The lack of a Downside.

[HowlVoid]

1 hour ago, Flarezen said:

Or just eat red caps since you still lose sanity with monster meat while red caps are carrots for wormwood 

I usually want the sanity drop so I can start getting nightmare fuel. The sooner I have a shadow manipulator, the sooner I have a bat bat and darkswords prototypes. 

Sanity is the easiest thing for Wormwood to replace thanks to the high amount of random seeds that drop early game.

That's why I called it a synergy, it helps in regards to many aspects in the early game in any given playthrough. What's more spiders drop many useful resources for him so the mm comes naturally.

[PetulantPansy]

He does lack a downside, but I'd argue that WX is one of the most challenging characters in the cast if the rework sticks. I don't think there are any other characters whose own crafts require boss kills (multiple of them). I'm not sure if challenging is the right word. Maybe "advanced" would be a better fit. A beginner won't be able to benefit from all the crafts of WX (even in their 5th year of their 10th playthrough if they don't know what they're doing). 

 

It's not just beating bosses. I'm not sure if Jimmy has been fixed but getting a boss scan with Jimmy is a bit tedious. I know it's a 1 time thing but still. 

 

You look at public servers and most of them don't make it past the first year. It's not easy to unlock all of WX's circuits in the first year (actually impossible with the bearger tuft). 

[TheDoctor11220]

You already have plenty of characters that have downsides. This change doesn't remove a characer which previously had downsides, WX has always had only the water as a downside and it's still like that. The character refresh isn't supposed to make him a different character entirely. Not every character needs to have major downsides (also defining what a "major" downside isn't even that straightforward even from just reading this thread, it depends on the player).

[Copyafriend]

10 hours ago, reallychina said:

Does this make the game worse? Yes, but that doesn't seem to be an issue for them.

Not worse, just different. I prefer really hard games and dont starve is becoming less hard at the beginning, but thats okay because most downsides were honestly just inconveniences. Except for willow, she always burned down her own base with her downsides. 

my point is, yeah they lost their downsides, but most downsides didnt change the characters in a meaningful or interesting way, just in an annoying way that you had to deal with.

[Szczuku]

I fully agree that a good downside is what keeps me interested in a character most of the time, hence why 2 of my oldest worlds are Wormwood and Wurt.

My idea for Wx-78's downside:

Everything that they eat has to be slowly absorbed (as in their chemical engine needs time to work), all of the food's stats are slowly (faster than jellybeans but not too fast) absorbed 1 by 1 (first hunger, then health, then sanity).

Idk if its a 'playstyle-defining' downside but it could force the player to think ahead if they should start healing durring a bossfight as they'll have to wait for hunger first and to pay extra attention to dodging while their stats are slowly absorbing. Also 'use-type' healing no longer affects Wx 

[Mike23Ua]

I think downsides are just as important as upsides and I can use a whole bunch of other non DS games as references that point to that: 

State Of Decay 2- You got an Excellent Cook/Medic but she has only one good lung so her Stamina is like 20% you KNOW she’s not good at taking out on scavenging runs but you keep her around to heal up everyone else.

Tainted Grail: Conquest- I’m currently playing through this game as BloodMage class, this class has to sacrifice portions of their own health bar to summon & promote minions, You only get small returns in the Health you sacrificed whenever you sacrifice the Golem that protects you from enemy damage, removing the Golem from the battle to heal portions of your health with the Risk that Without them to intercept incoming damage: You could be in a world of hurt.

Many RPGs, MOBA’s and Open world sandbox survival games utilize these upsides with downsides mechanics..

They make you actually have to think strategically & decide if the Risk is worth the Reward.

Just like chopping down a tree in hamlet for food/wood to be meet by a Scorpion or cutting down a palm tree in Shipwrecked for its Coconuts to enrage palm tree guardians,  or trying to gather Vines/Bamboo for a new boat in Shipwrecked only for a snake to jump out the bush after you.

Even WANDA is a prime example in this risk vs reward mechanic… 

And Without that feeling in a Open world Uncompromising survival sandbox game- it just makes characters feel overpowered and bland..

also their is sort of a psychological connection between you as the player, and the character your playing as: for example- Knowing that my Cook/Medic only has 20% Stamina I take a hell of a lot of extra caution in fighting to keep her Alive, and when I am forced to take her out on scavenger runs, I play the game more cautiously & want to keep her alive.

[Well-met]

being wet should give wx harsher penalties

[Mike23Ua]

51 minutes ago, Well-met said:

being wet should give wx harsher penalties

As of the new update, it does now