesh flooring so over 50% of coal and eggs just drop below."

Wait. What?

Notice how over 50% of my flooring inside the stables is made of mesh doors. The hatches can walk on it, but if they poop coal or eggs, it'll just drop though, into the rooms below. Even if you use sweepers, it'll still save you power if you build vertically.

 

1 hour ago, Idinyphe said:

What I don't get is how do you get all the energy for the systems you have and how do you keep them running?

 

Exactly why I use my build. I also have no idea how these guys produce power for all this stuff early game lol. Especially since I need to look at arcades and music now.

I prefer my build for the simple fact that it takes no power and I only need a few kg of refined metal to start building it. I get this made quick, so that I can use that coal they produce to power other things in the mid game.

[Jumpp]

Okay, that's cool. I had never noticed that stuff falls through sideways mesh doors. They don't have to open to make this happen?

[BadlyBurned]

18 minutes ago, Jumpp said:

Okay, that's cool. I had never noticed that stuff falls through sideways mesh doors. They don't have to open to make this happen?

No, and if they do open, the hatches won't fall through. Building vertically like this can be really good, just put coal storage, egg storage, etc all at the bottom, and it'll just fall straight down.

[Capsup]

17 hours ago, martosss said:

OK, I have to ask now, if you're using hatches for eggs and omelettes, do you feed the hatches at all? If yes, do you think it's sustainable to live that way? I made some calculations regarding omelettes and... unless you can produce enough stones for food, it is pretty unsustainable to feed hatches with human food:

 

Is this correct though? I'll be honest and say I can't really be bothered to make a correct excel sheet right now, but your "not fed" columns definitely needs to be clamped. If you don't feed a hatch from its' birth, you don't get 14,8 eggs throughout its' lifetime since it'll starve to death, you'll get exactly 0, because it'll spend the first 5 days growing up and then it'll starve to death before it gets to reproduce (but that leaves us with 3200 kcal of meat!)

Some quick debug testing with temperatures on a hatch inside its' comfort range showed me that it didn't really have an effect, so I'm not sure what that changes.

A critter not being groomed, in captivity, will be glum and thus will consume calories 5 times slower but also only lay 1 egg per lifetime, so not grooming them isn't actually an option if we're going for eggs.

So I'm not really sure those numbers checks out, which is why it looks like it doesn't make sense at all since you're basing your numbers on ... what appears to be wrong numbers?

18 hours ago, Christophlette said:

Capsup seems to have a way to drown them without dupe interaction. Which requires a sweeper that you don't have for now in your game I admit. You could implement it in your farm ^^

It seems that the only dupe interaction @Capsup needs is when is egg pooper hatches die. A dupe needs to come and put an egg at the top ? Or a full grown hatch ? But a baby hatch can't grow in the water so... I don't know. There is still that question about his setup !

There is indeed not really a good way to automatically fill up the breeder stable, since they removed the option of a conveyor rail loop. All I do myself is just sweep one of the eggs in the bottom once I notice the stables missing a hatch to that empty compactor on the right which is set to "sweep only" and "stone hatchling egg". They drop the egg in there, I drop manually drop the egg out of there by unchecking the eggs of the compactor, then let the egg incubate. Then I mark it to be wrangled and it'll be put up into the breeder stable. It is the simplest solution until we get some way of measuring the amount of critters in a room or something like that.

You could solve this using something like Martoss' clock, a seperate breeding stable and another auto-dropping sweeper to seperate 1 egg every 12th cycle, but I much prefer the compact hatch stable and then a bit of manual work over a bigger hatch stable and it being fully automated.

[Scorpio King]

This is how i handle my critters:

Stone hatches were at 400 before i started to crack all eggs they lay for lime.

For shine bugs there is a lure that keeps them all in center, i dont bother relocating the eggs.

Drekos cant get out cos of the liquid lock, but there is no door in it.

The reason it works is that the grooming station does not have to be in a room to operate, making essentially my whole base a "room". So the critters does not get overcrowded and stay happy if groomed.

[Capsup]

20 hours ago, Scorpio King said:

This is how i handle my critters:

Stone hatches were at 400 before i started to crack all eggs they lay for lime.

For shine bugs there is a lure that keeps them all in center, i dont bother relocating the eggs.

Drekos cant get out cos of the liquid lock, but there is no door in it.

The reason it works is that the grooming station does not have to be in a room to operate, making essentially my whole base a "room". So the critters does not get overcrowded and stay happy if groomed.

I saw it mentioned that using grooming stations outside of a stable requires your ranchers to be seasoned though, is this right?

[hpongledd]

This is what i came up. Im producing meat, but can be easily switched to egg shells/omelette production

- Below left: is my breeding chamber, to fill the upper rooms
- Upper rooms: Just laying eggs and moved to my killing chamber (Im grooming them for coal and happiness)
- Killing chamber: has an autosweeper that stays on for 3sec, just enough time to pick up the eggs and letting them fall, with the clock sensors i move the water up once a day to kill all hatches and move the meat to the kitchen. But you could increase the timer moving the eggs to the storage and wait till viability goes down and egg shells pop out or you could move and crack them)

[Scorpio King]

3 hours ago, Capsup said:

I saw it mentioned that using grooming stations outside of a stable requires your ranchers to be seasoned though, is this right?

Not that i noticed, no. I think its unintended and would be fixed sometime.

@hpongledd That giant pool of water tho, love it.

[hpongledd]

1 hour ago, Scorpio King said:

Not that i noticed, no. I think its unintended and would be fixed sometime.

@hpongledd That giant pool of water tho, love it.

That giant pool of water needs to be consumed because its overflowing everywhere....

 

[Scorpio King]

I'm exploiting my water collection.

Only reason the water tank is not smaller like PH2O one is for visual representation, so i know when i need to panic when water gets low.

PH2O tank gives out heavy bursts of PO2, evaporation scales with mass, it can go beyond 1800g of gas, but if its not pumped out it wont burst anymore.

[hpongledd]

38 minutes ago, Scorpio King said:

I'm exploiting my water collection.

Only reason the water tank is not smaller like PH2O one is for visual representation, so i know when i need to panic when water gets low.

PH2O tank gives out heavy bursts of PO2, evaporation scales with mass, it can go beyond 1800g of gas, but if its not pumped out it wont burst anymore.

the dip of pH2O tho...genius! did not know about those ones! the one for pH2O is just moving one tile from before the vent to after it, isnt it?

 im going to overpressurize this