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Throwing some ideas for Wigfrid refresh


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First of all, Wigfrid is mini Bee Queen now:lol:. Both can sing a song that can cause mob to panic, except Bee Queen's song cannot be interrupt by being hit and Bee Queen has a song that boost its follower movement speed and attack speed, wouldn't it be nice to have it on our Wigfrid.

Thought out my testing I notice the meter as it fill up, progressively require more hits to do so.

Here I would like to suggest  to add songs that can only be use on second slot and third slot, while not changing what is already added to the game. I would categorise them as tier 1, 2 & 3. Songs that are more powerful it couldn't be perform in the early stage of battle(or early stage of performance), it can only be perform in the heat of the battle, especially on tier 3 songs I would consider them the "Ultimate". Those Ultimate are unlock when Wigfrid hits the third meter and will consume certain amount of meter upon usage. In the current version there's only two song that consume meter to perform, however due to meter progressively harder to build it is easier to not have any buffs just so you could refill and use it again. Currently those two songs are not worth to spam with though. And currently a fully filled up meter doesn't do anything, having tier 3 song provide a use and refill instead of "I'm full there is nothing I can gain from this"

Some idea would be, buff X for X seconds, restore X upon each use

 

Also I find it hard to believe a renown performer cannot perform a song without holding the lyrics, did she also read from the script as well while on stage? Maybe add an option to right click "eat" the script literally, to remember that song word by word as she eats it. Then she can perform it later with an icon without taking the inventory space. And eating another lyrics would replace the existing one as favorite.

 

Just throwing some of my ideas out

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Something a lot of people don't take into consideration when thinking about character balance is that even if one of their abilities isn't super amazing / game changing, doesn't mean they aren't balanced. Even if you think wigfrids songs are weak and need changes / buffs, Wigfrid is still a good character without them. That means buffing her songs is just getting her closer to being op. Not every perk needs to be treated like it's the characters only ability.

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120 hunger and an inability to eat honey. Coupled with the fact she's not even 2nd best at crowd control. Try like..... 4th or 5th best at it. And the solo bee queen... it could be a stretch to even say she's 3rd best. She may even be 4th. Idk. People who say she's "balanced"

They're overrating wigfrid. She's a fun character, but she's not powerful enough to be on the same league as your strong picks

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1 hour ago, PrezPara said:

Something a lot of people don't take into consideration when thinking about character balance is that even if one of their abilities isn't super amazing / game changing, doesn't mean they aren't balanced. Even if you think wigfrids songs are weak and need changes / buffs, Wigfrid is still a good character without them. That means buffing her songs is just getting her closer to being op. Not every perk needs to be treated like it's the characters only ability.

You would think that she can buffs her peers damage output like in forge, but no no no think of the balance. 

With how the meter is as of now I think most will settle with 1 buffs consider how easy to reach it and how quick it deplete once its outside battle.

There is no point aiming for second buffs really. You'd lose the inventory space to carry a second song. Reduce sanity loss might be a thing, but that's all this refresh can offer, 2 songs.

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Everyone is a strong character at this point. Wigfrid solo misses out. And what she does well on a team... doesn't really matter when the whole entire team is cooperating. 

A group of almost any characters can cooperate to make wigfrid's buffs redundant. I want wigfrid to have a better time during her day to day business with a more generous allowance to use her songs that aren't boss fights. 

I think wigfrid isn't strong enough to compensate for her fussy stomach that can't go as long as other characters without eating who is FORCED into long feed animations because all she can eat is meat

3 minutes ago, WimpyWolfgang said:

You would think that she can buffs her peers damage output like in forge, but no no no think of the balance. 

 

She does buff her peers now, but I really don't think it counts for that much. The power of teamwork is so strong, that it doesn't need wigfrid's buffs. 

4 minutes ago, WimpyWolfgang said:

With how the meter is as of now I think most will settle with 1 buffs consider how easy to reach it and how quick it deplete once its outside battle.

 

If what your saying is for Wigfrid to have a meter that runs out slower, I agree with it. But I'm not sure because of your wording.

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@chirsg Quite right, in terms of cooperating boss fight. 1 Wortox with 20 souls + 1 stack of butterfly is enough for everyone to hold F and kill almost all bosses without much strategy. This bundle of songs is too insufficient that makes them redundant to the other superior methods.

Making the meter drain slower would encourage player aim for more then 1 buffs

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1 hour ago, WimpyWolfgang said:

1 Wortox with 20 souls + 1 stack of butterfly

that equals killing 20 things first then catching another 20 butterflies and losing dps mid fight to drop souls constantly and staying grouped up enough so everyone gets healed (for every boss fight). Meanwhile Heartrending needs 1 papyrus 1 pen 1 life giving amulet and u can use it forever and nothing about the fight changes u get hp as you attack. And everyone is also carrying at least 2 battle helmets, something wortox cannot provide. 

 

1 hour ago, WimpyWolfgang said:

Making the meter drain slower would encourage player aim for more then 1 buffs

if u cant manage to stack more than 1 buff in a boss fight you're doing something wrong. Non-boss fights dont call for buffs because with Wigfrids innate damage boost they'll be over before u can make any use of the sustained buffs. 

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Well.. my harsh criticism aside for the current state of Wigfrids rework- I really only wanted her to get something new.. unique and fun, the songs are okay.. BUT should have released ALONGSIDE some new perks for Wigfrid- even if perks were “just for fun” and not actually meant to be about those super nerdy Stats people keep talking about. 
 

Plain and Simple: I Do NOT play ANY video game to sit around comparing stats of weapons and armors (sorry never liked RPG’s and I Never Will..) 

You guys are trying to turn an open world sandbox survival game into a game all about numbers and hard stats- and that’s when it’s going to fall flat on its face.

Just look at how many SKINS Spears have compared to literally every other (Insert Superior Weapon here) weapon- Which is really why I wish they would buff Spears to not be as ineffective as they actually are.. but that’s a topic for another thread.

My point is- Most of Wigfrids rework is all about hard numbers and stats through her song scrolls, where as .... Woodies Moose from to wreck spiders in a brand new way may have had (behind the scenes) stats involved- But no one actually saw those stats in such a bluntly obvious way.. what they saw was a cool new Form with Brand new Abilities to smash spiders with.
I didn’t expect Wigfrid to become anymore OP then she already was, but I TOTALLY expected her to get some new combat abilities.. Something fun like Moose Woodie, and I ended up disappointed.

In fact if it was up to me.. I would have made the entire theme of her rework focus on “The Power of the Unicorn”

How do you Nerf Wigfrid so she’s not Op?? How about- Her Life Leeching and Sanity gain abilities can ONLY work while wearing her special Helm that absorbs the power of fallen foes?

Her Special Helm and Spear should be what is most important to Wigfrid OTHERWISE she wouldn’t even spawn in the game with them to start with right???

Wendy spawns with her most prized Possession- Abigails flower. Willow- Bernie
These items both have a major impact on playing those particular characters... that STAY Relevant throughout your entire time playing as them..

But Wigfrid?? Wigfrid can quickly get (insert better gear here) that takes the importance of her special helm and spear away.

And that’s what I was incredibly hopeful to have seen changed most with her rework.

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44 minutes ago, Ohan said:

that equals killing 20 things first then catching another 20 butterflies and losing dps mid fight to drop souls constantly and staying grouped up enough so everyone gets healed (for every boss fight). Meanwhile Heartrending needs 1 papyrus 1 pen 1 life giving amulet and u can use it forever and nothing about the fight changes u get hp as you attack. And everyone is also carrying at least 2 battle helmets, something wortox cannot provide. 

 

if u cant manage to stack more than 1 buff in a boss fight you're doing something wrong. Non-boss fights dont call for buffs because with Wigfrids innate damage boost they'll be over before u can make any use of the sustained buffs. 

and anyways she gets 1 buff with just 1 spider nest, idk what are they doing

45 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Well.. my harsh criticism aside for the current state of Wigfrids rework- I really only wanted her to get something new.. unique and fun, the songs are okay.. BUT should have released ALONGSIDE some new perks for Wigfrid- even if perks were “just for fun” and not actually meant to be about those super nerdy Stats people keep talking about. 
 

Plain and Simple: I Do NOT play ANY video game to sit around comparing stats of weapons and armors (sorry never liked RPG’s and I Never Will..) 

You guys are trying to turn an open world sandbox survival game into a game all about numbers and hard stats- and that’s when it’s going to fall flat on its face.

Just look at how many SKINS Spears have compared to literally every other (Insert Superior Weapon here) weapon- Which is really why I wish they would buff Spears to not be as ineffective as they actually are.. but that’s a topic for another thread.

My point is- Most of Wigfrids rework is all about hard numbers and stats through her song scrolls, where as .... Woodies Moose from to wreck spiders in a brand new way may have had (behind the scenes) stats involved- But no one actually saw those stats in such a bluntly obvious way.. what they saw was a cool new Form with Brand new Abilities to smash spiders with.
I didn’t expect Wigfrid to become anymore OP then she already was, but I TOTALLY expected her to get some new combat abilities.. Something fun like Moose Woodie, and I ended up disappointed.

In fact if it was up to me.. I would have made the entire theme of her rework focus on “The Power of the Unicorn”

How do you Nerf Wigfrid so she’s not Op?? How about- Her Life Leeching and Sanity gain abilities can ONLY work while wearing her special Helm that absorbs the power of fallen foes?

Her Special Helm and Spear should be what is most important to Wigfrid OTHERWISE she wouldn’t even spawn in the game with them to start with right???

Wendy spawns with her most prized Possession- Abigails flower. Willow- Bernie
These items both have a major impact on playing those particular characters... that STAY Relevant throughout your entire time playing as them..

But Wigfrid?? Wigfrid can quickly get (insert better gear here) that takes the importance of her special helm and spear away.

And that’s what I was incredibly hopeful to have seen changed most with her rework.

how we can know if something is worth the trouble if we dont analyze the stats??? this isnt something new. DS has always a rpg component but instead of levels and skills you improve your tools

 

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