How do I use melee weapons without getting wrecked?

[Thieverpedia]

So I recently got back into Rotwood after a few months. I used to use spears, but after a standard run, I swapped to the bow I noticed on the rack. Entirely too much fun to use. I breezed through a tier 3 frenzy and defeated the Mother Treek with no problem. After a while, I tried that same tier of frenzy with my old spear...I was getting DESTROYED. Even the little bulbins wouldn't flinch at all from my constant melee strikes, so they'd end up ramming into me nonstop. I don't understand how I'm expected to get a combo off when things are ripping off large chunks of my health while comboing me in return. If anything, it feels like ranged combat is superior to melee just due to survivability. Even with my bulky level 5 armor that was supposed to reduce damage by quite a bit, I was still getting destroyed. Actually, in general, it also feels like heavy builds are basically unusable as well. Tanking doesn't work at all properly when dodging a hit results in zero damage, as healing is scarce without the right builds or luck.

I dunno, is there something I'm missing? Currently on Florocrane Armor with Frostbite, and it's going loads better.

[Pumking7]

I apologize this is a bit late, but I find melee weapons very fun and very fair to use in Rotwood. I do agree where melee weapons lack in survivability they gain in crowd control and high burst damage. I am going to write down a few tips/general rules I follow when using melees weapons (spear and hammer) and explain how I make the best of them.

Abuse Hitstun Mechanics

Spear and Hammer both have focus hit conditions which require their attacks to hit multiple targets, for hammer this is every attack and for spear this is the "spinning drill" move (light attack while dodging). These attacks both deal high amounts of hitstun, which stuns the enemy in place while slightly knocking them back. This allows you to get a lot of high damage focus attacks off on the enemy without giving them the chance to counterattack. This helps mow down groups of enemies without having to worry about them all ganging up on you. This is unlike the bow whose light attack trades hitstun for distance, and heavy attack takes too long to consistently use hitstun moves against enemies. 

This all comes into practice by positioning your enemies for maximum control and damage, so herding your enemies by rounding them up with high or using skills like "groddy groak gulp" gives a chance to attack them all at once with a spinning drill or a jumping somersault hammer move. Its sometimes best to stick to something very simple and just spam heavy attack on hammer repeatedly to control large groups of enemies.

Don't overcommit to attacks

When attacking with melee weapons the most important defensive tip to not is that its better to know when to hit and dodge rather than try to get in as many attacks as possible and get hit. When fighting on very high difficulties like the super-frenzies, my main goal in a lot of levels is to find openings to get a single meaningful hit in then continue dodging to find my next opening. Its also important to note that spear and hammer do provide a lot of forgiveness for overcommitting to an attack as almost all their moves can be easily dodged out of to prevent potential damage. One of the best moves to do on spear is heavy attack and immediately dodge after while chaining into another heavy attack, which provides both the dodge if needing to escape but also allowing your attack to be followed up by another heavy attack.

Its also important to recognize enemy patterns as some enemies like bulbins have a higher attack sight range, and can charge their roll attack at a much larger distance from the player. Whereas an enemy like beets has to directly stand on top of the player if it hopes to do any damage. Recognizing these differences is what helps know how to position yourself best for each enemy and where the openings for different attacks are.

Burst enemies down

Hammer and Spear both have attacks which can wipe out considerable portions of enemies health within a single attack. This is the hammers main gimmick (slow hits, but higher dmg per hit) with moves like golf swing, spinning lariat, jumping somersault and even basic heavy's allowing for an enemies to be instantly decimated. With hammer its all about maintaining distance and understanding enemies patterns to deal fatal blows. With spear its a bit different as spear focuses on safer high single target burst damage. Moves like heavy stab flurry and basic heavy attacks help single targets get wiped out after one or two attacks, with spinning drill acting as a burst when enemies get too concentrated for the spear. I found it useful to just get used to hitting enemies with the tip of the spear and getting a feel for it, for not only does it provide more distance but also gives focus damage that can be further incorporated into heavy focus strikes or light attack volleys.

Pick your tools accordingly

When playing with melee weapons picking the right weapon can provide a better experience and an easier time getting used to said weapon. You mentioned "Even the little bulbins wouldn't flinch at all from my constant melee strikes", so I would definitely recommend playing with the hammer "Bug buster". This hammer allows you to knock down many enemies by charging up a light attack while dodging. If you want to keep distance between you and your enemies using a spear like "Long arm of the claw" can provide that extra distance you miss in the bow to make a difference. There's a wide selection of weapons to choose from and each one is worth considering for what you need most in your next hunt. Its also worth considering the different miniboss skills too in picking your weapon. As mentioned already Groak weapons are great as melee to gather enemies together either for control or burst. Yammo skills can be used to defend yourself if you get swarmed, Collosapphire skills are useful for controlling/bursting enemies which are harder to fight in melee combat, Bonejaw can be used to chip/solo enemies out etc. The amount of miniboss/boss weapons allows you to throw the skill into your weapons playstyle. (I would probably just not recommend Floracrane skills, as spear and hammer already have great aoe burst options that Floracrane can't really compete with all that much).

As for armor I usually prioritize light or average weight class builds to allow for easy dodging in melee range (I find heavy builds hard to use and control as melee). If you are taking a lot of damage while attacking it might be effective to wear armor like Bullrog, Yammo, or Funguile pants, along with Ribbat chest armor. These armors allow you to resist and heal back damage while fighting. If you are getting hit a lot and want to retaliate you could also rely on Meowl set of armor which provides an opportunity to pounce upon your enemies with high crit chance and damage. If you find yourself too slow when navigating around enemies to find an opening I always find artic stunk pants an excellent pick for this. Also if you want to have armor to compliments your continued practice on dodging your enemies, Artic stunk hat and eye-v or gustree chest armor are great option for this.

I hope this helped you out in some way, and I hope using melees weapons becomes less frustrating and more fun for your future hunts.

 

[cybers2001]

Valid points. I don’t have a lot of experience with hammer/spear, but I follow similar strats with my striker treek build. With my build I aim to dps with the treek skill, but lean into my weapon as a means to hit stun or interrupt. Confidence is key here. For example, against a spinning bulbin, I could bait its spin, dodge vertically, then reposition horizontally to attack. But, if I just throw a heavy strike with my ball, I can chain immediately into treek spam knowing that the ball will interrupt the bulbin’s spin.  
  
Striker is an interesting role that can be played range, but I think being able to weave in and out of close range is key to rack up high hit streaks.