Combat/boss overhaul

[MondayNight]

51 minutes ago, Spirit Glow said:

Do you happen to have link on where this info exists? I can't seem to find this specific statistic you mention.

The only Forge 1 Stats link still active is this one: Home Forge Stats. Is missing data, graphics and some animations I believe. Take what I wrote with some grains of salt because 5 years passed, but I distinctively remember bulk player-base wins was some shockingly low percentage - that's why it peaked my attention a la "wow, general populace was THAT bad, huh?!". Perhaps @minespatch has some print-screens or adjacent data saved since I know he's passionate about archiving DS/T related content and maybe is willing to share some (ty in advance, btw, for any potential input on this, mines).

[minespatch]

4 minutes ago, x0-VERSUS-1y said:

Perhaps @minespatch has some print-screens

@Deerclops Mikawould be more your guy on this. He's been doing a ton of archiving on the wiki.

[Mysterious box]

8 hours ago, x0-VERSUS-1y said:

Bulk player-base en large hardly learns kiting patterns - usually most people just sit there, taking it like a champ tanking like a Wigfrid-main. If anything Forge showed, that's bulk players were quite bad even in those short, recurring 8-10 minutes play sessions. If I recall well, only ~2% of all those many thousands of players running around in Pugna's arena actually reached the end, beating its champions (KLei published some statistics when Forge 1 came to a close). On-and-on-and-on going at the same 8 minutes routine and still not managing to learn. Now extrapolate such complex fighting mechanics in Survival worlds, where casuals need to also brave the darkness, hunger, sanity, hostiles, temperatures etc - in cumulative manner. I reckon end result will be even more disappointing, with DST drop-rates way higher than present. And don't forget the sweet Dunning-Kruger effect where vast mass of low-skilled people over-estimate their performance, even demanding harder conditions for a complete hilarity of all these shenanigans. My pov is DST fighting mechanic should remain as-is, simple in appearance but rather complex through the sheer mass of foes and their combat particularities.

This is more or less what I expected it doesn't help that the game is heading in a direction where the game encourages you less and less to travel, punishes you less for mistakes(mostly because of griefers), proactively pushes characters who intentionally trivialize mechanics I wouldn't be shocked if you told me the average player is alot worse at the game than before that being said changing the combat system doesn't necessarily mean it has to become harder if it can become more engaging more people may attempt to learn it.

[Yuuko]

I think combat is pretty good, and there is expression in combat - its just done on the level of either character choice (wanda, wolfgang, wendy, etc) or in tool choice and prep (glass axe, weather pain, pan flute, walls, allies, etc.)  Even in multiplayer the fights are good.

The game gets a bad rap from some people who say a lot of the combat is repetitive and easy, especially when combined with multiplayer - or that some situations are too hard, especially when solo - but I think these cherry pick bad examples while ignoring the good ones and use this to try and hold the game to an unrealistic expectation.  The game doesn't have to have every single combat be some crazy interaction, or to be a very simple process to solo.

Its OKAY to "cheese" a boss by building walls, preping allies, using tools etc - and its okay for a boss to be overwhelmed by 12 players very quickly.  What's important is only that the same answer doesn't work for every boss, and in that way DST holds up pretty well.

tbh - I really wish Klei would quit trying to fix the cheese in the game.  idk who in Klei has been on one, but stuff like making Klaus walk over his sack is just a waste of dev time.