Transformers are broken

[Hudossay2]

As far as i can see, transformers works like batteries, but:

1. charge and discharge oultets are separated
2. there is a limit on how fast charge builds up

But there is no limit on how fast the charge can be used up. This is a problem because wires burn.
If there is a charge, transformer can support any wattage for the short time while charge still lives.
While this happens, any wire can be too thin, given enough power demand.

What happens is exactly what transformers are ment to protect from.

 

Another glitch is beyond my understanding. 2360 watts between two small transformers.
You can recreate this situation by turning on load like on the screenshot. High wattage is present while the charge lives. Enough to burn the wire.

I suggest limiting both inputs and outputs wattage of transformers to match their description.

[lapantouflema]

your contraption makes no sense to me, what's the point of having two lines of two tranformers ?
also, ONI is not real life, there is no "electron flow" in this game, either your circuit is overloading or not, if it is, any wire segment may take damage, even if not connected to anything.

transformers just "separate" two circuits, they are not actual transformers. 

[SharraShimada]

It makes sense in this case. 2 small transformers = 2kw, one large transformer =4kw. The problem: conductive wire is limited to 2kw. So you build a large transformer, which uses refined metal, and "waste" 50% of its capacity, or you build 2 small ones, with raw ore, and have exact the amount of the outgoing wire.

[metallichydra]

why do you need to have 4 transformers, why not just connect: heavy wire --> transformer --> conductive wire

 

[Nightinggale]

I'm with OP on this one. The issue isn't if it makes sense to make the setup in question because it doesn't. It's a setup, which displays the issue very well. The problem is that the transformer doesn't output power like the player would assume it to do (meaning shouldn't this be a bug report?).

We have a wire, which can handle 1000 W. There is one consumer, which can consume 1000 W and one "generator", which can deliver 1000 W. All that is according to the game text and since they are all 1000 W, they should match. Somehow he get 2360 W in the wire, which causes damage to the wire.

The question is why is the transformer delivering 2360 W when it states it can't deliver more than 1000 W? That would be like "why can my single coal generator power an aquatuner running under full load" (I don't think it can) because the core of the question is why is there more power in the wire than the generator(transformer) can deliver?

[TheGCat]

I think, it is the mechanic how the transformers work.

In this game, only the consumers counts. If you have more than for example 1000 Watt consumers behind a small transformer, the normal wire breaks. Why it breaks ? Because each transformer type have a little energy charge and can provide more than 1000Watt for a little time. In the short time, the wire breaks. Normally it should not be possible to draw more energy as 1000Watt, because you already use a transformer.  More consumers than 1000Watts should only cause a Brown-Out and not a wire break.

It should only be possible if you connect all the consumers without to use a transformer. Or you use a big transformer with a normal wire.

It 's just my point of view, but maybe I miss something.

[Nightinggale]

I decided to test this ingame and oddly enough I can't recreate the problem. I can remember I encountered it earlier, but now it seems to work as I would prefer it to work.

I set up 2 coal generators, which then charged some batteries (easy test setup). I added a transformer, which then powered 8 liquid pumps through a standard 1kW wire. 4 of the pumps were out of power, 4 pumps working (using 960W) and the batteries were charging. No overload. Placing 2 transformers in a row didn't seem to change anything, but putting two transformers in parallel meant all pumps started, but then the wire started to overload.

Next I tried a new setup. Still coal generators+batteries to feed one transformer. However this time the tranformer powered batteries. They charged with 1 kW. I added 960 W of load and the batteries then charged a lot slower, most likely 40 W. The coal generators still reported a constant 1 kW flow to the transformer.

This leaves the question: what did OP do to overload the wire?

[lapantouflema]

if i may add something, the way i understand how transformers should be used in this game is like you have one machine room full of generators all linked to one same grid that generates like 2500watts, but you cant have heavy watt wires all around your bases, so you plug one tranformer on it that will power let's say your research lab grid, but making sure your lab area doesn't exceed 1000w for the regular wire is your job, the transformer just allows to not size it to 2500w.

or at least that's how i understand it, i literraly never had any problem with this device.

[Hudossay2]

I'm sorry for not answering questions for so long.
Here are my answers:

1. What is the point of such a setup in the first place?
    Well, the "exact" same setup as on the screenshot probably doesn't make sense. But similar does.
Imagine having sun panels up in the space and oil related power setup down in the oil biome generating power at the same time. There could be some power from natural gas vent in the middle of the map too. Is it a good case for "connect all power sources using a thick wire along with batteries"? I don't think so. You would have to cross the entire map with the thick wire.
    The better option is to split the power generated into chunks of 2 kW and send it out to batteries using conductive wire. One wire per 2 kW. The description of transformers states that you could do so. In such a setup you have [generators -> high power -> transformers -> 2kW -> transformers -> high power -> batteries]

2. How to reproduce the wire burning?
    Nightinggale did it almost right. You have power supply (> 1kW), transformer (1 kW), thin wire(1 kW max) and some load (> 1kW). Missing part is time for transformer to build up charge. It works fine until power demand drops below transformer capacity. But when it does, charge build up and burn wires on the next "turning on" of a load. Then transformer outputs more than it should (for less than a second, which is enough), then charge is wasted and everything OK again.
    The problem is that in real game outside debug mode, machines constantly turn on and off, so the problem repeats over and over.

Also, I would like to mention that you would face this problem even without tricky transformers setup. Lets imagine you have a simple, "classical" power setup. Some good amount of generators and batteries all connected together with a thick wire. Then you have a small transformer 1 kW and thin wire connecting some power demand. And, believe it or not, as soon as the load exceeds 1 kW, the thin wire takes damage.

1. Why?
    Because transformer satisfies the demand for power (which is > 1kW) as long as its charge lives. That means, the load inside the wire is > 1kW, so it burns.

2. Okay, just stop connecting too high load for a small transformer, isn't this a solution?
    Is isn't, because there are so much machines which does not work most of the time. Separating your power setup in such a way, that the potential power demand never exceeds wire wattage is a huge, ridiculous waste of resources. Why should i have separate conductive wires for two 1.2 kW machines, which practically never turned on at the same time? It would be so nice, if dupes just could not turn second one on, due to lack of power.
    Otherwise, why do we even need transformers in the first place? If i have to carefully count the load each time, and have no right to exceed wire capacity even with potential load, there is no point in transformers at all. Lets just split outlets of the batteries into two, one for power source, one for power demand. If you have to keep an eye on the total load on each branch, there would be no defference anyway.

3. What is my siggestion?
    Rework transformers. Now they act like batteries with separate outlets for charge and load.
    Make them work just like steam turbine, so it's power generation would differ depending on circumstances. Take into account power demand and power supply. The least of them is the amount of power generated and consumed by the transformer.

[badgamer123]

 i actually having some issue similar to this one(been stop playing for weeks waiting updated)
my old base got a few long and far away place need 1kw-2kw power that only turn on 20% of a day...
the power grid end up like this:
ST:Small transformer  LT: Large transformer   ,SB:smart battery switch ,C:consumer
Heavy wire>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
                     >                           >                  >
                   STX2                    LT                 SB

                     I  ST+C               I                     I
                    SB                       C                   C+ST(within 2kw)
                     I

                   ST+C
                     I(receive left -over power from other ST,from the first SB line/LT)
                     SB-----STx2-----C
some consumer line will go above 3kw draw,but I always limited it with 1 small transformer output with no battery inside the loop to prevent overload.

Anyway I checked every line connected with maximum only 2 ST output  and 2 ST input....(the smart battery switch was very carefully checked/disable)
my 2kw wire will often end up overload.
After  sometime I end up throw away most of the ST to ST stuff,end up using a ton of smart battery switch..every cable line be come
very boring like this: Heavy wire>LT>SB>STx2>SB>ST>SB>ST>SB>ST......i end up with a very dumb design that I was not happy with.