[Game Update] - 651259

[CremeLover]

4 hours ago, Jason said:

Changes

• Wendy
  • The Shadow Abigail becomes a flat 25 planar damage instead fluctuating with day cycle.
  • When the Sisturn is filled with Lune Tree Blossoms, while Abigail is summoned, elixirs heal at half rate.
  • The chance of bonus elixirs from Extra Yield is slightly reduced.
  • Grave Beautification skill now adds a craftable Spirit Vessel that is used to carry Spirits from a grave to a new location.
  • Gestalt Abigail behaviour tweaks:
    • Range to initiate an attack is longer than default.
  • Art changes
    • Shadow Abigail is changed.
    • Wendy has a unique version of the grave revival animation
    • When the Sisturn is full of Lune Tree Blossoms, there is a new idle to express Abigail’s closer proximity to reality.

 

So in the end the solution was to nerf the elixir when Abigail has damage reduction instead of reworking the mechanic.

Not the most elegant solution, and is going to create a few undesirable interactions, most notably:

On 1/3/2025 at 5:24 AM, DegenerateFurry said:

Some bosses have doubled damage against mobs while others do the same amount to players and mobs. 

Bosses that do the same regardless of target type:

• Ancient Guardian
• Shadow Pieces (all, all stages)
• Lord of the Fruit Flies (does he even count?)
• Crab King's imposing claws
• Nightmare Werepig
• Possessed Varg
• Frostjaw
• Great Depths Worm
• Scrappy Werepig
• Spider Queen
• Toadstool
• Ancient Fuelweaver

Bosses that do doubled damage to mobs: 

• Bearger
• Deerclops
• Moose/Goose
• Antlion
• Bee Queen
• Crystal Deerclops
• Armored Bearger
• Malbatross
• Dragonfly
• Eye of Terror
• Twins of Terror
• Treeguards
• Klaus
• Ancient Fuelweaver

Celestial Champion also does extra damage to mobs with most of its attacks, but it's only a little bit more rather than doubled.

Which means taking the line AND using the petals on the sisturn would nerf to Abigail's best elixir with no tangeable benefits... so I guess I better keep this list handy for Wendy playthroughs.

And to my utmost disillusionment, not even considering any changes to mourning glory acquisition.

Nevertheless, thanks for the hard work, and kudos to the fantastic work to the animation team as always.
Looking forward to the release of the beta!

Edited January 24, 2025 by CremeLover

[WenericMember]

21 minutes ago, CremeLover said:

So in the end the solution was to nerf the elixir when Abigail has damage reduction instead of reworking the mechanic.

Not the most elegant solution, and is going to create a few undesirable interactions, most notably:

Which means taking the line AND using the petals on the sisturn would nerf to Abigail's best elixir with no tangeable benefits... so I guess I better keep this list handy for Wendy playthroughs.

And to my utmost disillusionment, not even considering any changes to mourning glory acquisition.

Nevertheless, thanks for the hard work, and kudos to the fantastic work to the animation team as always.
Looking forward to the release of the beta!

The beta isn't quite done yet,  Walter still has changes to go, so things might still happen.

I think the main issue that stopped your suggestions from being implemented is that they were changes to Wendy's base kit which isn't really the focused for the update. Consider:

Yeah they should make Player tag more consistent either way lol.

[HowlVoid]

38 minutes ago, CremeLover said:

So in the end the solution was to nerf the elixir when Abigail has damage reduction instead of reworking the mechanic.

Not the most elegant solution, and is going to create a few undesirable interactions, most notably:

Which means taking the line AND using the petals on the sisturn would nerf to Abigail's best elixir with no tangeable benefits... so I guess I better keep this list handy for Wendy playthroughs.

And to my utmost disillusionment, not even considering any changes to mourning glory acquisition.

Nevertheless, thanks for the hard work, and kudos to the fantastic work to the animation team as always.
Looking forward to the release of the beta!

Last time I heard antlion doesn't even hurt Abigail, this was changed? 

And spider queen, lord of the fruitflies and crab king??? This list has a lot of fluff 9 times out of 10 those are not hard or free hits for Abigail.

The only real threats they could take a look at are fw, toadstool, and shadow pieces (not sure about nightmare werepig).

Second list are just character counters, good kiting is rewarded and having weaknesses to a strong character makes them more interesting. Klaus and Dragonfly are huge threats to wormwood when he catches on fire and that's interesting to the character imo.

Edited January 24, 2025 by HowlVoid

[Dingle]

43 minutes ago, CremeLover said:

So in the end the solution was to nerf the elixir when Abigail has damage reduction instead of reworking the mechanic.

Not the most elegant solution, and is going to create a few undesirable interactions, most notably:

Which means taking the line AND using the petals on the sisturn would nerf to Abigail's best elixir with no tangeable benefits... so I guess I better keep this list handy for Wendy playthroughs.

And to my utmost disillusionment, not even considering any changes to mourning glory acquisition.

Nevertheless, thanks for the hard work, and kudos to the fantastic work to the animation team as always.
Looking forward to the release of the beta!

AFW is wrong, look down a bit in that thread

[CremeLover]

1 hour ago, HowlVoid said:

Last time I heard antlion doesn't even hurt Abigail, this was changed? 

And spider queen, lord of the fruitflies and crab king??? This list has a lot of fluff 9 times out of 10 those are not hard or free hits for Abigail.

The only real threats they could take a look at are fw, toadstool, and shadow pieces (not sure about nightmare werepig).

Second list are just character counters, good kiting is rewarded and having weaknesses to a strong character makes them more interesting. Klaus and Dragonfly are huge threats to wormwood when he catches on fire and that's interesting to the character imo.

Is not about the difficulty, is about a skill that makes Abigail "become more resistant to the Giants of the constant like the rest of the survivors", but actually only on some of them, while nerfing her overall.

59 minutes ago, Dingle said:

AFW is wrong, look down a bit in that thread

True, I mostly just wanted the original post that had a list and redirect to the thread, instead of copying a new one, but still should've edited the quote of the original post as well at least, my bad. Thanks for the heads up.

Edited January 24, 2025 by CremeLover

[marshyds]

Every day we get closer to the first living character that starts with A in dst.

[Yaorin yon]

Are you saying that player tags do not apply to any enemies, but the elixir must be weakened by a multiplier? Is your logic like this? I have never seen a weakening function in any character's skill tree, and this absurdity is like a lot of water in the designer's mind.

[HowlVoid]

I have a suggestion for the shield potion.

 

Picture is just for proof of concept.

My point is the "shield" is an immovable area of effect "entity". You drink the potion, ghostly hands spawn to form a dome (or abigails big head can pop out the ground as a 4x4 tile dome) and player characters can move in and out of it. 

A single dome can make everyone inside of it (Wendy, abigail and co.) Immune to an area of effect hit (if all hit simultaneously or 1 hit if single target. And it has 1 hp so it pops after 1 hit. 

The vengeance version would just do aoe when it pops. Bonus if the hands clap/swat to do damage or the big Abigail head turns red like when she does an aoe.

It doesn't move so you'd have to use preemptively. Idk if drinking another potion spawns another one or it replaces the old one (give them a timer?).

But it would have more applications like giving allies a place to heal, fight inside it to protect your beefalo, fight inside it to protect Abigail/give her time to run away, idk what else. 

Imagine you place a revival shrine as Wendy and then "bubble it" so if you revive mid battle you don't just immediately die again to the first hit. Maybe it gives some warmth....

Also you can make the shield just a big bubble too, that's probably less work. 

Edited January 24, 2025 by HowlVoid

[Kondr_]

I like Unyielding Draught right now and i thought that Distilled Vengeance is a bit expensive since its release.

but i still have suggestion mb someone would like it:
 

mb Unyielding Draught should give some summer protection?

Distilled Vengeance may give some water protection or block drown-penalty (like Wes can)

[Evelo]

Interesting that Lune Blossoms brings "Abigail closer to reality" when wearing the Enlightened Crown she states, "When I wear it, i-it's harder to see Abigail." which seems like a disconnect between what the lunar stuff does. Unless of course the Lune Blossoms are actually just causing Wendy to hallucinate more as the Gestalts appear to whisper promises of desires of some kind to many of the survivors. Would love a lore explanation as to why Lune Blossoms do this to Wendy/Abigail.
Either way I am still super happy yall decided to take up that idea of adding in Lune Blossoms to the Sisturn. Makes me a happy little Flower Friend!

One more thing, what does putting Dark Petals in the Sisturn actually do? Besides look awesome and give a massive sanity drain?

[WenericMember]

1 hour ago, Evelo said:

Interesting that Lune Blossoms brings "Abigail closer to reality" when wearing the Enlightened Crown she states, "When I wear it, i-it's harder to see Abigail." which seems like a disconnect between what the lunar stuff does. Unless of course the Lune Blossoms are actually just causing Wendy to hallucinate more as the Gestalts appear to whisper promises of desires of some kind to many of the survivors. Would love a lore explanation as to why Lune Blossoms do this to Wendy/Abigail.
Either way I am still super happy yall decided to take up that idea of adding in Lune Blossoms to the Sisturn. Makes me a happy little Flower Friend!

One more thing, what does putting Dark Petals in the Sisturn actually do? Besides look awesome and give a massive sanity drain?

I think it's just that. Largely a flavor thing as Dark Petals are comparatively easy to get.

The way I see Lunar interaction with Abigail:

• The celestial crown is a direct connection to altar. The overwhelming lunar magic disrupts the shadow magic keeping Abigail materialized, as Wendy has no control over the crown.
• Lunar Blossoms. They are a mutated, but are not actually related to altar. They aren't actually posessed by gesalts, but still retain trace amounts of lunar magic. Unlike the celestial crown: which isn't designed by the survivors, the Lunar Sisturn is actually controlling the magic, like Wagstaff is trying to do.
• Gesalt Abigail: Is a different way of Abigail manifesting. In folklore spirits can manifest in a variety of ways - will-o-wisps, spectres, banshees, the list is endless. Gesalt Abigail isn't corrupted like the lunar bosses as she lacks material form (the bosses were the spiritless corpses possessed by gesalts), but manifests in a different form as normal, granting her different abilities.

I think the big thing that people are forgetting, is that Altar and Gesalts are the only actively "corruptive" elements. The rest is the result of that corruption.

 

Edited January 24, 2025 by WenericMember

[Evelo]

3 minutes ago, WenericMember said:

The way I see Lunar interaction with Abigail:

• The celestial crown is a direct connection to altar. The overwhelming lunar magic disrupts the shadow magic keeping Abigail materialized.
• Lunar Blossoms. They are a mutated, but are not actually related to altar. They aren't actually posessed by gesalts, but still retain trace amounts of lunar magic. Unlike the celestial crown: which isn't designed by the survivors, the Lunar Sisturn is actually controlling the magic, like Wagstaff is trying to do.
• Gesalt Abigail: Is a different way of Abigail manifesting. In folklore spirits can manifest in a variety of ways - will-o-wisps, spectres, banshees, the list is endless. Gesalt Abigail isn't corrupted as she lacks material form, but manifests in a different form as normal, granting her different abilities.

oooh I like those, would like to see an official reasoning from Klei so we can add that to our Lore collection :P thanks for the theories!

[Creatorofswamps]

6 hours ago, Jason said:

Wendy

• The Shadow Abigail becomes a flat 25 planar damage instead fluctuating with day cycle.
• When the Sisturn is filled with Lune Tree Blossoms, while Abigail is summoned, elixirs heal at half rate.
• The chance of bonus elixirs from Extra Yield is slightly reduced.
• The Gravestones By Wendy skill now adds a craftable Spirit Vessel that is used to carry Spirits from a grave to a new location.
• Gestalt Abigail behaviour tweaks:
  • Range to initiate an attack is longer than default.
• Art changes
  • Shadow Abigail is changed.
  • Wendy has a unique version of the grave revival animation
  • When the Sisturn is full of Lune Tree Blossoms, there is a new idle to express Abigail’s closer proximity to reality.

 

Thanks for the nice update, it's really cool that you've further refined the visual aspects of Wendy's skill tree. And Abigail in "human form" is pretty  cute!

Edited January 24, 2025 by Creatorofswamps

[Grove]

24 minutes ago, WenericMember said:

Lunar Blossoms. They are a mutated, but are not actually related to altar. They aren't actually posessed by gesalts, but still retain trace amounts of lunar magic. Unlike the celestial crown: which isn't designed by the survivors, the Lunar Sisturn is actually controlling the magic, like Wagstaff is trying to do.

Wendy and Abby accidentally controlling lunar magic while Wagstaff struggles is hilarious. Truly the nieces of Maxwell

[WenericMember]

12 minutes ago, Debruh said:

Wendy and Abby accidentally controlling lunar magic while Wagstaff struggles is hilarious. Truly the nieces of Maxwell

I Love whenever Wendy is a little bit uppity, she's just got the tiniest touch of Maxwell in her and it's great.

Speaking of which, I really hope we get a Maxwell & Wendy intermission this year. There's so much potential there.

[TeaY]

I'm really shocked. The skill trees for three characters took a full two months to complete. There were many problems with the early versions of the skill trees. Everyone waited for over a month, only to get such a result? During these more than one month, friends on the forum raised so many suggestions and ideas. Yet you completely ignored them. After waiting for such a long time, Wendy's skill tree has become even worse. I'm really disappointed in you all.

[Littlefat1213]

I'm dreaming to own my ghost army when playing wendy. Never mind, it's not in the mainline and we can make it come true via workshop in future.

[Grove]

1 minute ago, Littlefat1213 said:

I'm dreaming to own my ghost army when playing wendy. Never mind, it's not in the mainline and we can make it come true via workshop in future.

I mean the grave skills achieve something similar to that.

Also, pretty weird to expect to lead an army as the character whose lore and gameplay is centered around one specific person/follower who she's incomplete without.

This isn't even a flaw with the character, this comment feels like filler

[WenericMember]

2 minutes ago, Debruh said:

I mean the grave skills achieve something similar to that.

Also, pretty weird to expect to lead an army as the character whose lore and gameplay is centered around one specific person/follower who she's incomplete without.

This isn't even a flaw with the character, this comment feels like filler

Leave em be, they aren't being rude and it's not like no-ones ever gone off topic before. I get tensions are high, but your comment just feels needlessly aggressive.

Edited January 24, 2025 by WenericMember

[Littlefat1213]

4 minutes ago, Debruh said:

I mean the grave skills achieve something similar to that.

Also, pretty weird to expect to lead an army as the character whose lore and gameplay is centered around one specific person/follower who she's incomplete without.

This isn't even a flaw with the character, this comment feels like filler

Yeah i admit it's a bit off topic, I just share a funny idea but i'm not requesting for devs to do it.

you know wendy can help the pipspook and i think it's not strange to leader the ghost. Just feel interesting when other guy see a wave of ghost following you back to the base.

And it's not worth to make it offical, ghost is weak and not really helpful to the combat.

[WenericMember]

1 minute ago, Littlefat1213 said:

Yeah i admit it's a bit off topic, I just share a funny idea but i'm not requesting for devs to do it.

you know wendy can help the pipspook and i think it's not strange to leader the ghost. Just feel interesting when other guy see a wave of ghost following you back to the base.

And it's not worth to make it offical, ghost is weak and not really helpful to the combat.

Tbh uncapped Grave spawns would be hilarious to see in action. 

Especially because they rapidly respawn IIRC.

[Master_NiX]

Not sure if this was ever mentioned, but apparently you can deconstruct Graves now.
I kinda like it now, but I wish I could decorate those without the Headstone, since those cant be removed at all.

 

 

 

Edited January 24, 2025 by Master_NiX

[WenericMember]

5 minutes ago, Master_NiX said:

Not sure if this was ever mentioned, but apparently you can deconstruct Graves now.
I kinda like it now, but I wish I could decorate those without the Headstone, since those cant be removed at all.

 

 

 

Huh, so they did solve the softlock with AF and CC summoning.

[erick was right]

disappointment, after so many good suggestion nothing was made to beta

[Steorra]

14 minutes ago, Master_NiX said:

Not sure if this was ever mentioned, but apparently you can deconstruct Graves now.
I kinda like it now, but I wish I could decorate those without the Headstone, since those cant be removed at all.

 

 

 

This was already applied before the latest patch.

1 hour ago, Littlefat1213 said:

Yeah i admit it's a bit off topic, I just share a funny idea but i'm not requesting for devs to do it.

you know wendy can help the pipspook and i think it's not strange to leader the ghost. Just feel interesting when other guy see a wave of ghost following you back to the base.

And it's not worth to make it offical, ghost is weak and not really helpful to the combat.

Due to these patches, I think the ideas which "not worth to make it official" have more chance to go live rather than some compromise idea by complex long-term discussion.