Hydrogen Generator must be removed.

[Genry]

This generator infuriates me, it breaks the game.
When you get oxygen from the lyser, you get energy.
You don't need a nuclear reactor, a coal reactor, you don't need anything.
I suggest removing it from the game and replacing it with:
Hydrogen burner.
Requires 60 watts and destroys hydrogen.
EVERYONE WILL BE MUCH MORE PLEASANT TO PLAY. Klei, please.

[SharraShimada]

And again someone wants something removed, because he just cant just dont use it. 

And here´s the same answer to you, like for everone else: NO

Dont like it? Dont use it. Period.

[Genry]

15 hours ago, SharraShimada said:

And again someone wants something removed, because he just cant just dont use it. 

And here´s the same answer to you, like for everone else: NO

Dont like it? Dont use it. Period.

I don’t know how to use? What are you talking about?
Did you read what I wrote?

1 minute ago, Genry said:

I don’t know how to use? What are you talking about?
Did you read what I wrote?

I can’t not use it, so I need to put hydrogen from the lizer somewhere. What kind of nonsense you wrote.

If I make a lizer, even a lazy lizer with a filter, I get 800/1600 watts, and I spend 720. And there are systems without a filter.
You get both oxygen and energy from scratch. Adding an incinerator will increase the energy cost, making the electrolyzer energy costly. This will give other energy sources more value.

[SharraShimada]

Yes i´ve read what you posted. And my statement remains. If you dont like the hydrogen generator: dont use it. Just vent the hydrogen elsewhere or into space. You´re welcome.

No one will delete this generator, just because you dont like it.

[Genry]

15 hours ago, SharraShimada said:

Yes i´ve read what you posted. And my statement remains. If you dont like the hydrogen generator: dont use it. Just vent the hydrogen elsewhere or into space. You´re welcome.

No one will delete this generator, just because you dont like it.

Come on? I also wrote the reasons why this generator is not needed in the game. Did you just see that I don't like it?
Just throw it into space?
Lol, what if I play on an asteroid with a lava cap, where there is no algae? Also, do not use a generator? But it's okay that it is built into the game mechanics. And why should I not use it if it's part of the official gameplay?

4 minutes ago, Genry said:

Come on? I also wrote the reasons why this generator is not needed in the game. Did you just see that I don't like it?
Just throw it into space?
Lol, what if I play on an asteroid with a lava cap, where there is no algae? Also, do not use a generator? But it's okay that it is built into the game mechanics. And why should I not use it if it's part of the official gameplay?

I will use it as the gameplay developer intended. I play his game with his rules. I am not going to limit myself in game things if game mechanics are built on them.
With the same success, I can say, well, do not use a computer mouse if it is not convenient for you, because you have claws instead of hands?
Your logic is great.

[pether]

33 minutes ago, Genry said:

I will use it as the gameplay developer intended.

I'm pretty sure devs intended the game to be fun. Some people need hydrogen generator to feel comfortable in their games. If you are not having fun, don't use it. If you want to get rid of hydrogen without the generator, crush it with airlock doors. You can connect them to power if you fear the game is too easy without power requirement for everything you do.

[Genry]

52 minutes ago, pether said:

I'm pretty sure devs intended the game to be fun. Some people need hydrogen generator to feel comfortable in their games. If you are not having fun, don't use it. If you want to get rid of hydrogen without the generator, crush it with airlock doors. You can connect them to power if you fear the game is too easy without power requirement for everything you do.

I don’t know what they wanted and no one knows except the developers, I see this:

1) The game sets the main tasks:
-Find food
-Get oxygen.
-Get electricity.

We have solar panels that require a significant investment in research, they need to be built in large numbers and require a building to get the material to build them, as well as access to space and a lot of time to build them. And they also require the construction of batteries.

We have a nuclear reactor that provides a huge amount of energy and requires a contribution to research.

And we have a hydrogen generator, which we get at the very beginning of the game, and given that there is an inadequate amount of water on the asteroid (3 basic asteroid ones in DLC), we build a lazy room with 2-3 generators and get 2 kilowatts of energy from them on an indefinite basis. Because we have a lizer, which gives us both infinite oxygen and energy, which is enough for 150 cycles.
This completely kills coal generators, natural generators, and other types of generators in the early stages of the game.
And in the later we increase the amperage with the help of solar panels.

We do not need a nuclear reactor, because there is enough energy already.

What's so funny?
It's fun to solve problems, look for resources, it's fun when you have a limited amount of resources and you need to develop.

I'm not happy because when I find a water geyser I get oxygen + energy + food.
And since when do people need a comfortable game?
This is a relatively niche product, albeit a popular one. Those who play it do not need comfort, people need balanced difficulty.

Games like dark souls, LWOTC are adequately complex and incredibly entertaining.
This game is from this breed, people who play it a lot do not experience any difficulties, the rest of the people who do not like the game will not understand it and will go to play other games, because the game, as I said, is niche (for a certain audience).This game such a genre.

1 hour ago, pether said:

I'm pretty sure devs intended the game to be fun. Some people need hydrogen generator to feel comfortable in their games. If you are not having fun, don't use it. If you want to get rid of hydrogen without the generator, crush it with airlock doors. You can connect them to power if you fear the game is too easy without power requirement for everything you do.

Replacing the hydrogen generator will make you spend more conventional coal, make you quickly master technology and space, other planets.
Because coal is spent faster, and lizer does not provide energy, but requires it on the contrary.
The lack of energy will provoke people to build a nuclear reactor, so this completely eliminates the energy shortage.

It is much more interesting and more fun, the gameplay will change for the better.
But there is ONE building that kills a whole bunch of game mechanics, over which the developer tried and implemented into the game.
Is this fair?

6 minutes ago, Genry said:

I don’t know what they wanted and no one knows except the developers, I see this:

1) The game sets the main tasks:
-Find food
-Get oxygen.
-Get electricity.

We have solar panels that require a significant investment in research, they need to be built in large numbers and require a building to get the material to build them, as well as access to space and a lot of time to build them. And they also require the construction of batteries.

We have a nuclear reactor that provides a huge amount of energy and requires a contribution to research.

And we have a hydrogen generator, which we get at the very beginning of the game, and given that there is an inadequate amount of water on the asteroid (3 basic asteroid ones in DLC), we build a lazy room with 2-3 generators and get 2 kilowatts of energy from them on an indefinite basis. Because we have a lizer, which gives us both infinite oxygen and energy, which is enough for 150 cycles.
This completely kills coal generators, natural generators, and other types of generators in the early stages of the game.
And in the later we increase the amperage with the help of solar panels.

We do not need a nuclear reactor, because there is enough energy already.

What's so funny?
It's fun to solve problems, look for resources, it's fun when you have a limited amount of resources and you need to develop.

I'm not happy because when I find a water geyser I get oxygen + energy + food.
And since when do people need a comfortable game?
This is a relatively niche product, albeit a popular one. Those who play it do not need comfort, people need balanced difficulty.

Games like dark souls, LWOTC are adequately complex and incredibly entertaining.
This game is from this breed, people who play it a lot do not experience any difficulties, the rest of the people who do not like the game will not understand it and will go to play other games, because the game, as I said, is niche (for a certain audience).This game such a genre.

Replacing the hydrogen generator will make you spend more conventional coal, make you quickly master technology and space, other planets.
Because coal is spent faster, and lizer does not provide energy, but requires it on the contrary.
The lack of energy will provoke people to build a nuclear reactor, so this completely eliminates the energy shortage.

It is much more interesting and more fun, the gameplay will change for the better.
But there is ONE building that kills a whole bunch of game mechanics, over which the developer tried and implemented into the game.
Is this fair?

Yes, let them at least add to the plot features.
Replacing the generator with an incinerator.
It does not require much time, and everyone will be pleased.

[SharraShimada]

Please, stop complaining. Thats all you´re doing. The devs made the generator, and its staying. Period. End of discussion (for me). And if you go on with it, i will just put you on the ignore list.

[Genry]

Is this site your private room?
You apparently consider yourself the navel of the earth, you don’t like what I wrote, so why did you answer? I didn’t write this topic to you personally, as it were.

[NeoDeusMachina]

1 hour ago, Genry said:

Is this site your private room?
You apparently consider yourself the navel of the earth, you don’t like what I wrote, so why did you answer? I didn’t write this topic to you personally, as it were.

No, but the tone in this thread is so tense that I would not be surprised if I was not the only one who did not feel like contributing anything constructive to it. So I read both your opinions and I was so drained that this is all I could convince myself to write.

[blueberry pi]

Let's say the hydrogen generator is gone. What will happen to the hydrogen incentive in growing Saturn Critter traps (which you mostly grow for hydrogen)? Or the extra energy of plug slugs in the form of hydrogen? Or the hydrogen vent?  Those are reasons this generator is needed. If it's gone then these fun and interesting options for energy will be gone or harmed.

Now let's talk electrolyzers. If you build them correctly you get extra power with your oxygen. To build an efficient electrolyzer setup that will make power instead of consuming, you need a bit of knowledge, about automation or filters and you are working on a budget to make a profit with power. This is a reward for learning (bypassed by using a tutorial but that's another matter) you make a good system you get power with your oxygen instead of using power. It's making you think about what you make to progress and change your sources of power for other things. Good game design.

Power costs: a one electrolyzer setup in the best case is gonna need three pumps, which are gonna run like two pumps but sort the gasses without filters. That would be 600 watts. The hydrogen you get makes you 896 watts if you burn it all, 296 watts extra. Now this thing is generating heat, for a simple design you use an Anti entropy thermo-nullifier to cool it down, it uses 10 gs of hydrogen, so your power generation goes down to 816 watts, 216 watts extra and oxygen for water, you need a pump for water, 48 watts extra to the costs, 168 extra watts of power, cool oxygen and a happy player with skills to keep growing.

This is just a point to the debate, but thanks for listening.

 

[Genry]

16 hours ago, blueberry pi said:

Let's say the hydrogen generator is gone. What will happen to the hydrogen incentive in growing Saturn Critter traps (which you mostly grow for hydrogen)? Or the extra energy of plug slugs in the form of hydrogen? Or the hydrogen vent?  Those are reasons this generator is needed. If it's gone then these fun and interesting options for energy will be gone or harmed.

Now let's talk electrolyzers. If you build them correctly you get extra power with your oxygen. To build an efficient electrolyzer setup that will make power instead of consuming, you need a bit of knowledge, about automation or filters and you are working on a budget to make a profit with power. This is a reward for learning (bypassed by using a tutorial but that's another matter) you make a good system you get power with your oxygen instead of using power. It's making you think about what you make to progress and change your sources of power for other things. Good game design.

Power costs: a one electrolyzer setup in the best case is gonna need three pumps, which are gonna run like two pumps but sort the gasses without filters. That would be 600 watts. The hydrogen you get makes you 896 watts if you burn it all, 296 watts extra. Now this thing is generating heat, for a simple design you use an Anti entropy thermo-nullifier to cool it down, it uses 10 gs of hydrogen, so your power generation goes down to 816 watts, 216 watts extra and oxygen for water, you need a pump for water, 48 watts extra to the costs, 168 extra watts of power, cool oxygen and a happy player with skills to keep growing.

This is just a point to the debate, but thanks for listening.

 

Hydrogen from snails, as I understand it, was introduced into the game not to generate energy, but to obtain hydrogen as a material. For drecons, for example.
Flycatcher. You are right. I forgot about it.
The electrolyser does not require cooling, you seal the two pumps and the filter in thermal insulation, and cool the electrolyzer itself with a pipe circuit with water, which also enters it.
I make 4 rooms with 4 electrolyzers, where the last room fills the other 3 rooms to the maximum pressure in the pipes.
It turns out 2 pipes for duplicants, 1 pipe for suits and refueling rockets.
There is no need for cooling. The pump that pumps water is already necessary for other things, it should not be taken into account.
So it turns out the pump + pump + filter = 720 watts. The generator gives 1600 watts under acceleration.
20 duplicants breathe on 880w*2 pipes + the value for adding the maximum pressure in the pipes.
We get 2000Wt.
I use the filter, because I like it better,the system is more flexible and stable, and even more electricity can be obtained in systems without a filter.

It's too strong early on in the game.
Removing the generator is a radical method, and if I were a developer, I would replace it, but you can simply move the generator to higher technologies.
Or weaken the increase in electricity from 800W to 600W.

We have a wood burner that provides almost no energy, but requires a lot of conditions, and here the hydrogen generator is 800 watts from the very beginning of the game, absolutely clean and environmentally friendly.
It's just an imbalance.