Yes, Abi SHOULD be "immortal" and this enhanced Wendy's identity. (Survey for attitudes of Abi's survival)

[mima_]

no, abigail should not be immortal without wendy help, thats all thank you

[WANZUN]

My personal view is to remove the player tag, because Abigail is not a player, the subsidy can only increase the defense of the moon Abigail by 85%. In this way, the characteristics of Shadow abi and Moon abi are distinct, with the loss of aoe and the promotion of single combat.

[renamoe]

Quote

1. Do you agree that Abi is the only one core feature of Wendy?

Yes.

No. (please leave details about what other core feature Wendy has)

This is a tough question for me to answer because I don't see Abigail as the only core feature of Wendy. Wendy herself is a complete character with so much personality and depth. She's comfortable in the dark, dabbles in Ectoherbology, doesn't hit very hard, and her favorite food is banana pop. She also has her 6 Ghostly Elixirs and a uniquely morbid personality—always relating things (even herself) to death and the darker aspects of life.

For me, the bond between Wendy and Abigail is the true core. They're twin sisters, and their connection goes beyond just mechanics. Abigail complements Wendy, but Wendy is more than just her ghostly companion. That's my perspective.

[Reiko24]

4 hours ago, Xplan said:

"DO NOT take exploits into consideration when talking about balance."

what a gorgeous claim

Things he said is just meaningless fancy words.

the FACT is any Walter player can make good use of it.

I don’t understand why taking UNINTENDED exploits that are BUGS into consideration when determining strength and balancing is common sense for you.

the mechanics that are exploits were unintended bugs, obviously the game should be balanced around what isn’t an ERROR in design

[Reiko24]

6 hours ago, SilverSpoon said:

I verified can not just tank but also kill gigants which were in the "Blessed Sisturn III is OP" video, Bearger, Deerclops, Crystal Deerclops, and Ancient Fuelweaver with "no effort" by Woodie's "Treeguard Feller II" and present screenshot evidence(plz look my posting history.)

And I have taken a video evidence, but I'm lazy so really don't want to edit it. And If the "video evidence" is ever referenced again, please someone instead me point out Treeguard idle because I now need my post approved by a moderator,

Woodie's treeguards killing bosses is cheese

[Jakepeng99]

28 minutes ago, Reiko24 said:

Woodie's treeguards killing bosses is cheese

Its not, mob vs mob violence is intended and core in dst from its early days.

 

[Reiko24]

27 minutes ago, Jakepeng99 said:

Its not, mob vs mob violence is intended and core in dst from its early days.

 

Sure, if three treeguards spawned and decided to help you with a Deerclops, but Woodie's treeguards are not natural mobs. Killing bosses with 50 treeguards is cheese.

[Mike23Ua]

29 minutes ago, Reiko24 said:

Sure, if three treeguards spawned and decided to help you with a Deerclops, but Woodie's treeguards are not natural mobs. Killing bosses with 50 treeguards is cheese.

No? Killing Bosses with 50 Treeguards is intended gameplay these days.. Plus You can throw silly moose punches and hmm let me think..

If I wanted to a could summon the Twins of Terror from the Terrarium and hide inside a bush hat while the only target it can find to fight nearby is Lunar Bearger.

I love how all the Wendy posts use Armored Bearger as their judgement boss, This particular boss is completely passive to the player unless you attack or provoke it, it’s something you never need to actually directly fight… If you just want the loot rewards from killing it, it’s a PASSIVE Mob that will ignore you exist, or even drop aggro and give you time to restore health, plant dynamite, kite it to a horde of Brightshades etc….

Anyone who is fighting an Armored Bearger in face to face confrontation is either doing so for the fun of the fight (highly unlikely?) or they’re doing it to stroke their ego of being able to do it.

Otherwise- You can passively chip away at him over long periods of time, and UNLIKE Dragonfly, his health won’t recover if you leave the area..?

But also: Anyone who has reached Lunar Bearger the intended way had to first kill several other bosses first and this (again passive…) boss shouldn’t be a huge threat to them if they made it that far?

[Debruh]

23 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

No? Killing Bosses with 50 Treeguards is intended gameplay these days.. Plus You can throw silly moose punches and hmm let me think..

If I wanted to a could summon the Twins of Terror from the Terrarium and hide inside a bush hat while the only target it can find to fight nearby is Lunar Bearger.

I love how all the Wendy posts use Armored Bearger as their judgement boss, This particular boss is completely passive to the player unless you attack or provoke it, it’s something you never need to actually directly fight… If you just want the loot rewards from killing it, it’s a PASSIVE Mob that will ignore you exist, or even drop aggro and give you time to restore health, plant dynamite, kite it to a horde of Brightshades etc….

Anyone who is fighting an Armored Bearger in face to face confrontation is either doing so for the fun of the fight (highly unlikely?) or they’re doing it to stroke their ego of being able to do it.

Otherwise- You can passively chip away at him over long periods of time, and UNLIKE Dragonfly, his health won’t recover if you leave the area..?

But also: Anyone who has reached Lunar Bearger the intended way had to first kill several other bosses first and this (again passive…) boss shouldn’t be a huge threat to them if they made it that far?

Pretty sure Armored bearger is inherently aggressive.

Agree with the rest of your points though 

[Mike23Ua]

9 minutes ago, Debruh said:

Pretty sure Armored bearger is inherently aggressive.

Agree with the rest of your points though 

Unless they patched it.. no. Armored Bearger only targets the player if the player has done something to provoke it.

(Attacking it, picking up food items it was trying to eat)

What players might not know however.. is what the Bearger is targeting.

It will ignore your bases existence if there’s no food in your base to steal: (Bee Boxes, Crockpot dishes, fridges of food)

Because UNLIKE Deerclops (I’m uncertain of Ice Clops) Bearger and his Lunar Variant are not designed to intentionally target and wreck up your base.

Now as far as things that could tick off a Lunar Bearger goes: Just picking up rot or plucking flower petals (both of which are food sources for him) can anger him.

Unless Klei patched it since I last tested it… you can literally stand right beside armored lunar bear and he won’t bother attacking you until you attack him (or if your playing as Wendy.. Abby attacks him)

[Debruh]

Just now, Mike23Ua said:

Unless they patched it.. no. Armored Bearger only targets the player if the player has done something to provoke it.

(Attacking it, picking up food items it was trying to eat)

What players might not know however.. is what the Bearger is targeting.

It will ignore your bases existence if there’s no food in your base to steal: (Bee Boxes, Crockpot dishes, fridges of food)

Because UNLIKE Deerclops (I’m uncertain of Ice Clops) Bearger and his Lunar Variant are not designed to intentionally target and wreck up your base.

Now as far as things that could tick off a Lunar Bearger goes: Just picking up rot or plucking flower petals (both of which are food sources for him) can anger him.

Unless Klei patched it since I last tested it… you can literally stand right beside armored lunar bear and he won’t bother attacking you until you attack him (or if your playing as Wendy.. Abby attacks him)

That's normal bearger that works like that

I was just doing him a few days ago to try and survive with Abby, and he naturally runs at ya. No items in the inventory aside from elixirs, void cowl reaper, walking cane, and mag

[Mike23Ua]

1 minute ago, Debruh said:

That's normal bearger that works like that

I was just doing him a few days ago to try and survive with Abby, and he naturally runs at ya. No items in the inventory aside from elixirs, void cowl reaper, walking cane, and mag

Did you have Abby on Riled mode? Try unsummoning Abby and standing near him. Unless Klei changed it since he was first released, Armored Bearger doesn’t aggressively target the player.

[Debruh]

Just now, Mike23Ua said:

Did you have Abby on Riled mode? Try unsummoning Abby and standing near him. Unless Klei changed it since he was first released, Armored Bearger doesn’t aggressively target the player.

Nope, she was away due to an attack command so she doesn't get hit by the ground pound

According to the wiki (wiki.gg), Crystal deerclops also doesn't target structures. So it seems like the mutated bosses don't really behave like their og counterparts. 

[Well-met]

1 hour ago, Mike23Ua said:

Unless they patched it.. no. Armored Bearger only targets the player if the player has done something to provoke it.

no

mutant bosses are corpses driven by the gestalt, they have no script or purpose other than to chase down mobs and players.

[Mike23Ua]

46 minutes ago, Well-met said:

no

mutant bosses are corpses driven by the gestalt, they have no script or purpose other than to chase down mobs and players.

It only chases you if you “provoke” it, if it did as you claim it does it would relentlessly chase you to the edges of the earth and won’t give up or lose interest in you.

But it doesn’t, it will drop aggro and go off to do its own thing at some point.

[Lee lol]

4小时前，Mike23Ua说：

除非他们修补了它..不。只有当玩家做了一些事情来挑衅它时，装甲熊才会针对玩家。

（攻击它，捡起它想吃的食物）

然而，玩家可能不知道的是，Bearger的目标是什么。

如果你的基地里没有食物可以偷，它将忽略你的基地的存在：（蜜蜂箱、炖锅盘子、食物冰箱）

因为与鹿瓣（我不确定冰瓣）不同，Bearger和他的Lunar Variant不是故意瞄准和破坏你的基地而设计的。

现在，就可能激怒月球携带者的事情而言：只是捡腐烂或摘花瓣（两者都是他的食物来源）就能激怒他。

除非Klei自从我上次测试它以来修补了它......你真的可以站在装甲月熊旁边，在你攻击它之前，它不会费心攻击你（或者如果你扮演Wendy..Abby攻击他）

You confused the armored bearger with the Bearger.

[Xplan]

9 hours ago, Reiko24 said:

I don’t understand why taking UNINTENDED exploits that are BUGS into consideration when determining strength and balancing is common sense for you.

the mechanics that are exploits were unintended bugs, obviously the game should be balanced around what isn’t an ERROR in design

it's not a bug.

walter's attack speed is too fast that AFW can't pull out Ancient Key. walter can just defeat it outside simply pressing F.

maybe you should urge Klei to nerf walter's Slingshot. you dont want a broken character. dont you ?

[WenericMember]

Why should you use potions other than cure all in this state? Cure all makes her practically immortal.

Why bother with team spirit? She can facetank.

Why pick lunar alignment? Youre sacrificing extra damage and Abbys already effectively mmortal.

It does not enhance Wendys gameplay identity in any way. 

 

But the main question is. If Abigail's immortal... Whats Wendy's downside?

Wolfgang has a sanity weakness. Maxwell has a lesser health capacity, as does willow with sanity. Wicker cant use some ofnthe easiest stat restoring methods.

Sure some of these are pretty minor. Bit if Abigail becomes immortal, Wendy will jave literally no weakness. If that's not a problem then theres no reason engaging in discussion.

 

[Steorra]

12 minutes ago, WenericMember said:

Why should you use potions other than cure all in this state? Cure all makes her practically immortal.

Why bother with team spirit? She can facetank.

Why pick lunar alignment? Youre sacrificing extra damage and Abbys already effectively mmortal.

It does not enhance Wendys gameplay identity in any way. 

 

But the main question is. If Abigail's immortal... Whats Wendy's downside?

Wolfgang has a sanity weakness. Maxwell has a lesser health capacity, as does willow with sanity. Wicker cant use some ofnthe easiest stat restoring methods.

Sure some of these are pretty minor. Bit if Abigail becomes immortal, Wendy will jave literally no weakness. If that's not a problem then theres no reason engaging in discussion.

 

She still has a downside for engaging shadow.

If you think this is not her downside, ok then what about to give her a skill which stop shadowbeak spawn from Wendy, or even let Wendy could dealt Vex effect to Shadows?

[Nikki Darks]

Honestly, my take on this whole player tag debate really is just:

If it's to stay, give it to Bernie as well! It's only fair. Unless the Wendy mains would like to argue that it'd be "too strong" or "OP"?

Or, only let Lunar Abby have the player tag, since she's the one that's meant to be used against bosses.

[Xplan]

2 minutes ago, Nikki Darks said:

Honestly, my take on this whole player tag debate really is just:

If it's to stay, give it to Bernie as well! It's only fair. Unless the Wendy mains would like to argue that it'd be "too strong" or "OP"?

Or, only let Lunar Abby have the player tag, since she's the one that's meant to be used against bosses.

I wont mind neither do other Wendy mains.

Maybe give Lunar Abi Plannar Entity too.

[Nikki Darks]

2 minutes ago, Xplan said:

I wont mind neither do other Wendy mains.

Maybe give Lunar Abi Plannar Entity too.

The OP of this post is actually against Bernie having it because it's be "too good". Hence why I added the sass to my post.

[Mike23Ua]

1 minute ago, Nikki Darks said:

Honestly, my take on this whole player tag debate really is just:

If it's to stay, give it to Bernie as well! It's only fair. Unless the Wendy mains would like to argue that it'd be "too strong" or "OP"?

Or, only let Lunar Abby have the player tag, since she's the one that's meant to be used against bosses.

Sure, give it to Bernie..? But at the same time, make crafting additional Abigail flowers serve an ACTUAL gameplay purpose.

Because as of right now, it only serves to craft them again if they’re stollen in PvP, a Catcoon does not pounce Wendy and then Eat the flower…

Abigails flower never needs to leave the players inventory for any reason.

Unlike Bernie, you don’t have to rush to the spot Abby just died in and pour an Elixer on her flower to revive her..

Wendys gameplay was made boring with her rework, and her skill tree only makes her even more overkill than she already was.

You don’t even need to have active flower petals (now we can store multiple TYPES by the way) fueling a Sisturn before Abigail’s flower will bloom back out, Atleast if Wurts Merm king starved to death, she looses the Merm king buffs.

But Wendy? Nah man she’s so mind numbingly easy that she should take Wilson’s place amongst the character roster as being the beginner character.

Klei needs to take this time during extended beta to- NERF Wendy (fairly of course…) give placing flowers in Sisturn or crafting multiple Abigail flowers a purpose.

We can give Bernie the same “player” tag Abby has, but can we PLEASE actually bring Abby down a peg or two in the process?

[Xplan]

Just now, Nikki Darks said:

The OP of this post is actually against Bernie having it because it's be "too good". Hence why I added the sass to my post.

Actually, he is not.

He is working hard on preventing Klei to nerf Abi's survival ability. by comparing Abi with Bernie and other followers.

[Nikki Darks]

14 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Sure, give it to Bernie..? But at the same time, make crafting additional Abigail flowers serve an ACTUAL gameplay purpose.

Because as of right now, it only serves to craft them again if they’re stollen in PvP, a Catcoon does not pounce Wendy and then Eat the flower…

Abigails flower never needs to leave the players inventory for any reason.

Unlike Bernie, you don’t have to rush to the spot Abby just died in and pour an Elixer on her flower to revive her..

Wendys gameplay was made boring with her rework, and her skill tree only makes her even more overkill than she already was.

You don’t even need to have active flower petals (now we can store multiple TYPES by the way) fueling a Sisturn before Abigail’s flower will bloom back out, Atleast if Wurts Merm king starved to death, she looses the Merm king buffs.

But Wendy? Nah man she’s so mind numbingly easy that she should take Wilson’s place amongst the character roster as being the beginner character.

Klei needs to take this time during extended beta to- NERF Wendy (fairly of course…) give placing flowers in Sisturn or crafting multiple Abigail flowers a purpose.

We can give Bernie the same “player” tag Abby has, but can we PLEASE actually bring Abby down a peg or two in the process?

The Wurt comparison is actually phenomenal. 

But the issue lies in her playerbase. People who just don't want to have to do anything, yet reap all the rewards. That's just what her mains are like.

I am just hoping Klei noticed this before making any final decisions.