Willow REHAUL (I know there's a lot of threads, but read this one)

[Chesska]

I don't think what we've got going on with Willow is acceptable and I have absolutely NEVER liked her as a character since, as a pyromaniac, she just DOESN'T reflect that in her abilities at all.

 

IMMUNITY to fire? Gaining sanity from fire? Starting off with a lighter? None of that makes sense!

 

Here are all my suggestions. First off, clean slate, remove all her current perks.

 

So every character has 3 details about them that makes them unique, yes? So let's go with these three.

 

1. Likes to pass the torch - Willow has a 100% chance to set enemies on fire with torches and other objects that can be used to light enemies on fire, and does 200% damage with a fire-base weapon equipped. In addition, any enemy that attacks her has a 10% chance to be lit on fire. Finally, enemies that die by fire damage when Willow is around will have an 80% chance (per item) to drop their normal items instead of Ash upon death.
2. A very resourceful pyromaniac - Torches last twice as long when Willow equips them, and whenever she fuels a fire it gains 1.5x the normal amount of fuel.
3. Really shouldn't be around fire - Burns food when she cooks it, reducing its nutritional value by half. In addition, her sanity drains around fire and enemies that are on fire.

I honestly believe these 3 would be a perfect balance for her. It fits her well.

 

She's a pyromaniac, not a fire goddess. She lights things on fire by accident. And gaining sanity from fire? That makes no sense at all. I suppose as a game mechanic, sure. But with what I've suggested, she'll have enough fire-related positive perks that her LOSING sanity to fire would be more balanced.

 

I honestly don't believe that just some minor tweaking of Willow is what we need.

 

I wasn't happy with her lighting fires in the dark back in 2012, I wasn't enthralled with her gaining sanity to fire, and the addition of her lighter which is just a bad torch that never runs out never caught my attention.

 

Make her an actual pyromaniac.

 

This goes hand-in-hand with Wendy's massive overhaul when Sanity became an issue, it makes sense for the Bereaved character to lose less sanity in situations that would bother others. Having Abigail as a blood pact summon that stays around longer is MUCH better than what she had previously, and her doing less damage as a trade-off is a fantastic solution to the idea that Abigail might make her overpowered.

 

So please, genuinely consider these suggestions.

 

And if any modders out there read this and think they can pull off all this through mods, give it a go!

[Rosten]

Burns food when she cooks it, reducing its nutritional value by half. In addition, her sanity drains around fire and enemies that are on fire.

 

Dear god why

 

[Chesska]

Burns food when she cooks it, reducing its nutritional value by half. In addition, her sanity drains around fire and enemies that are on fire.

 

Dear god why

 

I mean strictly cooking over a campfire, not crockpot.

 

 

Also why WOULDN'T her sanity drain around fire? She's a pyromaniac. That's FEEDING THE DISEASE.

[Auth]

I mean strictly cooking over a campfire, not crockpot.

 

 

Also why WOULDN'T her sanity drain around fire? She's a pyromaniac. That's FEEDING THE DISEASE.

 

Pyromaniacs are actually calmed by fires. Shows what you know.

[Rosten]

Pyromaniacs are actually calmed by fires. Shows what you know.

Pyromania is an impulse control disorder^[1] in which individuals repeatedly fail to resist impulses to deliberately start fires,^[1] in order to relieve tension or for instant gratification

 

Weirdobob's right.

 

[Chesska]

Relieving tension doesn't increase sanity, though.

 

I mean, I get your point. But it's all kind of semantics... in my personal opinion, it'd make more sense for a pyromaniac to lose sanity to being around fire because being around fire would make her go deeper into a crazed state of fire-lust, thus becoming more insane.

 

Plus she's not your run-of-the-mill pyromaniac, she burned down a village and constantly refers to things by their flammability. That really can't be good for her health.

 

Either way, it's better than the current inexplicable 10% sanity drain from all sources right now, why not move that to fire sources instead? It makes more sense than what's there now.

[CammoAmmo]

Honestly, if you want a new champion, then ask for a new champion. But judging from the uprising of people who are against the Willow nerfs (including me), there are many people who actually do like Willow. Just because you don't like a champion doesn't mean that she deserves a complete overhaul. 

 

Also, it's a game. Nothing is going to be perfectly realistic. 

[rezecib]

Either way, it's better than the current inexplicable 10% sanity drain from all sources right now, why not move that to fire sources instead? It makes more sense than what's there now.

That's not how it works. She just has a 1.1 multiplier on all sanity rates. That is, her sanity component adds up all the factors, determines a rate, and then multiplies that by 1.1. So if she would be gaining sanity normally, she gains a little more. If she would be losing sanity normally, she loses a little more. 

 

But as for general feedback on your idea... It's interesting, more interesting than the previous Willow was. But along the lines of what CammoAmmo said, this makes more sense for a new character. The reason Willow is getting tweaked instead of completely overhauled is because she's already been a character. While yes, from a design standpoint it's easier just to completely overhaul her, there's also a legacy consideration.

 

But I don't think anyone should be getting all up in arms about the current state of Willow. If you have a private server where there were no griefers, you can use the mod to restore Willow. Otherwise, it's a temporary solution, and is definitely going to evolve further.

[Asparagus]

She's a pyromaniac, not a fire goddess.

Why not both! O__O 

[Chesska]

That's not how it works. She just has a 1.1 multiplier on all sanity rates. That is, her sanity component adds up all the factors, determines a rate, and then multiplies that by 1.1. So if she would be gaining sanity normally, she gains a little more. If she would be losing sanity normally, she loses a little more. 

 

But as for general feedback on your idea... It's interesting, more interesting than the previous Willow was. But along the lines of what CammoAmmo said, this makes more sense for a new character. The reason Willow is getting tweaked instead of completely overhauled is because she's already been a character. While yes, from a design standpoint it's easier just to completely overhaul her, there's also a legacy consideration.

 

But I don't think anyone should be getting all up in arms about the current state of Willow. If you have a private server where there were no griefers, you can use the mod to restore Willow. Otherwise, it's a temporary solution, and is definitely going to evolve further.

 

 

Wendy got completely overhauled, everything about the way she works changed. It was slow and over time, yes, but when she started out she was just mechanically another Wilson that had a spooky follower every third evening.

 

Now she has a consistent follower, a damage nerf, very different sanity mechanics, and plays and works entirely differently.

 

The same needs to happen to Willow. Since her introduction, the only changes she's gotten is immunity to fire and having a lighter. Her fire-based perk is still just lighting a tiny fire at her feet, but at least when that was first introduced it was actually useful since she could go nights without a torch.

 

Willow needs to be changed. She just isn't different enough, especially after all this nerfing. She's just Wilson with a 50% fire damage reduction. What's the point of that?

 

 

Honestly, if you want a new champion, then ask for a new champion. But judging from the uprising of people who are against the Willow nerfs (including me), there are many people who actually do like Willow. Just because you don't like a champion doesn't mean that she deserves a complete overhaul. 

 

Also, it's a game. Nothing is going to be perfectly realistic. 

 

I'm sorry but this isn't league of legends or dota or wherever you came from. They're characters. Not champions, not avatars, not toons. Characters.

[Asparagus]

I'm sorry but this isn't league of legends or dota or wherever you came from. They're characters. Not champions, not avatars, not toons. Characters.

I thought they were called "puppets"? O__O

 

Anyway... what are your thoughts about returning Willow to her old self? As in immunity to the Grue? Then she would be totally different from the rest... O___O

 

My thoughts:

• Become 75% immune to fire damage (not so "weak" as the 50% she is now but not too OP for the total 100%)
• Make the lighter non-craftable but refuelable... (so she'll be even more special for being the only character with a personal light source)
• Keep her "regains sanity when near fire" perk (as pyromaniacs feel at ease when seeing or being near fires)

Honestly, she was fine before... it's the people misusing her that's the problem...

O__O

[Chesska]

I thought they were called "puppets"? O__O

 

Anyway... what are your thoughts about returning Willow to her old self? As in immunity to the Grue? Then she would be totally different from the rest... O___O

 

My thoughts:

• Become 75% immune to fire damage (not so "weak" as the 50% she is now but not too OP for the total 100%)
• Make the lighter non-craftable but refuelable... (so she'll be even more special for being the only character with a personal light source)
• Keep her "regains sanity when near fire" perk (as pyromaniacs feel at ease when seeing or being near fires)

Honestly, she was fine before... it's the people misusing her that's the problem...

O__O

 

I don't know, I really feel like regaining sanity when near a fire makes it entirely too easy to manage her sanity. The sanity gain at a max level fire is more than the Tam o' Shanter, and they can be stacked.

 

Fire resistance is iffy for me. Realistically it makes no sense, but... let's throw realism out the door because let's face it, it's not part of the equation. If she has some kind of magical aura, why should it be one that protects her from fire but doesn't deal any fire damage itself?

 

She needs to light more fires more often and it needs to have more drawbacks than it currently has or ever has had. The worst thing you can do with fire is get rid of potentially renewable resources like twigs, berry bushes, and grass and that can be avoided easily enough.

 

The lighter is just kinda dumb. I really don't think she needs a starting item or an exclusive item to be a good pyromaniac, she just needs to be more... fiery.

 

But I'm obviously really biased, and this argument isn't really going anywhere.

 

Is there a place to request mods..? I want to request some character mods...

 

Or at least some artwork and sound files, I could probably learn lua scripting in a few weeks if I really wanted to.

[Asparagus]

But I'm obviously really biased, and this argument isn't really going anywhere.   Is there a place to request mods..? I want to request some character mods...   Or at least some artwork and sound files, I could probably learn lua scripting in a few weeks if I really wanted to.

  

 

[CammoAmmo]

Wendy got completely overhauled, everything about the way she works changed. It was slow and over time, yes, but when she started out she was just mechanically another Wilson that had a spooky follower every third evening.

Now she has a consistent follower, a damage nerf, very different sanity mechanics, and plays and works entirely differently.

The same needs to happen to Willow. Since her introduction, the only changes she's gotten is immunity to fire and having a lighter. Her fire-based perk is still just lighting a tiny fire at her feet, but at least when that was first introduced it was actually useful since she could go nights without a torch.

Willow needs to be changed. She just isn't different enough, especially after all this nerfing. She's just Wilson with a 50% fire damage reduction. What's the point of that?

I'm sorry but this isn't league of legends or dota or wherever you came from. They're characters. Not champions, not avatars, not toons. Characters.

Do I need to change the word to character for you to understand my post? My point still stands.

[Uthael]

Sanity is a matter of perspective and cultural viewpoint.

In some eastern countries every being "that has it's back turned to God" is just food. Including what we call "pets". Heck, there are societies in which cannibalism is normal. I know a guy that used to spend 18+ hours a day on their PC. Playing games! Now he's got a regular job and is one of the rare I know in my life that's both quite intelligent AND accepted as "sane".

 

If something looks insane, you ain't looking "outside of the box".

"Relieving mental tension" sounds kind of lame in this game. I believe "gaining sanity" is a nicer term.

 

Side note: someone said "champions" instead of "characters". Both true, why not. It's not like characters here are a regular appearance in the worlds of Don't starve.  

 

All that being said, I believe a pyromaniac character really should gain sanity while standing near a fire.

[Uthael]

Wanted to edit my post, but "our post will need to be approved by a moderator,"...

Quoting OP: "IMMUNITY to fire? Gaining sanity from fire? Starting off with a lighter? None of that makes sense!"

I'd agree that fire immunity is odd and wouldn't mind it removed for the sake of game balance, but why not start with a lighter? Even if all of the characters would start with an empty inventory, it wouldn't explain the fancy clothes. So why not a lighter?

[Auth]

to be honest, i thought the characters were fine. willow needed a nerf for her lighter, yes, but she didnt need a nerf herself. Although, I wouldn't stress it, I'm sure a mod will come out that returns Willow to her old self. (at least I hope so, I really dont want to do that myself) 

 

I liked her fire immunity, but now, she's basically a Wilson that suffers from terrible sanity, and is an okay charcoal farmer. Besides, this blows my theory of Willow wearing fire-retardent undies.

[rezecib]

I'm sure a mod will come out that returns Willow to her old self.

Here you go. 

[darthmorf]

From what I've seen of suggestions (from other forums too) ones that get added are usually smaller ones. Clearly, the devs like her how she is. I think a better solution would be to just change her description.