Too many of Wurt's skills are... Eh..

[GhostyToasty]

I don't see many people talking about this, most posts are related to Winona, but.. 

 

Way too many of Wurt's skills just... Suck. The entire mosquito path is bad, because mosquitos are incredibly weak mobs, and making things like fertilizer doesn't fit Wurt's playstyle OR personality (she literally hates farming!) not to mention skills like swamp pathfinder. Wurt is mainly a solo character, due to how many resources she needs, and always needing to be near a swamp. Even IF someone used her in multi-player, nobody besides her is gonna base at swamp, so it's useless. 

 

None of these skills are fixing Wurt's main issues.

 

1- how long it takes her to build all these merm buildings 

 

2- not being able to be brought over to the caves. 

 

There has to be some solution to those problems, because those are the things that make wurt outclassed by Maxwell. Please, Klei. We don't need more useless skills like a healing item that only heals one merm at a time, or a tiny sanity gain for a character with 200 sanity and a free tophat effect just by holding fish

[Mozheikich]

Wurt was OP even before that. I think extra health and merm buffs its huge.

Compare, for example, what she cand and what Webber can. She is way better than him.

Or how about Wilson or Wolfgang skills. They are so pure. 

I think if Klei give every character OP skill tree then DST don't be so funny anymore. I love Willow and I've been wishing for a long time that Klei would give her something, but they did too much.

[arubaro]

3 hours ago, GhostyToasty said:

Even IF someone used her in multi-player, nobody besides her is gonna base at swamp, so it's useless. 

Do you know you can place swamp turf anywhere? so this perk is to make it useful for other players. Usually only solo wurt players use swamp as cobblestone but with that skill point, that perk can work in multiplayer 

3 hours ago, GhostyToasty said:

or a tiny sanity gain for a character with 200 sanity and a free tophat effect just by holding fish

The sanity gain can stack with the fish and cloths... you can get more hits from CC crown by stacking 4 sanity reg buffs (head, body, fish and wetness)

3 hours ago, GhostyToasty said:

how long it takes her to build all these merm buildings 

That is not a problem, that is the cost of becoming one of the strongest characters

3 hours ago, GhostyToasty said:

not being able to be brought over to the caves

Technical limitation, nothing to do with perks

Also will be weird to have that via a skill tree instead of by default 

3 hours ago, GhostyToasty said:

There has to be some solution to those problems, because those are the things that make wurt outclassed by Maxwell

They are played differently,  this is not a moba. Both are worth the try

Anyways, maxwell is imba and wurt is close 

[Mysterious box]

3 hours ago, Mozheikich said:

Wurt was OP even before that. I think extra health and merm buffs its huge.

Compare, for example, what she cand and what Webber can. She is way better than him.

Or how about Wilson or Wolfgang skills. They are so pure. 

I think if Klei give every character OP skill tree then DST don't be so funny anymore. I love Willow and I've been wishing for a long time that Klei would give her something, but they did too much.

Wurt wasn't really op before the skill tree when you get down to it the main thing that makes people think that is watching her demolish certain bosses with merm guards but that setup took a massive amount of time and many times bunnymen could do the exact same thing and were something anyone could use. Something Wurt really suffered from was despite how much work you put into her followers were at best abit above average when compared to other normal and character exclusive followers. The skill tree's goal in the merm buffs seemed to be mainly focused on making them more unique compared to other followers as well as trying to help them catch up to Maxwell in the resource game.

When it came to resource harvesting Maxwell was straight up better than her peak performance right out of spawn and that was a problem for a character you'd be hours in to get a worse result.

As for Webber I won't compare him to current Wurt as it's unfair since he doesn't have his skill tree yet but he competes in different ways pre skill tree Webber can kill many bosses with spiders using less overal minions that Wurt did because of nurses making his followers a invincible wall that dps checks bosses. Webber's niche is that he offers the most relaxed follower experience due to their infinite loyalty as well as being able to carry them. Add to the fact spiders exist in every main area in the game and you should nearly always have access to more spiders.

[ShadowDuelist]

4 hours ago, GhostyToasty said:

not being able to be brought over to the caves. 

I think this is her biggest problem. Because even if your progression goes slow, you could still slowly but steadily take care of your small army, taking them with you wherever you go.
Even in casual short public games she will be able to build at least 3-4 merm houses in the first few autimn days, with the feeder she will be able to have them out at all times, but losing them when you change shards is the biggest downside of her whole gameplay.

[Mozheikich]

6 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

Wurt wasn't really op before the skill tree when you get down to it the main thing that makes people think that is watching her demolish certain bosses with merm guards.

Even without merms she has best stats in the game(except WX maybe) 250 HP 250 hunger 200 sanity

Immune to wetness

Immune to frogs 

Immune to drowning in the Ocean

Fish give her sanity

Even books give her sanity 

Speed boost in swamp

AND ALSO have strong merms.

Compere this to Webber 

[Mozheikich]

6 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

As for Webber I won't compare him to current Wurt as it's unfair since he doesn't have his skill tree yet but he competes in different ways pre skill tree Webber can kill many bosses with spiders using less overal minions that Wurt did because of nurses making his followers a invincible wall that dps checks bosses. Webber's niche is that he offers the most relaxed follower experience due to their infinite loyalty as well as being able to carry them. Add to the fact spiders exist in every main area in the game and you should nearly always have access to more spiders.

I love Webber but he isn't he strongest characters. 

His spiders isn't that good(weak, low HP, eat your food, cant chop tree or mine stone)

Also he have garbage Sainty 

Beard is cool 

[Dr.Webber]

14 hours ago, GhostyToasty said:

not being able to be brought over to the caves. 

I’m sure this was Qol’d in the beta

[HeatAndRun]

13 hours ago, ShadowDuelist said:

losing them when you change shards is the biggest downside of her whole gameplay.

I would gladly put all fifteen skill points if I could bring merms between shards

[Dextops]

17 hours ago, Mozheikich said:

Wurt was OP even before that. I think extra health and merm buffs its huge.

wurt is not and has never been op. Needing to put in tons of work and effort to get something is quite literally the opposite of being OP. and for wurt, imho, the payoff is rarely worth it. I fully agree with OP here because a bunch of these skills just aren't anything useful and need to direly be switched.

[Mysterious box]

6 hours ago, Mozheikich said:

Even without merms she has best stats in the game(except WX maybe) 250 HP 250 hunger 200 sanity

After making a merm king which is not only a time investment but requires additional resources to maintain on a stationary target.

6 hours ago, Mozheikich said:

Immune to wetness

Before the skill tree she still froze which made this mostly useless until you got the seasonal fish.

 

6 hours ago, Mozheikich said:

Immune to frogs

There are very few frog spawners in a world and frog rain only happens in one season even then most people just use frog rain to their advantage anyway to which they don't need to be neutral to accomplish.

6 hours ago, Mozheikich said:

Immune to drowning in the Ocean

I mean how often are you really drowning?

6 hours ago, Mozheikich said:

Fish give her sanity

It's neat but nothing amazing.

6 hours ago, Mozheikich said:

Even books give her sanity 

situational as it requires you to either setup a bookcase and books then switch to wurt or have a wicker in your world.

6 hours ago, Mozheikich said:

Speed boost in swamp

Until the skill tree which added the mudslinger this didn't really come up as much as it should unless you based in the swamp or specifically setup swamp arenas for boss fights.

6 hours ago, Mozheikich said:

Compere this to Webber 

 

6 hours ago, Mozheikich said:

I love Webber but he isn't he strongest characters. 

His spiders isn't that good(weak, low HP, eat your food, cant chop tree or mine stone)

Also he have garbage Sainty 

Beard is cool 

Okay I will

 Nurse Spider

400 hp

Spitter

350 hp

Spider Warrior

400 hp

These are just their base hp each nurse you have with you can make a aoe healing pulse which heals all spiders in that area for 150 hp how in the world is this low hp? Even Abigail only has 600 hp and this is a horde. To further put this to rest any boss or mob who can't clear these spider's entire hp cannot kill them as there is no limit to how many times a nurse can heal.

Webby Whistle

Using the whistle also calls off any friendly spiders from what they're currently attacking, allowing the player to quickly withdraw their allies from a potentially dangerous or unwanted combat situation. Wurt can't do this and this does matter in a ton of scenarios.

 

Friendly Spiders hearing the whistle will not attempt to eat meat items temporarily, allowing the player to save some or all of the meat from bigger animals if timed well. If they ate your food it's because you didn't manage them well Webber has a much greater degree of control over his followers but in exchange requires you to manage them so they don't step out of line.

7 hours ago, Mozheikich said:

Also he have garbage Sainty 

Passively makes the materials for a tophat and can sleep in spider dens for free to recover stats which makes bringing a spider den to the ruins or any place you intend to spend a bit of time at really powerful as it's a bed and breakfast.

Another thing to add is Webber's followers don't have a maintenance cost which makes him feel much safer than most any survivor the moment he sets up which is generally in the first few days. 

What I'm getting from this is your not very experienced with how to make the best use of Webber and his abilities and there's nothing wrong with that the thing is Wurt and Webber just excel in different ways. 

[Theukon-dos]

I don't really have enough experience with Wurt or her skill tree to really comment on it. Hence why I left it out of my post talking about the update. But I do think it's pretty weird conceptually how so much of Wurt's skill tree is about buffing herself.

 

Usually in games, the point of a summoner character is that they're very weak on their own, and bolster their strength with their minions. Even in DS/T itself, Wendy has a damage penelty that she offsets by summoning abigail. And Webber has a moderately low sanity, plus being a monster makes him attacked by creatures that would normally benefit the player.

I know Wurt already didn't do this. She has average stats even without the KOTM active, and being a merm means that only pigs are hostile towards her instead of pigs, bunnymen, and catcoons. But I still think it's a bit off-kilter to double down on that and make Wurt herself a juggernaut instead of making her more reliant on merm armies.

 

[Theukon-dos]

11 hours ago, SSneaky said:

Amphibian tree could be more utility focused, with (especially) noncombat action speed and (mabye?) movement speed buffs according to her wetness instead of defensive buffs.

Perhaps even the ability to water garden tiles and withered plants when wet enough?

That's also a good option. I could also see it having some sailing perks. Though that is definitely more due to personal bias than anything.